Microsof Offering 360 Games On Demand Starting August

@McGaveson: This is true, but I can't stand the free shipping. When I buy stuff I want it now. Which is weird because I'm pretty patient with everything else. But not when it comes to buying things.

@Launch: It most certainly is new to the mainstream. Now that 2 of the 3 consoles support downloading retail games, we're getting closer and closer to no longer needing to buy games in stores.

@jcb231: No disk swapping. As someone who buys all the Guitar Hero games, it would be easier to access the games from an onscreen menu. Don't you agree?

@chronomasakari: Yet. right? That's a good point though. Maybe they'll just go digital. Didn't Amazon do it with the XBL Store?

@Neonox: Why would you want to?

Paper_Luffy

I love the idea but it doesn't seem worth it. If I pay full price for a game I want a case and manual to display in my collection.

Thomas Emory

@NeoStarr: I mean, you're not gonna go out and buy an SUV just for a few days of moving...

There's a company called U-Haul that forms its entire business model around the renting of vehicles for "just a few days" for the purpose of moving.

Kinda like how you would rent a video game. And if you don't finish the game in the alotted rental period (or complete your move during the agreed rental period) you are required to pay additional fees for continued use (either late fees or re-rental)

For my next trick...watch this.

On the other hand; I have this game I really love. You would probably love it too.

I have this shirt I love to wear, I bet you'd like it too.

I'll lend it to you if you want, as long as I can get it back when I want to play it again.

I'll lend you the shirt if you want, as long as I get it back when I need to wear it again.

By that time, you'll probably have beaten it, or if not, you can always borrow it again later on.

By that time it may have impressed somebody at a bar, or if not, you can always borrow it again to try out.

Either way, we'll likely end up at the same conclusion; having both beat the game.

Either way, we'l likely both end up at the same conclusion...the shirt either does or does not help one's social life.

See, with because digital media isn't a physical product...

Except for that VHS tape, DVD, game disc, and vinyl record that I'm currently looking at.

You have yet to put together a valid argument. Or a decent metaphor for that matter.

@Toasticus: Hah, I must have left the article open quite a while before getting around to commenting on it. Thanks for the fix, Stephen.

They should limit comments to 160 characters. Man, some of these comments are like novels. Minimize ftw!

@NeoStarr: "Hey now, don't be feedin' the trolls." Oh damn! I just realized that was what you are... So I won't bother responding anymore to your poorly thought out argument about how borrowing shirts isn't like borrowing a game. Goodbye. Have fun with your B.S.

@NeoStarr: "I also have never had anyone ask me to lend them a game."

Bullshit, sir. You are a damn liar.

@slimky: $150 for 1TB? They sell their 120GB for $150, and you think they'll give you 1TB for the same price?

"He's got... hiiiigh hopes, he's got hiiiigh hopes."

PS3 with a $110 500GB HDD from NewEgg FTW.

BTW, I don't even think they make 2.5" 1TB drives yet, so the idea of getting one for $150 any time soon is pretty funny.

R_Shackelford

These games will all be much cheaper at the actual games stores just like the Xbox Originals..

@Captain Pretty Good: "Your argument sucks because you're using too many words to explain something that should be simple."

YES! THIS!!! (I also have never had anyone ask me to lend them a game, and I love your pants).

@Shinta: Target is not going to go out of business if we take video games off the selves; they're just not particularly good at selling them anyway (actually, there's no Target around here, so I'm using Wal-Mart for reference and I assume they're not much different)

@Captain Pretty Good: Hey now, don't be feedin' the trolls.

@katsujinken: HDDs generate a lot more heat than an optical drive, and probably use about the same amount of juice to run.

R_Shackelford

@NeoStarr: HEY! Don't ignore me, troll!

@NeoStarr: Yeah, not like we want other people to have jobs or anything. Damn those Target employees, should all be fired all of them.

Shinta

@TRT-X: Was typing my other reply at the same time as you apparently, but I think I covered most of what I was saying better. Admittedly I didn't get enough sleep last night and a lot of what you're picking on me for is my own lack of concentration (For instance, I really just used the word illicit cause I couldn't think of a better way to describe a transaction in which the manufacturer of the product sees no profit; I just think of it as no different than IRL pirating myself).

But yeah, I spent a lot of time trying to clarify things in that last post. Basically what I was trying to say is that the person you're lending these things to gains a lot more from the full product than they would from borrowing everyday-use items. I mean, you're not gonna go out and buy an SUV just for a few days of moving, so in that case it makes sense, but you can't really say you drive an SUV. On the other hand, if you borrow a video game for a few days and beat it, you can say that you've beaten that video game (which may not be a complete experience in itself, but is usually enough of one to say you know what you're talking about should it ever come up in conversation or whatever). Yeah, the metaphor is not perfect again but I think you see what I mean.

Now, in regards to "wearing a shirt in its entirety" (another product of my fatigue); what I mean is something like... I have this Bape shirt that I really love. A lot. You would probably love it too. I'll lend it to you if you want, as long as I get it back for every hot date I have this month. So if we have a hot date on the same night, I might just end up lookin' snazzier than you.
On the other hand; I have this game I really love. You would probably love it too. I'll lend it to you if you want, as long as I can get it back when I want to play it again. By that time, you'll probably have beaten it, or if not, you can always borrow it again later on. Either way, we'll likely end up at the same conclusion; having both beat the game.

See, with because digital media isn't a physical product, I think we should pay proportionate fees to the right people for what we take from a game rather than what goes into it.

@Slagathorian:

100% agreed with!

give me my disc! :)

@NeoStarr:

Well I guess it is a good thing that the store is on my way home...Literally, on my way home. But the last couple games I have bought on release day, I did not reserve. It is called knowing your local retail stores and which ones are the best to go to, if you didn't reserve it. And in no cases do I ever have to wake up extra early to get it. If I reserve the game, I could go 3 days later from release and pick it up. Just because a place may do a midnight release or whatever, does not mean one has to partake in that.

And I personally believe sole digital distribution is stupid. I like having physical copies. I always have a back up for it, for one. Yes I can burn my digital media to discs, but then what is that, I still have a disc to store. Or I could always back it up on another HDD, but then that just means I have to go get another HDD and fill up another one. With a physical copy I never have to worry about HDD failure or data corruption. If it screws up, oh well rip it again.

Plus stuff like movies and albums, I can take that physical disc and hand it to by buddy and say check this out. Sorry I am not loaning my friend my iPod, computer, or HDD just cause I want him check out a band or a movie.

Also does no one have Debit cards? Or is that something that only my local area has. Money comes right out of my checking account, just like a check or paypal.

@NeoStarr: Your argument sucks because you're using too many words to explain something that should be simple.

@NeoStarr: So, you're saying you wouldn't let a friend borrow one of your games? What a good pal you are!

@NeoStarr: I'm wearing parachute pants right now.

@Captain Pretty Good: I play a lot of games over and over and I'm not saying that's a bad thing. If you're having fun with it then that's cool. But the argument started with the idea of lending games to people and selling them when you are done with them, and that just gives another person a chance to finish it as many times as they want and have as much fun with it as they want without the developer ever seeing a cent from them. The reason I bring up every day use items is because you either use them until they're insufficient or outdated, whereas you play a game till you get bored. Thus, when somebody buys a used product, you can expect a certain degradation of quality from the used item; but with digital content it's different because it's all the same code (the only risk is a scratched disc).

When I say they're expendable (and maybe that's not the right word, I admit), I mean that in most cases the person will eventually get bored of them, whereas with everyday-use items you usually don't replace them until they're either obsolete or out of style. Video games are actually quite timeless in our society, but not as much on an individual level.

So let's say a person spends fifty hours playing a game, then after getting into a different game (s)he lends it to two more people who each play it for 50 hours and love it, but eventually move on from it. That's a hundred hours of enjoyment the developers didn't get paid for.

Now, let's say a person wears parachute pants once a month or so for ten years (being too legit to quit). By this time they've likely become worn out and are most certainly out of style. He has a certain timeframe where the pants can be lent out to individuals while they can still make fashionable use of them. Every time he does this, it is digging into his own limited time with the pants, so the expense is his. Pants manufacturers continue to see profits this way because people are always gonna need to replace their old pants (and also because you can't go your entire life just borrowing all the best pants from people who have already worn them).

Hmmmm... probably should've made that more clear earlier.

@ps360blows: I don't think you quite understand my point. Any concern regarding digital distribution revolves both around the user side maintaining integrity and the provider side.

So like if I need to be online to verify said games (which is a common practice these days), or if the providers start implementing that delightful download cap concept.

Reading comprehension FTW!

@NeoStarr: How exactly do you wear a shirt or sit in a chair "in its entirety"? Did you even think your own metaphor through before using it...or did you plan that so you could pull a pretty week "Gotchya" that just muddles it up even worse?

Also, just like ANYTHING that you lend to somebody, they "have access to it" for as long as the you say is okay. I can easily lend somebody a game for a night of gaming just as I could lend them a shirt for a single evening out. Likewise, I could lend somebody a shirt "indefinately" and they can wear it as much as they like in that time period.

The only conditional in that situation (just like a game) is that I would expect to get my item back in good condition without any damage above and beyond what I would expect from normal wear and tear (no new holes from stretching it out or scratches on the disc)

@NeoStarr: Because you can't share a chair, or a shirt, or a car so easily.

Are you serious with that statement? Let's say somebody's moving and needs an SUV to haul stuff in. All I have to do is toss them my keys and viola they now can use the car. I don't have to give him also hand him the deed to the car, my license to drive, and the garage it's stored in so he can borrow it.

A chair isn't easy to share? It's a chair. Let's say a friend is having some sort of party/get together. All I have to do is grab my chair and bring it to the party and BAM they now can borrow that chair for future use. I don't have to also give him the original tag from the store, the receipt proving I bought it, and the kitchen in which I use it.

A shirt? It's the easiest thing to share. I just toss them the shirt and if it fits they wear it. I don't need to give them the tags, the reciept, or the closet so they can use it.

when you do decide to sell them, it's probably because there's something better on the market.

Or because the shirt doesn't fit, or I now have a kid and thus need a car that can carry a family around, or because I redecorated my home and the old chair doesn't match.

Kinda like how a game may no longer meet my needs, or the sequel (which is better) is now out.

Digital distribution will just set everything back on the right course by not allowing these sorts of illicit sales.

Seriously...are you a plant? Do you even know what "illicit" means? I bought the merchandise. It's mine now. If I decide I no longer want it, why shouldn't I be allowed to sell it to a new user? Why does electrionic media get to be exempt from actually being OWNED.

@Jonbo298: Well, then it would make as much sense as OnLive does, which is...not much.

Seriously, though, I have the 20GB drive, so I'm just trying to ignore this bit of news.

Rallion

No mention of licensing yet? Because I had 2 replacement Xbox within 1 year the license transfer thingy do not work. Thus I have to be logged into LIVE for many of my XBLA games to work and other users on my console can't play them without me being logged in as well.

downloading the full game onto the HD forever? or like a rental?
it would be cool to download and rent a game for a few days, or a week, and then have it expire, like they do with movies.

darkslide

@brandonf:

Same. Won't happen though.

OmnomnomPancake

@-[[CHoZO]]-: EXACTLY, and better yet, developers and/or Microsoft get a cut of the profits.

nerdBOY01

Does it include Oddworld Stranger?

Turael

But can we STILL use our MS Points? and I assume it's like a rental, try-before-you-buy kind of thing?

If so, this would actually be kind of cool. No more having to deal with Blockbuster and them not having game's in-stock. Woohoo!

@NeoStarr: But what you said was that no one is going to want to play a game over and over because it's expendable and you compared it to everyday-use items.
WTF???
I don't know about you, but I play a lot of my games over and over.
I love the Ratchet and Clank series, Disgaea, and Diablo 2 because of this.
You must just have a short attention span.

@Captain Pretty Good: Sure you can share those, but passing around a video game actually gives the person a chance to complete it in its entirety, while if you share, say, a shirt, the person won't have access to it for every big date or whatever they want to wear it on in the future.

@jcb231: That's what Terrabyte hard drives are for my friend. I could probably fit my entire X-Box collection onto one; it'll likely only be another generation before they're built in. I wouldn't even be surprised if Microsoft decided to release a larger hard drive to complement this news.

@jcb231: You COMPLETELY missed the point. Games will eventually end, even if it takes 40 hours, and then you're welcome to go back and play it if you want but you're more likely to move on to a new experience for a while until you get all nostalgic for it. Usually by that time it's disappeared off the shelves; and where do we find it? Through digital distribution of course (Virtual Console especially). On top of that, the developer can still see profits from their games years after they're released. I did not say that a game ends and then it sucks. I was implying that we're always moving on to new things.

@SocraticMethod: They are definitely not suffering, but I still don't see why I should want to pay extra, arbitrary costs for packaging and retail mark ups. I don't mind shaving off a percentage of each sale for a company like Steam or something though when they're managing my collection through my account.

@Maxyboy13: inFamous is Static Shock: The Game: Hey, I think it'd be cool to download BioWare. I wonder if we also download all the employees? If even a small amount of people downloaded them, they'd be up to their dialogue trees in business. They'd be spread pretty thin, though...

Andrew Wyatt

Awesome. I've wanted something like this for a while. I'd love if they offered a rental service for this, though.

kylenalepa

@NeoStarr: Aww the poor video games industry is so broke and need my money so much. Seriously though, they're bigger than the movie industry these days, bigger than most industries period right now and you make it sound like they're suffering. I prefer my money to go to the devs too, but only on games I know I will get my money's worth from. Pure digital distribution is not the answer.

Your logic has failed in many ways in this thread.

This....is awesome. Hey everyone getting pissed off, at least it's an OPTION

Bababoof is amazing

i dont get it, you can download a whole copy game? but games like halo tell you NOT to run the game disc as a DL prog ? And if i recall it is just a jumpstart on loading so it doesnt actually have the whole game, just the load jumps?

lordhewlett

No way am I going to use this service. More than half the retail titles I play I rent. Now if they offered an on-demand game rental service, say $5 for a week then this would be great.

Oh yeah, but before we can consider any of this, we need a frelling 1TB HDD!

@NeoStarr:

Wow. Media expendable? It's this sort of attitude that's contributing to the video game world's apparent total hatred and disregard for its history. Classic video games should be treated like classic movies and music, but they're not...instead we get backwards compatibility thrown out the window all the time, and entire series of awesome games regulated to unplayable status or dustbins because no modern hardware can play them.

Media is NOT expendable. Maybe YOU don't spend an extended period of time on a game but my 40 plus hours of Mass Effect play beg to differ, and I have every intention of playing that game again shortly before the sequel comes out. I like owning my media, not renting it. Then it is mine to do with as I please, to loan out, to resell, whatever. Plus I don't relish the notion of my hard drive suffering damage and making me lose thousands of dollars in games.

jcb231

Well...M$ needs to launch a 300-400 GB drive for $129 to entice people to DL more shit onto their 360.

hiruu

@-[[CHoZO]]-: Actually I see this as their final solution for RRODs. Since they've obviously not been able to find a way to outright eliminate them, maybe they're instead going to try and shift the focus on which games are primarily played on xBox360s to digital downloads so there won't be any hot power consuming optical drives spinning inside warping the motherboard.

Psst, the screenshot shows BioShock, not the dev BioWare. ;)

@Slagathorian: I agree, I'm living in New Zealand and we just UPGRADED to 15 gigs per month. American services often don't have this problem, but many countries do. If it went digital, it'd be more expensive.

bangbangblah

@NeoStarr:

If Xbox Originals are any indication, the physical disc will be cheaper than the digital version.

Physical products sold from stores also benefit from retailers competing against each other via sales and coupons and promotions. Digital downloads tend to stay the same price forever, barring inclusion in the "Deal of the Week" promo.

Even if they were the exact same price, I'll take a physical copy over a download any day of the week. Why fill up my hard drive? A disc version can also be played on other people's machines.

And pre-ordering is for chumps....unless it comes with some great bonus, it's kind of pointless. I've never purchased a game that I wasn't able to get on Day One if I wanted it. Even biggies like Halo 3 and GTA 4.

jcb231

@NeoStarr: "Because you can't share a chair, or a shirt, or a car so easily."

*facepalm*

Dude, those are things that you can totally share easily... Try again with less fail. :/

Awesome, I'm totally buying Bioware over Live when this goes up. I wonder if it'll max out my card...

That's my annoying way of pointing out the misspelling of Bioshock.

Anyway I give this a big meh. While I like digital services like Steam and GOG, I also like that I have insane amounts of memory to use up on my PC. My 360 won't be able to hold more than maybe 5 games if I'm lucky so this isn't something I'm seeing as viable. Not to mention what happens if I still have a working 360 down the line (no jokes) about 10 years and want to dip back into Mass Effect? Will Microsoft allow me to redownload this game then? No thanks. I'll keep my physical copies so I can always enjoy my games.

jargy1

Sorry, but I'm not always that keen on buy Virtual Console / Wiiware games due to the fact I'm buying games I don't have full control over.

I'm certainly not going to buy full priced games in a digital format which I will lose control of when Microsoft decides not when I decide.

It's all about stopping piracy and used games sales but it will kill consumer choice once this becomes the norm and there won't be a cost benefit either for consumers by going down this route to stop piracy and used games sales. It'll be just like CD based games where we're told it will be cheaper and it was slightly for all of about 2 seconds and then prices go back to being high.

CharlesNelsonReilly

@slimky: one tb for 150 would solve all my problems in download land

tnmnsquare

@Neonox:
Why would you want to?

You have the disc. The physical disc. Why would you also want to take up your hard drive space by downloading the whole thing?

And if you really hate discs spinning in the drive, you can just copy the game to your hard drive in the dashboard, no download required.

jcb231

@Everard: Well I believe Steam charges slightly less than retail SRP; but you'd have to be out of your mind if you think you're gonna get a full length, 4+ GB game for $20.

You're not getting anything more with a boxed purchase unless it's one of those special editions that actually comes with physical objects, you're just throwing all your money away to the wrong people.

nice.. im buying a new 120gb HDD tomorrow for my xbox anyways so im glad i have more stuff to fill it up with!

styl3s

@notquitedeadyet: I see where you are coming from and i definitely agree, but i live in México and it can be really hard to find game stores here, the ones in my city usually just keep newer games in stock, so a game like Mass Effect which i would like to play before the sequel comes out would be very hard to find. This is a great alternative to our problem and it should even help avoid piracy :D!

rojano17

@firstworldgamer…dood:

That's true but systems don't make game stores money.

@NeoStarr: If developers want me to buy a game that I can't resell, they'd better not be charging anything like $60 for it. I refuse to pay more than $20 for digital content, period.

Everard

@TRT-X: Well, just like with Steam or any other digital game distribution system, you simply redownload those games at no charge. Unlike a scratched or lost disc that you'll never play again and have no way of recovering without purchasing a second time.

Oops.

ps360blows

@jcb231: I suppose this would be for impulse buyers who can't wait to play the game as soon as possible. I still prefer games on disc. You can't resell downloaded games.

Pizookie

@im.thatoneguy: Exactly, if you're not paying with a credit card, you're getting a worse deal. Cash is probably the worst way to pay for things.

Ohh no the beggining of the End, Darn digital distribution!><

Naota

@Valnen: Actually you can get free Super Saver delivery on orders over £5 and if you have Prime (which I do) then it is free next day delivery.

McGaveson

Sorry, I need a physical copy to resell on eBay to make some of my $60 bucks back I spent for 5-10 hours of enrertainment.

Despacio

@McGaveson: And on Amazon you get to pay for shipping.

@ttocs: I lost my copy of Civ: Rev on the train last year, weeks after I bought it.

*sniff*

Thanks for reminding me.

Michael Bay called it...........

The beginning of the end.

@lucasreis: Altough, I still wanted MS to develop a console that doesn´t break.

lucasreis

You listed BioWare as a game, I assume you meant BioShock cause it is in the screen shot.

rhys1882

@jcb231: Yeah, but if there's a points purchase option (which I'm sure there will be... or at least hope there will be) you can always buy points on sale from those same retail outlets; almost all the points I've bought were at least 25% off, most 50% off. If new titles are released same day as digital downloads, even at full price, I could potentially be paying half price for them on day one, and since I can queue up the downloads online from work, there's potentially no downtime to play once I get home.

It's like having a private sale whenever I want to buy things...

That being said, I remain skeptical due to the harddrive issue you already brought up as installed games can be deleted and reinstalled on a whim, redownloading a game won't happen "on a whim" since, even if you're on an OC12, downloading 4GB or more will take longer than my attention span if it's not the "new hotness" or if a friend wants to check something like Crackdown out.

This is fucking great news for someone who lives in a shitty TAX LAND like I do. If they accept international credit cards it will be just like giving a HUGE FINGER to all the game companies here in Brazil and just paying the price these guys are asking instead of 3 times more! FUCKING AWESOME NEWS!

lucasreis

@adoggz: They need to release a 1TB for 150$. Until then, they can continue to release new stock for the HDD, most people won't be able to try them.

I'm an early 360 buyer with a stupid 20Gb. I can't even dream of downloading a full game on my HDD with all the download I made (Metallica pack for GH:WT is around 1Gb!!!).

If the drop doesn't come to the price, it will come in my interest.

slimky

@RockyRan: I'm from the UK so these prices are in pounds sterling:

[www.amazon.co.uk]

[store.steampowered.com]

The links show the PC version of orange box for £14.64 on Amazon UK and £16.99 from Steam.
So I'm not ignorant.

McGaveson

@Aprotosis: What are you guys talking about? I used Warhawk as an example because it was the first and it was definitely a full blu ray release not a PSN arcade game. Since then, Burnout Paradise, Socom, Siren, Quest for Booty and NFL head coach were also released. So yes, the PSN started putting up full retail relases on the PSN almost 2 years ago.

@Spaceboy: you haven't actually implied that you read joystiq.

sweenish

I like this idea very much.

Jim Gallo

@Lou3000: Wow, you can say that again!

only interested if you can "rent" a title for a period of time, like you do with movie downloads. Not interested in paying full price for downloaded games that I can get at retail... here's why:

1. No room on the HD. I have the 120gb drive and only have 3gb left. Yea i can delete stuff to clear up room, but really how many games am I going to have on such a small hd? Does this mean that 500gb or grater hard drives are in the works?

2. Download speed. How long is it going to take to download a new title? I be I could drive to target, pick up a game, come home and fire it up much much faster than it would take for the download to complete.

3. No resale value at all! Plus, I have more than 1 Xbox 360 in the house... what if I want to play in the bedroom, but then later play in the game room?

PlayerXXX

@Microshock: You can bet Microsoft will do a better job of it, though, mark my words. They do EVERYTHING better, because Sony just kinda give up after five minutes.

Classic games - A main feature of PSN that after several years have basically NO good games to begin with. Microsoft have SEVERAL.

Clothing - Sony hinted several times that they could make Home-clothes as awards for achieving stuff in various games. They never did get it very established, and after Watchmen, Killzone 2 and Resident Evil 5 there hasn't been much at all. Now Microsoft will do it too, and given the steady update of avatar-clothing, you can bet they'll do a better job.

Demos and games - Microsoft get plenty of classic games here as well, and they manage almost always a pretty much worldwide release. Sony take forever to release their announced PSN-games (Fat Princess is turning a year old, and back then you could tell from the screenshots it was at least playable to some degree) and in the meantime they release either nothing, or gameclones like Breakout and Pinball (compare THAT to virtual on or Rez) and then fuck up majorly, because SCEA, SCEE and SCEJ don't seem to ever communicate between each other.

@Lou3000: Yes it was. Burnout Paradise is also downloadable. That's definately a full game.

@EMPEROR_COW: Will depend on the time of day, direction of wind, and what the publishers/MS decides. Region restrictions for DLC exist already if you didn't know; for example, you can't download the premium Agarest War theme in the US (though you can download the gamer icons), and they've locked out CoD:WaW's map pack as well GoW2's in Japan. In the meantime there's plenty of shit that you CAN dl as well.

Why would they do this? Hell if I knew, but every publisher's got their set of rules, and hey, more power to them to get the choice to restrict their shit if they wish. Might be a pain for you if you can't get everything you want, but that's where te whole voting with dollars thing comes in with the rest of their lineup.

@DXY!: Eh? It's not new, although i'd agree that more and more it's spreading from the PC onto consoles, first ps3 (which has been more of a trial so far but an important first step), the new psp and the 360 however seem to be adopting a bit more completely.

Might be a sign from Sony that the ps3 examples worked, which is good news.

A lot of things has gotten me excited but come on MS a price drop for your 120GB please???????

JetPogi

@TRT-X: Because you can't share a chair, or a shirt, or a car so easily. They're meant to last you a long time, and when you do decide to sell them, it's probably because there's something better on the market.

Media on the other hand is pretty much expendable. You don't usually spend an extended period of time on one song, or movie, or game; it's more of a cycle. Thus; these products don't have a lot of lasting value, and developers pretty much only have the sales made in the first few weeks to determine how much money they'll have for their next endeavor. It also makes it much more difficult to find new copies of older games.

It used to be that art went up in value with demand and resale. Now it's the exact opposite. Digital distribution will just set everything back on the right course by not allowing these sorts of illicit sales.

@Aprotosis:Sony released Burnout Paradise...

@McGaveson: Really? Steam is a joke? Could you point me to a place where I could've gotten the PC version of Orange Box for 10 bucks?

It's one thing to dislike digital distribution in general. It's another to spout off ignorant crap.

RockyRan

@dreadnought666:
These are downloads for full retail releases. The Warhawk example is more like downloading a PSN game and then having it go to retail like those arcade packs. If they let you download their entire library, this will be huge.

Aprotosis

No way. If I'm getting a full game for a system that supports physical media (disc), I'm getting a disc.

@Rampage: Warhawk isn't a $60 game.

Lou3000

@ttocs: Yeah, it's gotta be Civ Rev.

@nonpareil: Needs a bigger Hard Drive IMO.

if it's cheaper than retail it makes sense. and it HAS to be cheaper since no production costs and shipping and vendors cash in... so, yeah, if it makes the game cheaper, i'm in!

I definitely like this - I don't have any real attachment to owning a "physical" retail package and disc. I know a lot of folks do - that's fine. And if you want to later sell agame that certainly makes perfect sense. But I don't sell my games, so having them on the hard drive works better for me (less clutter, too).

Forsakyn

YAYA!i hate used games sales and i expected this to be included when the xbox 360 launched. With companies like GAME/GAMESTOP charging almost new prices for old used games i am happy to know those companies will be run into the ground as we go into the next generation of games!

@xxXX_Insanities_Birth_XXxx: When you install the game from the disk you still need to have the disk in the system to play it.

Yay! XBLA gets PSN!

Wolfgang Wozniak

@MDX: Totally agree with you on that one. I'm still rocking the old 20GB HDD, sad.

I'm gonna need a heafty discount to RENT my games, instead of buying them.

@nonpareil: Until server issues or HDD problems cause you to lose access to your entire game collection.

Oops.

@NeoStarr: OMG two trips to the STORE! NOOO!

The nice thing about reserves is you can do more than one at a time. Thusly, if I walk into a store to buy that new game that just came out (or to sell some used games), I can drop $20 and reserve 4 games and be on my way. No extra trip.

I'm sorry, but this is just one more step towards removing the gamer's right to actually OWN the stuff they buy. Once I buy a game, I should have every right to sell it once I am done. Just like an item of clothing, piece of furniture, or even a house or car...

Why do games or music get to be any different?

Sounds interesting. But, I thought that this was going to be more of a rental service. That's what I think of when I think on demand. I never expect to keep the games, just try them out and experience them. Some games just aren't worth buying to some people.

@emorottie:
Yeah F*CK credit card!! Who wants free airplane tickets to anywhere in the world every couple years.

Damn Credit Card companies always giving me free stuff for using them!

im.thatoneguy

@zgreenwell: They could pack games from this point onward with codes that let you download the game. That way you have an incentive to buy new also.

@xxXX_Insanities_Birth_XXxx:

What if you burned the disc and crushed its burnt husk into little pieces in front of the webcam thing?

im.thatoneguy

@Slagathorian: Exactly. More money goes to the gaming industry and less goes to YOU.

@quidsquid: You can install it if you have the disc anyway so you don't need to download it but you'd get the same results. No need for the disc (unless you need it in to authenticate it).

xxXX_Insanities_Birth_XXxx

@McGaveson: Real gamers keep their collections anyway.

The mockup includes BioWare, Stephen?

@nonpareil: ??????

Digital Distribution isn't a good thing. The devs want you to think it is, because TECHNICALLY it should lower prices as you don't have to burn a disc, print a playing manual, ship the game ect. But we all know they won't really lower the price. There are enough stores now that sell video games that it isn't THAT inconvenient to go to a store to pick up a game. I mean, people usually need to go to walmart once a month anyways for toothpaste, socks, etc. You may as well pick up a game when you're there.

Also my monthly download cap is 40GB per month. This would screw me.

Plus you couldn't sell your games when you're finished, or lend them to a friend.

Trust me people, the move to digital distribution is not for our best interests. Its for theirs.

@CheechWizz: Well, you can't download systems yet.

@notquitedeadyet: I use a credit card when I purchase at the local Target, actually.

emorottie

Does this get rid of the elevator loading?

This would be nice if we could download the Guitar Hero games and Rock Band 2. No disk swapping anyone?

However, Microsoft NEEDS to offer bigger hard drives. Or external hard drive support. 120 gigs is NOT enough for a service like this.

... This might make me buy a 360.

@ttocs: Would you believe I meant Oblivion? Temporary boxart confusion. We're adding a couple more games to the post: BioShock and Lego Star Wars

@NeoStarr: Because you can sell your games if you bought the physical disc. How would you ever sell these games? I sold my copy of DMC4 on Ebay for around 50$ the week after I bought it new. I then re-picked it up later for 20$ at EB.

Also, this wouldn't allow friends to lend their games to each other.

@ttocs: Nice catch. Wonder if this is a slip up on the reporting end or if the mock-up itself was incorrect.

bdenby

@ShadowOdin finally got a copy of Suikoden III. Is upset wit...:
Yeah but games like Killzone 2 are easily 25GB and they can't put that on, inFAMOUS as well.

Games like Burnout are only 3GB in size.

@NeoStarr: Also, this way you know that 100% of the money you're giving is going to people who have some involvement in making the games/consoles we love.

@Takamofo: I know, that's the point I was making.

bigger HDD announcement coming soon from MS

@notquitedeadyet: You're then paying for the packaging and corporate mark up of the product. Also, those shelves are getting a little full, aren't they? And if you want a game on release day, you'll likely have to make two trips to the store; one for the pre-order and the other to pick it up. In some cases, you'll have to wake up extra early for the latter.

This day in age, I just don't see how there is any point to releasing any digital product by any means other than digital distribution, frankly. In regards to the credit card issue; all they need is paypal support so the money can come straight from my bank account and this will be perfect.

@pikemoney: I think the leaderboards are up over a million now, so I would say quite a few people. It's one of the best multiplayer games of this gen, and I actually purchased via the PSN.

@pikemoney: uh, i did. so did a lot of people.

@quidsquid: You would be able to sell the disc and still play the game...

uzivatel

Wait, Civilization IV or Civilization: Revolution? The former is a massive announcement.

Kuciwalker

@Neonox: why? You could just install the disk....

Unless you want to get it for free then sell back your game.... in which case no one gets something for nothing...

ShaggyB

@notquitedeadyet: Yep, that's how they getcha.

gaijira

@Neonox: No. What would stop you from simply renting the game, then downloading it and getting a free copy? Never going to happen.

The age of digital distribution is finally at hand.

The games will have to be at least half price of the disk version to make it a worthwhile sacrifice of not getting the physical copy.
I'm not a fan of downloadable games in the slightest so I don't think I'd ever download them anyway but it'll tempt some people. Steam is a joke, you can get disk copies of the games they sell on there for much cheaper than the Steam price.
It disturbs me how willing people are to sacrifice their rights and their ability to lend or sell on their games. That's not to say I particularly agree with the way game shops are commercialising the second hand market.
I personally only buy new copies and I hate in when there is less selection for those than the second hand games!

McGaveson

Hmph. I can definitely see the games being offered for download being more expensive than buying used (for instance, Assassin's Creed being 20 bucks even though you can buy it used for as little as 10 bucks). If that's the case (and I'm pretty confident it will be), count me out.

RockyRan

@dreadnought666: yeah and who bought that?

I like to own my game disks so this is not for me, others might find it useful though, but you better have at least a 360 Elite HDD to try and use this honestly.

@notquitedeadyet:Going into debt FTW!

@Rampage: Almost two years. Started with Warhawk in August of 07.

@adoggz: They will need to as an incentive if they really want this to take off.

@ShadowOdin finally got a copy of Suikoden III. Is upset wit...: You might expect more coming out from the Live Marketplace since so far the PS3 only has 8 PS3 games (Burnout Paradise, GT5: Prologue, Hail to the Chimp, NFL Head Coach 09, Ratchet & Clank Future: Quest for Booty, Siren: Blood Curse, SOCOM: U.S. Navy SEALs Confrontation, and Warhawk).

That's great, but MS apparently forgot to announce the new bigger hard drive needed for all this downloadable content. If they announced a 360GB drive with hard-drive transfer cables for the 360, I would snatch that up day-of-release. My 120GB drive has less than 15GB left....and I've only owned my console since October 2007....I'm going to run out of space this year, I know it. And I really have no clue how to deal with that...I can't possibly be alone, there must be others who buy a lot of arcade games and DLC.

But honestly, why in the heck would I buy Assassin's Creed as a download that takes up my precious hard drive space when I could own the disc, which dollars to donuts will be cheaper to purchase because retail outlets have all types of sales and discounts, whereas MS will price-control what's sold over live....really, why would I? Look at Xbox Originals...only complete morons (and yes, I'm calling you a moron if you buy them) or folks with zero access to any other retail source would download those over-priced titles instead of just buying the disc.

jcb231

This is good news, I love digital distribution and its relative ease to buy new titles on the spot, particually older discontinued titles.

@liquid_kore:

And you've now implied that you do as well. And I have now, too. Oi!

Sounds insane. Full downloads of games? Are they streamed? My tiny, tiny HDD cannot handle full games. Besides, I like how pretty the boxes look on my shelf.

Spaceboy

@ShadowOdin finally got a copy of Suikoden III. Is upset wit...: Oh shi-
I forgot that Sony HAS the service, they just never use it.
Silly me
Forgetting that Sony never ever really use their own services, just give us a tease, making us ask for more, and then ignoring it

Not having to add 4200 points to buy a game would be nice.

@Neonox: I don't think that would work. It would be difficult to track whether or not it's your copy, or you're buying it. Also, what if you download the game, then go sell it? Does that next person get the download free too? Also, if that were true, you'd be able to get new games for pretty cheap. I think they should try to implement a system that allows you to install the full game onto your system (like a computer), but they would have to implement some sort of verification process to avoid rampant piracy.

cinemandrew

@nonpareil: You do realize that Sony has been offering full game downloads for over a year, right?

Rampage

@EMPEROR_COW:

ofcourse i'll need a japanese account .. which i already have .. so ... hmmm

EMPEROR_COW

If they aren't at heavy discount compared to physical copies then screw that - Hey Microsoft you're gonna hafta do better than that to claim back that preowned dollar!!!

interesting ...
i wonder if i would be able to download import games on my american xbox ... hmmm i wonder ... i think they're breaking the region barrier indirectly with this one
which is great .. because technicly ... every side STILL gets its cash ...

i hope it accepts international credit cards this time

EMPEROR_COW

@Quote: true, but by downloading them you don't need the disc in the tray to still play the game.

Kinda like Sony, eh?

I almost got really excited about this, until I realized it was downloads/purchases.

I was having these visions of the Sega Channel reborn, and was curious how in the heck they were going to manage that with games so much larger than 15 years ago.

jallen

Now offer a 120GB HDD for 40$ and this'll be a good announcement.

MDX

@BubbleF**kingBuddy: He reads Joystiq! Get 'em fellas!

Awesome. Best E3 so Far.

SinfulKnight

@drtyfrnk: LOL I was wondering if anyone else noticed that...

does this mean Microsoft will drop the price on the replacement hd's now?

I'll... pass. With the install-to-HDD option, the main benefits of this already exist. All you're getting is a bit of convenience.

I realize that convenience is what has made steam so successful, of course, but quite frankly I have more faith in my computer's hard drive to still be around in ten years than Microsoft's DRM system to allow me to still play my games two systems later.

Moonshadow101

@AoE: This is Microsoft we're talking about....

@Neonox: That would be sweet, but probably not as it would lead to a lot of rental/gamefly abuse.

I hope they update their credit card system to take more types of card for this, it's so annoying wanting to buy some points, having the card in front of me I can buy anything else on the internet with, and not being allowed to.

woons

Well this was inevitable, this is just the start. Wonder if there's gonna be brick and mortar game stores in say 5-10 years.

CheechWizz

Until the 360 can allow you to easily use your own hard drives, this won't bode well for most. Unless they are going with the OnLive approach of streaming on the fly then it would make more sense.

Another way they're going to crack down on used game sales.

-[[CHoZO]]-

WOW. This is big. Digital distribution, here we come -- should make the next gen of consoles sleeker, faster, quieter, and more reliable.

Microsoft OWNED this year. Sony, Nintendo, Step up or GTFO.

If prices are low enough, I'll strongly consider this.

AoE

Forgot the T in microsoft Totilo :)

Cool news though.

Oh cool. I imagine most users' hard drives will be pretty full if you have to install them as well, like.

@Neonox:

Don't bet any money on it.

notquitedeadyet

If every single one of them has a demo like the Arcade games then it's incredible. Probably not though.

samwise227

@Neonox: It'd be faster for you to install from the disc since the NXE let's you do that...

Civilization 4 or Civilization Revolution?

Eh, I still would rather just go to Target/Walmart/Gamestop/etc. to get the disc version. I'll pay in cash over credit card any day.

notquitedeadyet

Can we download them for free if we have a physical copy?

I'll mark this off on the Bingo...

BubbleF**kingBuddy

Does this mean we get cheaper hard drive upgrades!?!?

chigaimasmaro

@Valnen: Real gamers don't care about a box on the shelf.

ps360blows

@Rampage: I just wish they'd offer ALL their games for download already. Some of use have upgraded hard drives that have more than enough room.

@Slagathorian: Your points aren't enough for those of us without download caps and good connections to care. Some of us DO have the resources available to take full advantage of a digital distribution system. If you want to buy a disc, fine, but there's no reason they shouldn't offer digital distribution for every game too.

ps360blows

@Microshock: Why not? I can download 25GB pretty quickly, and I've got plenty of hard drive space. They should just put every game up for download to give people who want that option the ability to download their games. It's not like they'd be forcing anyone to use it.

ps360blows

@TRT-X: Yeah, dude, I "get it" (there's really not much to get there, champ) but your points are not enough for a lot of us who see those are rather small inconveniences, at best, compared to the much greater advantages of not having to give money to some awful store, not having to actually have a disc in the drive to play, not having to worry about ever losing the disc or scratching it, and never worrying about having to wait for it to be in stock. I'm not some collector who needs a box on the shelf to prove I own a game. I just want to play them.

As a side note: Can we please all stop using this "FTW" crap? It makes you sound retarded.

ps360blows

@NeoStarr: My question is, why neostar, why are you trying to push DD so hard? No ones convinced, no ones changing their way of life. Are you working in marketing for a game developer or something?

@im.thatoneguy: True. Very true.

Announced this week:
Xbox 360 1tb drive only $699!!