Edge Explores The Genesis Of The PlayStation

@aw3str1k3r: we saw the same thing with the PSP. I remember the commercials to the tune of Take Me Out that showed all these fantastic things the PSP can do, while playing videogames was tacked on at the end. we all see how that panned out, as the PSP continues to flounder to stay above water, blaming piracy rates or whatever the scapegoat of the moment is, instead of courting developers to make games for their handheld. UMD movies/tv episodes have fallen completely to the wayside, which comes as little surprise from a format that cost as much as DVDs with fewer options/uses. the PSP sees a handful of releases as time moves forward, fewer and fewer which are worth wasting looking at the case, let alone putting it into your PSP.

hats off to you Sony; you took your place on top and raced to the bottom in favor of multimedia functionality.

fillerbunny9

@an skyline:
I don't like it. What's wrong with me then?

@B1S1:
PSX is not acceptable. I am the law.

@shouryuuken:
I remember playing Quake II on the PS1. It was fun, but it certainly looked like grainy dogshit compared to the PC original (Duke 3D looked pretty decent, however.. But that PS1-exclusive episode was hard as balls, since there were no cheats for the PS1 version of Duke 3D).

Goldeneye was probably great fun if you enjoyed multiplayer gaming, but I've never really cared much for that, I prefer singleplayer gaming, as I need a story to drive me forwards through the game, and multiplayer gaming doesn't offer that :| I played Resi 1 and 2 on the PS1, and I actually found them to be vastly inferior to Silent Hill (and I still do.. Resi 4 was the first game in the series that I actually enjoyed).

@Alex_Mexico: There's something wrong with you if you do not like Banjo-Kazooie (not Kazzoie).

an skyline

@SG79: Yeah, okay.

an skyline

@FuriousMantis:
of course not!

it was an easy win for the dreamcast.

sorry. Still is an easy win for that little piece of god.

@Leanid: Okay, i guess i'm supposed to believe you just because you stated that, besides it's besides the point. My point is you act like Nintendo can do no wrong. Dude, i loved Nintendo at a point too. No i didn't jump ship like you think all former Nintendo fans did, i just grew up and was left in the cold by Nintendo. I wasn't being catered to anymore by them. I don't feel like i'm obliged to buy from any company. I won't buy a game from Nintendo, Sony or Microsoft that i have absolutely no interest in just because of who they are.

And when we look at people like me and you who actually consider gaming as a hobby,who actually seek gaming websites to discuss on,(hence the term "real gamers") the majority do not consider Nintendo as a serious contender this gen. Yes, the sales are through the roof, but who's actually buying it? Why is a greatly hyped game like MadWorld not selling crazy on it with the HUGE install base it has?

@tok1879: If you're going to draw conclusions about me from my past posts at least READ ALL OF MY POSTS. I've stated before that my platform of choice is PC. And great arguments there: Wii sucks because its shit, REAL GAMERS (whatever the fuck that means) prefer the HD consoles, people who buy the Wii are stupid. Great job addressing my points.

The thing is, I still remember when PC gamers were saying NEARLY THE EXACT SAME THINGS about consoles, console games, and console gamers that anti-Nintendo crusaders are saying now. People should take a step back for a moment and see how silly some of the things being said are. PC gamers were called elitists for it, but HD console gamers are REAL GAMERS now? Give me a fucking break. This is history repeating itself.

Leanid

@AkumaX: OR you could just get it for your own and tell the people that want it to help pay for their own. But then again, I wouldn't pay for a full complement of controllers out of my own pocket just for other people to use.

Leanid

@FuriousMantis: man i remember seeing a small half page article on that game in egm back in summer 96. i didnt even have a saturn yet.. but i went and bought it because it looked and sounded so wonderful. 59.99 i believe, and i rented the saturn like 5 times that summer. amazing game... still one of my favorites to this day.

@Combichristoffersen: yeah.. see i dont like super serious racing games like gran turismo, not big on rpgs (yeah.. final fantasy VII is legendary i know.. but it wasnt enough to make me enjoy the ps1 more than everything else), i thought nightmare creatures was pretty bad.. and tekken (at least until 3) was a definite rip off of virtua fighter. even though soul blade was okay, i still never liked 3d fighters nearly as much as 2d. i also never thought silent hill was all that good.. lots of games like that bore me.. i thought resident evil was much better.

as for goldeneye.. sure it may not have been as hot as whatever fpses were on pcs.. but it definitely trumped anything on a console. not only did they control bad on ps1 or saturn.. they looked horrendous.

@Kiri Komori: Yeah the ads truely were something with PS1 and PS2, with the PS3 it's just a strange capitalist something.

Its interresting to see that Europe wasn't considered there biggest market (Back then, it really wasn't). Nowadays, Europe IS the biggest market for Sony, but they still keep focusing on the US.

DoggySpew

@Chadders: Smart on MS' part, but it makes me loathe them. Poor Dreamcast, never got to be a contender :(

@Leanid: Ditto
@shouryuuken Guardian Heroes!!! I returned my PS1 and got a Saturn and a top loading NES and could not have been happier. Guardian Heroes was the first game I purchased, for a measly $16, and was literally stupified at it's awesomeness. Speaking of which... *dusts off Saturn*

Enos lives!

@Bergerac: 'Nintendo, MS and Sony may be 1st, 2nd, and 3rd, repsectively... but in terms of customer service, offering a product and dedication to bettering the industry, those placements are downright backwards.'
I wouldn't extend it that far. Sony is clearly just as willing to turn it's back on fans as the others with europe constantly getting a good kicking from Sony, the backwards compatibility being stripped away despite fans loving it, pushing blue ray rather than games and generally just ignoring fans love of 3rd party games (look how upset people got when FF13, devil may cry 4 etc. went on PS3). And there's nothing wrong with companeis paying to get exclusitivity. Sony did it last gen and on PS1 but PS fanboys tend to ignore that. If MS does a business deal to work with another company to make a game then that's a smart decision and a co-operatiive effort to get good games on there console not a crime. I don't get why PS3 fanboys use that argument (not saying your a PS3 fanboy but that's definitely sony logic).
Sony has been pretty good with it's fans but Nintendo and MS have been equally good (with MS being the best in my opinion by expanding it's japanese games portfolio and continuing to expand it's great online service which is what most people get the 360 for).

xxXX_Insanities_Birth_XXxx

I wonder if Nintendo still regret that whole deal, I mean, they could of been riding on the PS1 wave and eventually just became one, then again, it could of been the bad deal that sent Sony to try and make it even more better to go on their own.

@n00b_pwner: Just like how the PSP couldn't run PS1 games at more than like 5fps and kept having constant crashes, ...and then Sony released an official version and bam, pretty smooth gaming. You can't really judge unofficial programs as a basis.

@Nik Bartlett:

Actually so far Wii has sold more WW this year than it did in 2008 in the same time frame, in addition Sports resort isn't even out yet, and Wii has yet to revieve a price cut, or an alternate color, Wii is far, far away from peaking

come back in about two-three years, then we can talk

Avinash_Tyagi

@Combichristoffersen: Oh am I referring to the PS1? Dude, no shit. PSX is acceptable, that's pretty much what I've always used.

@Kiri Komori:Sega is still awesome.

sereal

I'll still support Sony. PS3 is the best turn around any gaming platform has ever made and many features were added to improve. I had it at launch and some people's memory may be short. I remember when there was no background downloading, there was no themes, the no vibration SIXAXIS was the only controller, PS Store was primarily browser based and poorly designed, and more.

With all that said, the games have gotten better. We now have awesome games like Ratchet and Clank Future: ToD, Uncharted, Killzone, Pixel Junk Eden, Flow, Flower, Metal Gear Solid 4, and titles multiplatform titles like GTA IV, etc.

@aw3str1k3r: I thought the following quote from the referenced article was fairly relevant to this discussion:

"Kutagari's constant insistence that PlayStation was a gaming machine, not some multimedia device, focused a sprawling organisation into unity.

Today, PlayStation 3 is the result of anything but focus, and Nintendo has regained the position as the leading console maker that Sony took from it."

I was reading that article a couple of weeks ago when the issue came out, and it was one of the most insightful features I've ever read in a magazine, EDGE never cease to amaze me, with each new issue topping the last.

-We are wasting time and missing opportunities while expecting too much from Nintendo and dealing with them in blind good faith-

am I the one who finds that quote atemporal?

@dgd1542: Until the casual gaming market falls apart... oh wait, that's already happening

Nik Bartlett

@shouryuuken:
I never actually played a Saturn (I'm not even sure if they were officially available here in Norway), but I'm completely opposite of you; the N64 and its games never impressed me much (never liked Zelda, stopped caring about Mario after SMB3 and I never thought of Goldeneye as being better than mediocre.. Wave Race 64 was gold, though), while I had my gaming fun on the PS1 (Gran Turismo, FF VII and IX, Crash Bandicoot 1-3, Nightmare Creatures, SoulBlade, Tekken 3 and Silent Hill were made of finest win back then).

@aw3str1k3r: it appears they could turn teh corner this year, when u consider the psn and ps3 games stacked for pre and post E3.

but u make a great point.

their early business model for PS3 was their downfall. (thanks to Ken Kutaragi and his Supercomputer babble).
09 is looking pretty stacked, when u consider the unannounced games for the system.

can it be like it was in its heyday, the undisputed heavyweight champion? only time will tell. but even the greats got knocked down. this was sony's first ko in the gaming industry. im sure they are hard at the gym for 09 to fight their way back for the title. you now you can never count them out.

@deanbmmv: BC is important to people, me included(which is why i have a 60gb model). I don't know why it's so difficult for some people to understand that some people would rather have one multi-functional hardware than multiple hardwares that perform these same functions.

@Combichristoffersen: all opinion my friend, all opinion. most of the games that people throw out there for psx that were big deals i didnt really care about. final fantasy, metal gear solid, gran turismo, tekken... and so on and so forth... meh.

for me, it was all about goldeneye, die hard arcade, nights, mario 64, f-zero x, killer instinct gold, starfox 64, guardian heroes, mischief makers, virtua fighter, virtua cop, daytona usa, the thq wrestling games, shining force III, ocarina of time, panzer dragoon series, clockwork knight, astal, legend of oasis, sega rally, perfect dark, bomberman 64, legend of the mystical ninja, wave race 64, and since i have a jp saturn (or played some of these back then too)... all the cool capcom fighters that were broken on playstation were great on saturn like x-men/marvel super heroes vs street fighter, the real bout fatal fury games..

i could go on for days.. and probably not list more than 20 games i liked on ps1. i was a big fan of beat em ups, platform games, and fighting games (still am) and the ps1 just wasnt the place to go for that kind of stuff for me. like i said, the lack of colors and blocky graphics killed stuff like spyro for me.. and the capcom fighting games suffered on ps1, fpses sucked on all consoles back then cept for goldeneye and perfect dark. multi tap? nah i got 4 ports on my 64.. i mean.. those 2 systems were my combo then.. and i still would play them way before the ps1.

@Leanid: LOL! All these from someone who thinks the Wii is God's own gift to humans. Sorry buddy, the Wii might be even more mass consumed than the PS3, but that doesn't save it from being a shitty ass example for a game console in the year 2009. Face it, out of the people who actually consider gaming to be a hobby, most of them prefer either the 360, the PS3 or both. The only reason the Wii is selling as much as it is is because of people who have absolutely no clue about gaming and what a quality game or games console is.

@Leanid: $200 peripheral cost for Nintendo isn't an exaggeration, it's an understatement. Wiimote $40, Nunchuk $20, Wiimotion Plus $20, total for one full motion controller $80, now get 3 of those so you can have 4 players and you're at $260, including the extra $20 for the Wiimotion plus for the Wiimote that came with the system. That takes the total of the system with 3 extra controllers to $510. Considering you can get the more powerful 360 elite with 3 extra controllers for $10 more or a PS3 with 3 controllers for $40 more and the Wii is not such a bargain.

I like my Wii and want the functionality of Wiimotion Plus but I don't know if I'm willing to pay another $80 to get it for all my Wiimotes.

AkumaX

@excel_excel: yeah, except PS1 was offering something "gamers" actually liked.

@behemoth79: Well, if you have a read of the 'Rise and Fall of Sega' article on IGN, Microsoft and Sega did have a development partnership agreement... but this was largely a Trojan Horse for MS to learn the specifics of console manufacture.

They then cheesed it and built the Xbox, Sega the Dreamcast and well, you saw how it turned out.

Chadders

@GummyTumor: I loved my N64. If I didn't have an N64 I would have missed out on the greatest games ever. Now I love my PS3 just as much.

Cue2

All of this visiting of the past and it seems noone remembers DRE, which drove UP the price of first gen US PSX units (Due to the fact that they could play imports unmodded thanks to the disc swap trick) and how it returned to terrorize us all on the PS2.

@an skyline:

Funny that carpel tunnel has nothing to do with awkward designs and more with repetitive motion. Obviously many disagree with your view since it's generally known that the PS controllers are considered the best.

This read made me feel like a dinosaur as it seems it was only yesterday. Anyway, the system remains my favorite of all time for very good reasons.

Hence why I own more PS1 downloads on the PS3 than current gen games, despite owning some on disc already. Great times keep rolling.

@Combichristoffersen: So now we're comparing to two of the first game pads ever? This is 2009 for fucks sake.

GameCube and the new 360 controllers are modern, ergonomic designs. The PS controllers are a mess.

Kotakufan777

I was a self proclaimed Nintendo fanboy back then. I even swore once back in 1996 before the inminent Christmas presents when I was to get my N64 (I was 11) that were I to get a PSX I wouldnt even open it. You have no idea how serious I was. I hated Sega and I loathed even more the PSX. For me there was no questioning what was to play videogames: Nintendo.

As the years passed the loyalty became envy. I was still loathing the PSX but now, for the first time ever, with envy. Seeing a FMV in FF7, the great mature story in Parasite Eve and epic games that spanned *gasp* 3 CDs was too much. Especially when I was to go back home and play Banjo Kazzoie and Diddy Kong Racing.

Finally, after years of mental and moral struggle and fighting with my PC when trying to play FF7 on it (oh yeah, I bought FF7 for the PC, I was not to become an infidel and buy a PSX for that!... I later did rebuyed the game for PS1) the impending release of FF8 broke me. On one hand I had the "big" holiday release of *shudder* Donkey Kong 64 on N64 and on the other I had *drool* FF8 on PS1. I couldn't take it anymore. December 25, 1999 was the day I turned my back on my Nintendo loyalty.

It was a long and hard process but Sony had won me over little by little. Game after game on the PS1 that targeted an older audience (I was 14, I was a big kid now!) like Dino Crisis and Metal Gear Solid (damn, I was playing a hollywood movie and with voices!!!) and countless RPGs won me over. Never stopped buying Nintendo games and products and was still a fan. *WAS* a fan, until 2008 rolled in and realized the Wii had nothing for me anymore and since then have never been closer to a PS console before like Im right now with my PS3.

All hail the PS1. They won fair and square the battle. And deservedly so.

@SolidOni: Umm, so they were unhappy that Nintendo weren't willing to give up their royalties? Despite the fact that that's the entire fucking business model of console makers and the only reason the loss-leading Playstation could ever be made? Ohhh, poor Sony, I do feel sorry.

Kotakufan777

@Kougeru Matsuoka:
RTFA, the PS1 had about 40 prototype controller design's. Most looked lie the NeoCon(was that it's name) crossed with SNES or PS1 controller's. One even nearly looked Nunchuck-ish.
This is the article's shot, but in the mag It's about half a page so you can make em out.
[www.edge-online.com]

@Leanid:
I still don't get people's issues with PS2 BC. It knocked a fair chunk off the price of the console, and the 360 or Wii don't play my PS2 games either. Sure they both have BC, but for games I don't own.
I'm not a moron so I kept my still working PS2 to play PS2 games on. and if it break's they are still sold new in stores. unlike GC n Xbox.

Also the 10 year life span isn't they'll keep the PS3 out for 10 years, then make a new console, they'll get to 6 years in (or so history tell's us) then release PS4, with 4 years to wean off the PS3. Much like the PS2, which at 9 years old has about 10 month's or so left. Though much like XP I have a feeling it'll be around much longer than expected. However History tell's us MS will release the 720(or whatever) and drop the 360 as if it never happened. Which is a bit of a bummer with buying the 360, because as soon as it's replacement's arrive do we know that the 360 will still get new games, Live, support, etc?

@aw3str1k3r:
One of the reason's we bought a PS2 was because it played DVD's, much like one of the reason's we bought a PS3.
There marketing it as a "Entertainment Centre" so games, movies, music internet etc. Which the 360 is as well, pushing Netflix and it's video store. Actually I haven't seen many advert's pushing the PS3 as a Blu-Ray player, I've seen ad's showing off Killzone 2 recently, the original ad's pushed Heavenly Sword. The only PS3 as a Blu-Ray player ad's Ive seen are the stickers on Blu-Ray cases with "Playable on PLAYSTATION 3 and blu-ray players".

And unless MS pull some random crap out their ass then their next console will have a Blu-Ray drive on it. Cos Digital Distribution would need everyone on a non-capped internet, and if they stick with DVD then studio's will drop like fly's, there's already rumbling's from Id n co on DVD's limited 8GB.

That was an interesting read.

TheOddOneDies

@n00b_pwner: i think i had that, wonder if i still have it in my piles of ps1 pirate copies from back in the day.

shame on me, shame :(

OMFGLOL

Ah those were the days, when the PS1 heralded a new era.

Bricked

@Combichristoffersen: first off, you're right, you guys never had a PSX (probably)

fixed link: [en.wikipedia.org])

Second, Combichrist kicks ass!

@Leanid: Can these comments get any longer >_<

drizzt_rocks

@n00b_pwner:

That doesn't mean anything. That could be the programmers fault. The fact that PS1 wasn't meant to run Sega hardware. Believe a good programmer could get a genesis or sms game to run on PS1.

@Zolbrod: We probably would have seen Microsoft and Sega pair up before the Dreamcast came out or shortly thereafter.

behemoth79

@dgd1542: For now. But all glory is fleeting...

jerimas

@undefined:

You mean back in the days where piracy wasn't sickening but a good way for boosting hardware sales against Nintendo.

Fabrice

Never liked the PS1 too much even though I did own one. Bought a Saturn when they did that 3-game bundle and liked it quite a bit, but by the time we were deeper into '97 I knew if I was going to be playing...well, anything new I'd have to pony up for a PS1, so I grabbed a used one near the end of that year. First and only time I ever bought a used system.

There were certainly some outstanding games released before that console was through, but I never felt much remorse about unplugging it once the Dreamcast rolled around. The PS1 seemed cold and heartless. The Sega consoles radiated love. At least that's what I concluded when I tried to stick my privates in the A/V slot.

KaneRobot

@an skyline:
I think the MS controllers are terrible, mainly due to the placement of the left analog stick.

And anyone who thinks the PS controllers are the poorest designed and most painful over time obviously never played the NES or the Master System.

@Valnen: And that's where you're wrong! The 360 has the best general controller layout right now.

I guess you enjoy carpal tunnel though.

an skyline

@B1S1:
I doubt any of you two owned a PSX, as it was only released in Japan. You're referring to the PS1.

[en.wikipedia.org])

@Helba: A couple of things:

- so how do you justify the extra cost to consumers? I know you said that it means nothing in the long-term, but it's still a major barrier for people accepting the console. If I'm reading you right, I think you're underestimating how important costs actually are to people that aren't enthusiasts. And looking at Sony's situation right now, it doesn't seem like there are enough enthusiasts to support them. A long-term goal with no short-term provisions... ehh...

- You seem to place great faith in Blu-Ray, and if you're in the industry you're certainly more qualified than I am to judge its merits in a technical environment. But is all of that actually being used (besides for the purposes of uncompressed CGI movies)? Does all that extra space equal to more content and an increase in the length of the game? Or does it simply mean we'll get the same game, only more shiny, and with no attempts at optimizing or compression? Is Blu-Ray really going to change the trend of games only lasting 8-10 hours, less if you're a great player (assuming that it is the default difficulty)? It seems like this trend is something that has nothing to do with technical limitations.

And of course, there's the standard "just because it has more raw power it doesn't mean it'll be FUN" statement. The key point is that this hasn't been the case yet.

- "making a console that will last longer than the standard 5-year lifespan and charging you just a little bit more."

"The advantage here is that because the console is designed to last longer, the 360 diehards will actually end up paying more for a console which will *still* not outlast the development potential for the PS3 by the time it's past it's peak as well."

You're simply speculating here, and without any evidence. How do you know the PS3 has greater development potential than MS' next console? Just because the PS3 is designed to have a 10-year lifecycle, it doesn't necessarily mean the tech is 10 years ahead of its time. And it's only natural that the 360 only has 1 year until a new console enters the scene, this is already its 4th year on the market. MS never claimed for their system to last a decade.

But I don't even see that as an issue; when the 360 peaks and the PS3 starts picking up steam THEN you get a PS3. In an ideal world the cost issue won't be as severe after 4-5 years on the market (although it looks like I'm setting myself up to be horribly wrong). The main issue here is that in this situation the PS3 early adopters are the ones suffering the most (more than the other consoles); it takes FIVE YEARS for developers to BEGIN to realize the PS3's potential?!

But it's OK though, because you can just Blu-Ray movies in the mean time, right? Or play PS2 games you mig- oh wait (ohoho).

- MS buying developer support is a problematic issue. I agree it doesn't seem fair, but its certainly not a negative for 360 owners. If anything it shows how dedicated they are in trying to make this whole console thing work. And this is at no cost to the consumers; MS is paying for it, not like how all PS3 owners are forced to pay for the Blu-Ray potential.

- "Sony may not be pumping out games like stinkwater from an outhouse, but that's actually a good thing." You must have loved Nintendo from the past 2 generations...

Are you implying that game developers/publishers on the PS3 DON'T try to gouge the customer in the form of DLC? This is a problem for both HD consoles, and the only reason its not as rampant on the Wii is because no one equates the Wii with online content, and storage issues.

Also, 'lol, tastes' and 'my opinion > your opinion'.

One of the themes you have going on here is that PS3 has the potential to become the best console, in time. In other words, when you buy a PS3 you're buying future potential? Buying a PS3 seems like a big gamble. You might be convinced that it has all the makings of a champ, but many others do not (as seen by the sales figures). Interesting opinion though.

And I hope you're not referencing to Nintendo with the $200 peripheral costs, even if it is an exaggeration.

Leanid

lol i have 3 of them under my computer right now....gosh it was the ps1 that got me into gaming in the first place

Hartia

@Valnen: ***Addendum:

I agree whole-heartedly about the BC issue. The problem is that people (including internal executives) kept screaming "It costs too much!" so they had to find a way to make it cheaper without losing profit, which means less components, which means less features.

@Valnen: I wasn't trying to. Other than the price (which is only a temporary barrier as people keep earning more money and will save for things they really want), it sells itself.

@SolidOni: Why? Sony's ridiculous demands for exorbitant royalties and rights for every game Nintendo sold on a disc drove Nintendo and would have driven anyone else away. Sony certainly came out on top, but that disagreement was entirely their fault, demanding things so far beyond a hardware supplier there's literally no logical base for them. It'd be like makers of fine canvas demanding rights to the painter's works just because it's on their cloth.

robbo_the_hood

@n00b_pwner: That music sounds like something you might hear in hell.

Valnen

@aw3str1k3r: The industry has also changed a lot since the first PlayStation. Consumers want, and usually expect, their electronics to do more than just one thing. Sony is marketing the PS3 as a multi media 'computer', and its hard for me to disagree with that stratagy.

@Helba: You really don't need to sell the PS3 to me. I know the pros of the console and actually own an 80 gig, and I'm even going to buy a used 60 gig soonish.

I think it was a mistake though for Sony to have backwards compatibility and then drop it. I realize it increased the cost of the console, but honestly I see it as a necessary feature (which is why I'll be replacing my new 80 gig model) that had to stay. Why? Because technology is evolving and hooking a PS2 to an HDTV simply does not work well. PS2 games will look much better if actually played in a PS3. People still play their PS2 games, even Sony knows this.

I'm glad it's still quite easy to find a 60 gig PS3 on the Internet. I'm buying one as soon as I get my tax refund...

Valnen

@Paul Soth: Hmm, well, what you said at the end is interesting. Personally, I don't know that the SNES really had a successor.

It seems to me like once the PSX came out, it sort of revolutionized the industry. Now I know that some will say, the industry has had a lot of major "revolutions" both before and after the PSX. But, to me, the PSX expanded gaming as a whole.

Games like MGS, FF, and Resident Evil added a new type of depth to video games. I think I was around then that people realized that games could be more than 'run to the right and jump on that guys head'.

I think what you said is more or less spot on about the two major markets going in separate paths after the SNES. But really it seems like Sony took that 'hardcore' market and nurtured it in to what it is today.

@aw3str1k3r: I'll agree that the PlayStation 3 is being heavily marketed as a "Blu-Ray Player" with less emphasis on the actual games.

But, let's be honest, Sony added extra features into the system in order to prevent the console from becoming primitive in a short period of time and to be able to market it as a "Multimedia Entertainment Device."

Also, with the higher price point the system has, Sony's more than likely trying to spin the marketing to justify the cost.

B33

@Kougeru Matsuoka: I disagree. I think the PS controllers are the best out there. Best ever, actually.

Valnen

God bless the PS1, so much <3, too much <3, i <3 <3 <3 the PS1!

pandafresh

@Hiroken: I didn't know the term "aliasing" back then (or if it even existed), but only an idiot wouldn't be able to see "jaggies."

@Leanid: Those were quite impressive. Often superior to the N64 in those moments. That's what made the aliasing during gameplay even more of a turn-off for me.

@Helba: And as to games:

Sony may not be pumping out games like stinkwater from an outhouse, but that's actually a good thing. Sony-produced games and games in general from their first and second party devs are amazing and that's where you find a lot of your gems.

Yes, the 360 has something like a 2.8:1 ration on games. So what?

If you walked into a food court and someone told you that they only had 5 things on the menu, but all of them were fantastic and left you full, and another restraint kept making money by charging you per-bite for unfilling food that tasted like cardboard comparatively, wouldn't you want to get less of the higher-quality food?

@GummyTumor: amen brother

pandafresh

@Valnen: As a member of the industry, I can tell you that Bergerac is right, and some of you others are right as well - what you don't realize is that both can be true.

I'm console agnostic. If a console has reliability and the features I want, along with the lifespan I want for a price I'm willing to pay, I have no problem with purchasing it. The main argument against the PS3 isn't its features, it's the cost. Well, bugger the cost. Think of this for a minute in terms outside of monetary value.

The fact is, average consoles have a few problems:

* the hardware is only state-of-the-art for so long, until everyone and their dog figures out how to use it it and not really get the most out of it, or until some tireless development team figures it all out and everyone else just builds on top of it and suddenly starts "supporting" the platform because it's easier and they didn't have to put in the work to make it better.

Think of it as this: Your big-name 360-only chest-beaters are John Hammond. You know, the guy who stole research from researchers and geneticists, got a quick patent and then started manufacturing the fruits of their labor on an island in costa rica in Jurassic park?

They could really care less what you think as a gamer. They care even less about you opinion on which console is better. They care *still* less about which is more powerful. All they care about is how much it costs to make a game vs how much they think they can make. I've been in on meetings that would make your stomach curl.

But the main point here is that the only reason the 360 took off compared to the ps3 is because M$ forced inclusion of the SDK for 360 into vista almost entirely; the end result is that pc devs suddenly could hire run of the mill programmers instead of the more specialized ones required for most consoles. The downside to this of course is that they started thumbing their nose at anything more complicated than that.

Now you notice that people are starting to produce multiplats that don't look horrible on the PS3 - the reason is that people are starting to figure it out (finally). But the main reason that you really want to support PS3 in all this is because they are actually pro-consumer. They have chosen, instead of making you pay for 200 bucks worth of peripherals and making their extras (like HDD) proprietary as M$ has, to instead making a console that will last longer than the standard 5-year lifespan and charging you just a little bit more.

The Blu-ray is actually also a boon - the storage space alone is worth the jump, because you can fit many, many, many times more data onto a blu-ray disc than you could possibly hope to package and sell in dvd form without stacking boxes 2 feet high.

Most of the objection to the PS3 is as people have said: price and game selection.

The reason that the 360 sells so well and people seem to want to cream their pants over it is because it is last-gen tech. it's reached its peak already. you can quote me - it's got maybe one good year left before it either starts to die off or M$ announces a new console, which will not surprise me.

The advantage here is that because the console is designed to last longer, the 360 diehards will actually end up paying more for a console which will *still* not outlast the development potential for the PS3 by the time it's past it's peak as well.

The game reason, well, that's either huge amounts of money thrown at companies my M$ (and YES, this DOES happen. They fly in freaking executives and technical support to developers they like enough at a moment's notice) or companies who aren't willing to invest in more highly skilled programmers to take advantage of the PS3 hardware. That's why you end up with crappy multiplat ports, because the ps3's power isn't utilized.

"and the evolution of the console's controllers"

wait..what? i didn't notice they changed at all except for the fairly useless and annoying "six axis" feature

ps controllers are still the most painful over time and poorest designed.

Kougeru Matsuoka

@cornerman8: It seems like everyone here is completely sidestepping what my point is, besides Leanid there (and that's a great bit you have there, sir). I'm not saying that the PS3 shouldn't have Blu-Ray, and I'm not disputing that the PS3 has worthwhile exclusive content. I'm expressing my distaste in the massive shift from Sony as to how they are representing a gaming system to the consumer as compared to the PS1/PS2 generations.

Back in the PS1/PS2 generations, Sony always pushed these great games to consumers as the primary incentive for purchasing their product. "Live in your world - Play in ours."

Now Sony isn't pushing the PS3 in the same fashion. We've seen it being pushed as a Blu Ray player that also plays games. That bottom line is what I feel contributes heavily to the PS3's slow start. Sony's PR was busy talking about the Cell and Blu Ray, and gave little mention to the games that were coming out (apart from Killzone 2, LittleBigPlanet, and MGS4).

@PatrickF**kingStar: No, I'd still be playing PC games. :D

But then again... a VAIO that plays Nintendo games...

Leanid

Takes me back to when I worked at Media Play during the start of the 32 Bit era.

I was talking about this on another form, but back in the days of the NES and SNES, Nintendo for the most part had two kinds of demographic: the Family market and the Hardcore market.

The Family market had your kid-frendly games, colorful characters, puzzle games, and titles that were easy to get into. The Hardcore market had your deep platformers, adventure games, RPGs, fighters, and so on.

When Sony broke up with Nintendo, the single smartest thing they did was bring over the Hardcore demographic to their side with the A-List developers. Konami, Capcom, Square, Namco... names that brought gamers to the PlayStation. In the entire history of the industry, it's hard to think of any move by anyone that was smarter then this.

Think about it: what system do you consider the proper successor to the SNES? The N64, or the PS1?

@aw3str1k3r: But what about those FMV and CGI cutscenes. My 10 year old self was blown away by them having only known of sprites from SNES and Gameboy.

Leanid

@cornerman8: I get the feeling Sony will learn from it's mistakes this generation and totally own the next one. They know what they're doing now.

Valnen

@excel_excel: Offers something different indeed...like looking like garbage on any modern TV.

Valnen

@Bergerac: I think the issue here is that shift from "a game console with multimedia tacked on" to "a Blu-Ray player with games tacked on". Sony pushing Blu-Ray has little to do with "providing high quality, state of the art multimedia systems", its about Sony establishing a format that is firmly under their control. Games had nothing to do with it, the customer has nothing to do with it.

I'm not going to condemn them for their actions, it makes perfect sense from a business standpoint to piggy back the Blu-Ray format onto the success of the Playstation brand. And let's not get into something as subjective as "bettering the industry"; I personally fail to see how increasingly powerful hardware is bettering the industry when all it does is put up barriers for developers. It's one of the issues with PC games development, but at least developers on the PC side can understand the architecture of the system more easily. And let's not forget how much consumers are paying to "better the industry". Consoles are meant for mass consumption; pricing it outside the range of non-enthusiasts runs counter to this philosophy.

The farther this generation develops, the more I'm starting to see the same issues faced by the PC games industry creep onto consoles.

I agree with aw3str1k3r. The PS3's main selling point is that it can play Blu-Ray movies, with games coming in second. I can't say what benefits Blu-Ray will bring, I'm not a videophile. I'm a gamer, and I judge the merits of a system based on what games are available. PS2 wasn't better than GC because it used DVDs, it was because PS2 had better games (in my opinion). So in all honesty I don't see how Blu-Ray is vastly superior to DVDs when I'm looking at PS3 and 360 games. (except for the length and quality of the cutscenes, harharhar)

Blu-Ray is another attempt by Sony at making their proprietary format an industry standard. Like Betamax, or something I've had personal experience with, MiniDiscs. Blu-Ray might turn out to be a great benefit to gamers, but I don't see any benefits in the games yet. It's disheartening to see them push the format and system as a great movie player, and not a great videogame console.

I had a PS1 and PS2 as my favourite console of their respective generations. I guess my disappointment is like those gamers that think Nintendo has abandoned them. I want to like the PS3, I really like its little brothers, but when the only game that interests me is Valkryia Chronicles... the system should be sold because of the games, NOT because I'm in the market for a Blu-Ray player.

Leanid

@Combichristoffersen: Mega Drive for us Euros!! And thats true it looked a lot more better

@aw3str1k3r:

Bergerac is right.

2 years in, and Sony is outputting more exclusive disc-based games than the competition on a yearly basis, and across more genres. It outputs more quality original digital download games as well. Its PSN service most of the high points of Live at zero cost. The games they publish and produce are largely more ambitious. It has a healthy ratio of new IP vs. established franchises.
It stumbled out of the gate when compared to the competition, no doubt about it. But the PS3 today, in my opinion, is the console to own going forward.

With or without Blu-ray, its still the haven for gamers. That fact is just largely ignored. Its common knowledge that they have more studios than the competition combined...how is it that folks in the know, don't understand that means more games for them. Does DLC for multiplatform games really outweigh access to more quality exclusive games? Are timed-exclusives that big of a selling point, when you can play an exclusive game til its not timed anymore? That's not a knock on MS, cause they have to do that. Gotta crawl before you can walk. But as gamers, how do we not get this?

Sure they stumbled out the gate. Ok, you don't like what their PR guy said. Fine, you don't need the bells and whistles, who can fault you? Alright, the 360 is outselling it. But the games are there, and they're going to keep coming in higher quantities than the competition. A PS3 owner is going to largely play what a 360 owner plays, except more. It'll be interesting to see how long gamers can ignore it.

cornerman8

@shouryuuken:
The N64 did 3D better and the Saturn did 2D better, but the PS1 had the majority of all the good games, so..

@B1S1: The PSX changed life

Fixed.

@excel_excel:
To be frank, it looked like shit compared to the sleek, sexy Mega Drive (or Genesis, if you like).

@B33: PS1 and the CD-Rom wasn't much of a risk per se, since you had add-on machines (Turbo-CD and Sega CD) and dedicated machines like the 3DO and the Phillips CDI all using the CD-ROM format.

What Sony did was price their machine low enough, and provide good games from the get-go, and more importantly they launched in the US at the beginning of Christmas gift-buying season. No jumping the gun like Sega did, and then being stuck with bad publicity from not having very many good games for several months.

Plus Sony took a page from Sega's playbook from their Genesis days, and upped the snark content (the first comp disc, which shipped with the PSX had a small reference within some dialog scrolling near the top that said "Saturn bytes", and of course the hilarious ad featuring Crash Bandicoot daring Mario to a rumble (outside of Nintendo of America's HQ, no less) and at an E3 where Sega was pranked with their Sonic inflatable being cut down...stuff like that helped take away the hardcore crown from Sega at the time, which Sega unfortunately never recovered from.

Don't take it as a Sega bash (I have virtually every Sega machine from the Genny and Master System add-on to the Dreamcast (still my overall favorite system), but unfortunately I can't ignore the evidence either.

@outlawauron: Really, you've played yakuza 3? How is it? Whats your fav part?

CriminoleLaw

@jacksons98: crap, you win, I forgot Valkyria was Sega

Kiri Komori

The PSX changed my life.

@chang187: Thats mean. Funny, but mean the same. Personally, I liked Chinese Democracy, but not enough to drop money on the Rock Band version right now. And the Wii is good for certain games.

Sthompson

@aw3str1k3r:

Because you TOTALLY KNEW what aliasing was back then--it was a common topic of discussion. I bet you were "aw3" struck by the mad anti-aliasing in the N64 and told ALL your friends.

*rolls eyes*

@aw3str1k3r: You do realize that Sony used PSX's ability to play Music CDs as a huge selling point back then, right?

And you do realize that most of the people that bought a PS2, bought it because they needed a DVD player, right?

Sony has always tried to say that their system is more than just a console, but a multimedia device, even back in the PSX era.

@Bergerac: Gamers have been jumping ship since N64 and PS1, Nintendo still makes games from their traditional franchises, compare to GC lineup in the same time frame, Nintendo has never been quick about their releases, gamers changed not Nintendo, etc.

TLDR; no, not really.

I've become a Nintendo fanboy this generation just from trying to correct these myths, misconceptions, or generally wrong statements. Nintendo doesn't even get me hard in comparison to a developer like Blizzard; almost all the games I REALLY liked are on PC.

Leanid

@SmilingPolitely: NKOTB > BSB and you know it...

Bergerac: Comment of the week. I've grown weary trying to explain this to most of the myopic 360 supporters. Although to their credit, MS is furthered the industry through online console gaming.

jawz10

@excel_excel: Yeha, he should get bonus gamer points.

Combine

I read this article last month and I have to say it was one of the most interesting I have come across in a long time. Well done to Edge.

Alsybub

@RockyRan: What?! Nearly everything they've since 2008 has been awesome. The only stinker since then was Golden Axe, but then Condemned 2, Valkyria Chronicles, House of the Dead, MadWorld, Yakuza 3, and Phantasy Star Portable.

That's not counting the awesome slate we have upcoming.

outlawauron

Sony made me forget all about the terrible taste that Nintendo left in my mouth with the N64. A lot of the good gaming related memories I have are with the original PS1. I still support Nintendo, but I'm glad Sony did what they did and carved their own niche in the gaming landscape.

Really great read. PS3 is the best Playstation yet, I'm loving mine.

jacksons98

@Kiri Komori:
SEGA is rocking... MadWorld rules and Valkyria Chronicles is one of the great games of this gen. But yeah they've destroyed Sonic.

jacksons98

That part where they showed the tech demo to developers where everyone was so surprised and like "Whoa I've never seen anything like this!" kinda surprised me. Did Sega not do anything similar with the Saturn? Both of the systems had similar capabilities afterall.

KHANV1CT

@B33: Did I say the N64 was perfect? No. But I do feel that it did a much better job at providing 3D graphics without MUCH aliasing. Whenever I played PS1 games, I always felt like it was trying to create 3D using pixels instead of polys from the sheer amount of aliasing.

@aw3str1k3r.

B33

@Bergerac: I didn't say I was against Sony including the Blu-Ray as the format the machine supports, but that I am firmly against Sony using that technology as it's primary selling point. I am furious that Sony focused more on pushing this aspect of a game machine than it did to push it's own exclusive games.

@aw3str1k3r: They included Blu Ray due to the impending HD market which had already started and which Sony had absolutely no control over.

The HD market is coming up around the PS3's general release window. Sony already know this through industry forecasts - home movies are going HD. The PS2 could play DVDs. The fact that the PS2 became the cheapest DVD player in Japan upon its release, is what saw it climb the market so sharply.

So, you think they're going to stick with DVDs in the PS3? Bear in mind that Sony pride themselves on providing high quality, state of the art multimedia systems in their Playstations, long before the 3rd iteration. You honestly think they're going to stick with DVD?

Sony aren't about 'putting games at the forefront': which is why they developed an internal talent relation between studios like Naughty Dog, Insomniac, Sucker Punch, Guerrila... whereas Nintendo and Microsoft, in comparison, dropped their market altogether, and released shoddy hardware and bought out third party games that were destined for Sony's platform to get some leverage, respectively speaking. Nintendo, MS and Sony may be 1st, 2nd, and 3rd, repsectively... but in terms of customer service, offering a product and dedication to bettering the industry, those placements are downright backwards.

I find your entire stance baffling. How can you actually be convinced of that?

Bergerac

@B33: But how did they advertise both the PS1 and PS2? They advertised with exclusive, new, and innovative games and just tacked the CD/DVD compatibility as a bulletpoint on the box. I don't deny that the media they were using were new and not as common at the consoles launch, but the consoles were in no way pushing the format.

Much of the PS3's advertising has very little to do with exclusive games and instead focused on the technology in the system. I'm sickened to see Sony making commercials where they're pushing movies as much as they are games. It shows that they care more about a proprietary format than they do the games featured on their system, a stark change from the Sony of the PS1/PS2 days.

Such as:

+ Watch video

And most other PS3 commercials feature at least one movie as a feature. one used Spiderman 3, another used Hancock, etc.

@aw3str1k3r: Because the N64 was completely devoid of aliasing, correct?

B33

I was enjoying my Famicom & Nintendo, then I saw the Final Fantasy 7 Opening......I GOTTA HAVE THAT GAME!! It was also my foray to VCD movies. Then all the great franchises I love also begin in that generation.

ahmeng

Genesis on the Playstation? The PS1 could barely play Master System games!

+ Watch video

@Mega-Driven: More like Phil Hairrisson MIRITE?

@aw3str1k3r: Isn't one of the reasons why both the PlayStation and PlayStation 2 were very successful was due to the fact that they took the risk with the CD-Rom format and DVD format?

The risk Sony took with Blu-Ray and the Cell Processor echoes past generations of the brand.

Granted, the PlayStation 3 isn't the leader of the pack, as of right now, primarily due to the console's higher pricepoint.

But, as far as a long term perspective goes, the PlayStation 3 carries quite a bit of potential.

B33

@ithyphallus: I don't know either. I guess it really depends on how old you are.

Gorilla Snow is Maximum Risky

Great Artcle!!! That beought back memories! Nice find Michael!

@D4RkNIKON: Sony wasn't pushing CDs to become a primary media format with the system though. Sony was already very successful in using CDs for music distribution, and was becoming a staple media regardless of the success of the Playstation.

The same goes for the PS2 and it's inclusion of a DVD player. DVDs were going to become a primary media without the PS2.

What Sony has done with the Playstation 3 has pushed this Blu-Ray format almost exclusively (how many BluRay players were being sold? not many, even now that prices have dropped to as low as 150.). Sony has done all this work with the PS3 to push Blu Ray into consumers hands, that they haven't been pushing as many games to go with the game system they're using to push the Blu Ray movie sales.

@Fadecy: Rival Schools for PSN/XBLA PLZ: Can you imagine having to chose between a monopoly Sony/Nintendo and a desperate Microsoft? Sounds terrible.

@SolidOni: It prince.

It prince?

IT PRINTS MONEY, BIATCH!

OOOOH SNAP!

@dgd1542: Yeah, and in doing so, they dropped all support of the market that made them.

Yay Nintendo?

Bergerac

@ReconToaster.: N64 had better graphics than the PS1. It was the disc space that really brought them over. When it comes to Nintendo, they always try to compete with disk capacity.

@dgd1542: If this were a trolling game on the PS3, you'd win a Gold trophy and a free Blu-Ray movie. Probably this one.

@aw3str1k3r: "they weren't pushing an entire format with it" Did you not read the post? Sony tried to provide a CD-ROM drive for the Super Nintendo. There's your format for you.

@Zolbrod: I thought SNES looked so futuristic back then LOL. I won mine along with the Super Scope 6 at some Nintendo promo thing. I still have it.

SNES Mario Kart for Life!

@Zolbrod: I dunno, I really can't imagine something like that because looking back the partnership was extremely doomed from the start. Nintendo was a juggernaut in the gaming industry and was used to having things their own way (they were EXTREMELY strict to 3rd parties), and Sony was an incredibly huge electronic and music brand that was used to having things THEIR own way.

Two huge companies with two huge egos was a guaranteed failure.

RockyRan

@aw3str1k3r: No kidding. I loaded up Pokemon Stadium 2 on my N64 earlier today after several years of not playing it and I was mildly surprised at the low amount of jaggies I was seeing. Certainly a lot less than PSX jaggies.

RockyRan

@Kiri Komori: It's really a shame. They've now degenerated into a second-rate 3rd party developer. How the times have changed.

RockyRan

Brings back memories of the "pencil trick" to play the version of Tekken 2 I brought back from Japan. Too bad it killed my console. Never had PS2, but LOVE my PS3!

@Zolbrod: Very monopolised.

@excel_excel:

Though they did steal away a lot of Nintendo developers by championing 3D gaming.

ReconToaster.

@Gorilla Snow is Maximum Risky: BSB > N'Sync. Don't you deny it.

@shouryuuken: I was never a fan of the PS1 or PS2 because of the aliasing that was rampant in all their games. I was a N64 person.

I can't help but wonder what the world of video games would have looked like now if Nintendo and Sony had paired up...

@shouryuuken:

Weird most people think PS2 is king. Then again my gamecube got a lot of play time with F-Zero and Melee. Spent hundreds of hours in Melee.

SolidOni

@BarbeQueQ: The US SNES was fugly yeah, but the rest of the world got a rather attractive one, I think.

ahh.. the original playstation.. how i hated thee so. i still look back at the system as rather bland, in the 4th gen... i didnt like the graphics. they reminded me of a 3d version of atari graphics.. blocky and low colors. the nintendo 64 looked better and the saturn still did 2d quite well.. which is why iw as in heaven on those consoles. then the ps2 came out, and i had plenty games for it because it was almost the only game in town.. but i still dug the dreamcast, original xbox, and gamecube more. now the ps3 is out.. and im a pretty big fan of the thing... whodathunk. still miss sega though.

@Mega-Driven: The universe will implode in 5...4..3..2..1...

Gorilla Snow is Maximum Risky

@Combine: But thats the thing, its not even a Wii article!!

Now that's a great article. One of the best I've read in a long time.

thebisonx

@excel_excel: it should have been "Achievement Unlocked: Troll Piss"

Succesfully Trolled Wii Article!

Combine

@SolidOni: haven't had contact with a girl for how many years?

ithyphallus

@Mega-Driven: That scared the crap out of me!

@dgd1542: EXACTLY.

Phil Harrison with hair!

@SolidOni: Yeah well it didn't look as good as the Mega Drive, which did the black, sleek look but it certainly looked better than its predessor....the NES certainly looked terrible

@excel_excel: Fission Mailed! I had to say it :)

zerokoolpsx

@excel_excel: Sorry that was a bit harsh but lets leave the talk about the casual crap.
If you think about it the PS1 was offering something different to what videogaming had offered till then.
The Wii does the same thing but offers something different.

@SolidOni: Nuh-uh, it was all about N'Sync fo sho.

Gorilla Snow is Maximum Risky

@BarbeQueQ: when I finally got a snes from my parents I thought it was the most beautiful thing ever. I still think it looks good

Masterpain22

That prototype has many similarities to the Wii. Same size and shape for the most part. Same slot loading disc drive. Same size shape and looking power button.
Get rid of that bulky top piece and buttons, and put a tray over the controller ports and you have the Wii.

Gam3r

lol at the ads
"It's more powerful than God"

[www.edge-online.com]

Kiri Komori

@excel_excel:

Got the job done for a 90's system.

SolidOni

@BarbeQueQ: Now now, the SNES....yeah ok it didn't look perfect

@excel_excel:

Loved listening to hootie and the blow fish and the spice girls on my ps1.

SolidOni

@SolidOni: Trolling. MISSION COMPLETE!

@excel_excel: I would've backed out too if I was Nintendo, that thing would have probably sold as well as a Sega-CD

Kiri Komori

@Gorilla Snow is Maximum Risky: Thats true. When the games did the talking. Sony didn't have to do much, just buy games basically. You didn't see them championing the fact that the PS1 could play fucking music CDs :P

@excel_excel: just like the SNES.

BarbeQueQ

@dgd1542:

Yes because wii has the best games this generation and certainly isn't releasing casual crap...

SolidOni

@aw3str1k3r: Most of us forgive Sony now, though. I do ever since I had a blast trollin' in Home. But yeah, the glory days were so much better.

Gorilla Snow is Maximum Risky

Its really interesting, if you think about it the N64 and PS1 were so different in the games they offered at the time, man....was a good time back then. Still a good time today but for nostalgia reasons back then was awesome!
I still believe that the Final Fantasy PS1 trilogy was great, loved all three of them!

Jesus christ did you see that SNES PS1 prototype. Ugly as shit!

I love this story, makes me feel for Sony.

<3 sony.

SolidOni

Ah, back in the days of when Sony was all about putting games at the forefront of their system, not just pushing unproven technology as a primary selling point. (yes the tech they were using was new, but it they weren't pushing an entire format with it)

and poor Sega was driven off oblivion and now spend their final days destroying their once great franchise

Kiri Komori

@dgd1542: back like Axle Rose is back.

chang187

and now Nintendo's back on top

dgd1542

@Bergerac: Excellent post.

Kyle D Johnson

@Combichristoffersen: Were you dropped on the head as a baby?

an skyline

@B1S1: PSX is not PS1. fail

@Gorilla Snow is Maximum Risky: I don't forgive them for treating their fanbase like shit and expecting us to all buy their latest console purely on the basis that it was Sony.

Sniktbub