Universal Ratings Raises Its Head Again, ESRB Responds

I can't remember who said it, but "fuck the children" and no, not into the pedo way either.

I might have mentioned this before, but I really do hate people.

@Xelioth: No, because games would still be rated.

adinnieken

@jamBot: Apparently so, given the vast amount of children I see in stores getting their parents to buy them, which I then have to deal with online.

Nobody is saying that Parenting is easy. Of course not. But Video Game Box Art is pretty easy to decipher.

If there's some chick on the front cover with her ass hanging out (X-Blades), then maybe it's not for kids?

Or several large men holding guns, knives or chain-saws, standing next to prostitutes with large boobies sucking on lolly-pops, again, that's a game not intended for children.

Is THAT really so hard to figure out?

@Kyosuke_Nanbu: A lot of them don't want to be blamed for screwing up children. The real issue here isn't the kids though. It's an excuse. Someone jerk wants to have the right to censor what they disagree with, so they pass laws to allow that, and the best way to get people to support a law that takes away freedom? Tell them it's FOR THE KIDDIES, WE HAVE TO PROTECT THEM. People suddenly drop what they're doing, and band together to protect their kids from...nothing. Because it's not a threat to them.

People shouldn't give up their freedom for anything, least of all "protection" and "security", most of which is just a load of crap that accomplishes nothing is says it does. Even if we had an ultra strict rating system like Germany, what's really stopping kids from playing any of these games? Kids find ways to get stuff, and no matter what laws you pass, it won't stop kids from finding a way, and it won't stop ignorant parents from letting Halo babysit their children, it will only make things more inconvenient and more censored for the people it's supposedly trying to protect.

TheCodexx

That's really great that Senators are taking so much time out of their "political agenda" to "Save the Children". But, this isn't going to do shit, if the Kid's parents buy the games for them anyway. Where's the "Law" to fix THAT?

To be fair, it would probably be less confusing all around to have one ratings system for everything, with the same standards and expectations.

In practice though it'll probably be a total clusterfuck to implement.

@Witzbold: many countries do, such as Australia and here in Brazil.

Viakenny

@Azures: True, but you still have to strike a balance between completely coddling children/protecting them from the outside world, and exposing them to absolutely everything.

Developmental psychology makes it pretty clear that children need positivity to develop healthy attitudes towards life. For example, while not always the case, a lot of children who grew up with constantly fighting parents, or parents who weren't very affectionate towards their children often end up with unhealthy beliefs about how to go about intimate relationships.
Similarly, if the parents are too lazy to explain to young children that certain gruesome scenes in video games are the exception or pure fantasy (or if the parents are unaware of the games their children buy and play), children could develop negative attitudes about things if they played enough of those games.

Not all parents are good parents, so that's why things like the ESRB can be useful. While some Teen and Mature games are harmless, there are some that probably have the ability to disturb a young child. If you haven't already watched it, the video I included is the sort of scene that I don't object to for any reason and think served the story of the game well, but I am glad that the ESRB generally prevents young children from seeing it.

nworobes

@nworobes: Rather kids be explained things they see rather than kept in ignorance about it. Its impossible to stop the world for one child, so prepare that child for the world instead.

@paulrenzo: No. Parenting isn't easy, and that's the POINT. These systems should be trivial, unnecessary.

That's why you have kids when you're good and fucking ready. If you have little johnny now cause u decided to bareback it one night don't come bitching.

@Azures: Yes.

crabperson

@sanyo: The point is you don't need government involvement in this sort of thing. It's just another excuse to let parents not be parents. Children are supposed to be taught; Taught how to properly decipher and deal with the world around them. If parents are raising good kids, it doesn't matter how many outlets of entertainment are avaliable to them, they'll make the right choices.

but no. GOD FORBID YOU MUST TAKE CARE OF THESE CHILDREN YOU SQUEEZED OUT OF YOUR SWEATY GOO FILLED EMBRACE!

@peterpanpiper2: I agree, a universal rating system implemented the right way would be great, and parents would automatically know what a rating meant.

Except this "report looks specifically at technology that can block programming by ratings". Guess what? All 3 current gen consoles include ratings blocking systems. Good on you, FCC.

A rating system that covers the broad spectrum of all that should probably be considered a positive thing because it streamlines the rating process across different types of media.

peterpanpiper2

@Arc-: Its not the same, an AO rating is the kiss of death to games, console makers will not allow AO games and stores will not carry them. Then you have the ESRB slapping AO on games that are obviously designed for mature players but in their idiot wisdom they want to protect the children. If they would use AO only for porn I would agree, but it has already been abused many times to force a mature games and force companies to tone down games for fear of getting an AO rating. AO is too powerful and needs to go, I would rather have an 18+ and let the mature people decide what is acceptable and not allow some group that does not know what the hell it is doing to decide.

Azriel77

@bobtheduck: Its true. when it comes down to it its up to the parents to monitor what the children get and play. the ratings are just to help the parents out to make a decision. Making one universal rating isn't going to help, its just going to prolong the problem.

NocNia

To be fair, this "universal ratings system" will put things into perspective: that videogames is a "not only for kids" thing, as it has the exact ratings system similar to "typical" media like TV shows and movies.

Also, some of you think it's so easy to be a parent; monitoring their children 24/7 while juggling between one (or even two or more) jobs is soo easy compared to controlling your avatar in the Sims 3 (/sarcasm)

paulrenzo

@Azriel77: but the thing is, AO is also for Porn.. while M is for lesser things.

It's like making R rated movies and Porn the same rating. it's just not right.

Arc-

@sunpop: Isn't that present day America? Kids can watch pretty mature stuff on TV unless their parents stop them, and a lot of stores still aren't super picky about selling Teen or Mature games to younger kids.

nworobes

@Omegastrider Fixed his ps3:

An America where parents have to make sure the kids aren't playing something they shouldn't be is an America I don't want to see.

@XtRiT: Doo doo doo, doo doo doo! *rimshot*

"laws to protect children"

If the parents are doing their jobs, then you won't have to worry.

If they aren't doing their jobs, then you have school to back them up.

It's that plain, and that simple.

No need to waste time on universal ratings. What we have now works.

If it ain't broke don't fix it.

@Grand_Marquis: Because, as stated above, the MPAA will immediately sue the motherloving **** out of them.

The new PEGI in UK & Eire is way better with the colour codes

@Grand_Marquis: Hah. Board. Monopoly.

@Xelioth: I thought GoldenEye was Teen?

@Xelioth: Oh no sir, They did sell me the game....because my mother got it for me ;]
And now, I enjoy playing Killer7, especially at night (trauma :Db)

NekuSakuraba just wants FRIENDS

@sandmanfvrreturns: Sony, MS and Nintendo (although since the SNES days, don't quote me on Nintendo) don't keep AO games from being released and don't pull products that are later rated AO (see San Andreas).

It's big-box retailers like Wal-Mart and Best Buy who refuse to stock AO titles. Seeing as this is where most sales come from, game publishers (not console manufacturers) generally won't let an AO game out the door til it's taken down to M since it will adversely affect sales.

Koztah

@Grand_Marquis: that is what valuntary means. no one is forcing them to use it, they choose to because it's best for them financially.

and no, in point of fact, the answer is not 'never.' what, they don't have indie film houses where you live?

@No cool name here... Move along: If nothing else, it means that the government has to spend more money to set up an agency to enforce it.

Generally speaking, even staunch liberals would prefer to avoid government expenditure to fix something that isn't broken, especially when the 'fix' would involve unconstitutional government regulation of protected speech.

Kegwen

@No cool name here... Move along: Because children are humans too, and thus have basic human rights, rights to not be abridged in access to any media included. Plus, their parents have the right to decide whether such media is suited for their kids, without any government restricting them in it.

All in all, this is another example of government poking their nose where it doesn't belong, and people are peeved with that enough as it is.

The one thing I hate about the ESRB is the seperation between 17+ and AO, just combine them into a 18+ rating so AO will not be the kiss of death to games.

Azriel77

@adinnieken: ESRB is used in canada, though, to my knowledge. if we phased out the ESRB here, canada would be affected.

@NekuSakuraba: I had an ID when I was 14. state-issued and looked just like a driver's license.

also? good on them for not selling you the game if you're only 15. don't complain about someone actually doing their job for once =P

@Zorantor: I think the ratings are more a guide anyway. I too played mortal kombat as a kid, as well as plenty of other hyper-violent games.

so long as the parent looks at WHY the game is rated the way it is, no harm done to the kid. my mom never would've let me play GTA, for instance, but GoldenEye was ok.

it's all just up to the parents, me thinks.

@NekuSakuraba: I've had a passport since I was a baby. People complain, but they end up having to accept it as a form of valid ID.

Avonej

@jojo13jojo233: It's not about Batman--it's what Joker and the others do. Plenty of cops and others get murdered.

@Cogito: Don't forget about NC-17. Right after R.

Eviltim

@eatsleepdie: It's Kotaku! Or rather Kotakustan.

@Tanneseph: True. I say they go with the ESRB ones for all of them. I have to say I am kind of partial to them at this point but that could just be because I work in the game industry :).

The ESRB works. I remember 2 times in Fred Meyer I saw a kid bring a game to his mom and she said no this is rated mature you can't have this one. The problem is when the parents don't care or the kid buys it by themselves. If a parent is looking for a rating and sees mature they know what that means

@Draco_2k: You know what they say... If pro is the opposite of con, then what's the opposite of Progress...

That's right... Government.

@Cpryd001: You send it to "tips@kotaku.com" and... I think you say "Comment of the week" in the subject line, and copy the comment you want to refer to, and a link.

@Grand_Marquis: Good point. It would be nice if the ratings were denoted by the same letters (G, PG, PG-13, R, X) and the ESRB was still responsible for assigning them, however. I just think that your usual idiot parent will respond more to a game that's "rated R" as opposed to one that's "rated M."

I'm really tired of the government constantly regulating and trying to protect the kiddies, you know what? THEY HAVE PARENTS, its their job to protect him, to keep him away from content they don't want him seeing.

Sadly we seem to live in the society of people have kids as an obligation rather than actually wanting them so we end up with bunch of idiot parents who barely pay attention to their kids but get PISSED if their little precious played a violent game or saw a violent movie.

@No cool name here... Move along: It isn't so much that we tend to have problems with the idea of "don't sell THIS to kids", as it is that "Why is it the governments job?". Is it your child? Then YOU should be controlling what comes into your household as it is.

Also, here in the US, most retailers already ID check minors for all sorts of things...you wanna visit one of those nice sex shops? ID. You wanna buy an R-rated movie? At Best Buy, at least, they carded my girlfriend. And games? ALL the retailers, as far as my experience, anyway, at least have rules on the books about ID checks, with some of them having severe penalties for doing so (ex: GameStop, which will fire you, immediately, if they find out you sold an M-rated game to a minor w/o parental approval).

An enforced rating system means that the government now sets the rules about what someone can and cannot sell, and to whom. If we are to be a free-market economy, we have to be a free-market economy. That's all.

angelbreaker

@No cool name here... Move along: I don't have a problem with game ratings, or their enforcement. As long as a store is using the game rating to prevent a minor from purchasing a game not intended for them, then I think they're doing their job.

I don't, however, feel that stores should be made, through punative laws, to enforce game ratings. Then you get stores acting the part of police, judge, and jury. A legal adult has the right to purchase any game, regardless of who is with them. My point of reference is a customer who walked into a Best Buy and was refused the opportunity to buy a video game because he had a minor in tow and the minor was a relative not his child.

I do like the idea of a universal rating system, i.e. one that uses the same symbols for each category and the same criteria for rating content. As long as technology exists to enforce content ratings, I don't think laws are necessary to.

adinnieken

@leimeisei909: I still remember when I went to see Silent Hill, there was a family with what looked to be a 2 year old, a 4 year old, a 7 year old, and a BABY... I capsed that one because in addition to the traumatized children, there would be a crying baby in the theater... Talk about insult to injury. I wanted to slap those parents.

@Cheater87:
He said if made "today", not what it was rated back when it was made.

@tetracycloide: You have educated me and I am better off for it. thank you.

GoonerVance

@Paul_Is_Drunk: "Quoting a great man, does not make you a great man"

~Abigail Adams

"At any rate" Benjamin Franklin lived the majority of his post revolution life in France and is a bit of an aristocrat and I have no time for his ideas.

EDIT: Speed Racer was only rated PG and had a kid saying "shit" and even flippin the bird. I think the ratings are used more for violence than language, which I think is a good thing.

GoonerVance

@NekuSakuraba: Oh and, let me clarify. I'm not 17, I'm 15. Now you must be thinking why did I complain about it and why am I buying an M game? ....You don't need to know. :/

NekuSakuraba just wants FRIENDS

@No cool name here... Move along: Why bother with legislation when stores already make it a policy to check? Does there really have to be some kind of law to make sure these stores don't sell directly to kids?

@No cool name here... Move along: Well, for one, we already have a system which prevents violent or sexually explicit or whatever etc items being sold directly to children.

@Kovitlac: My mom was never so picky. I remember playing Mortal Kombat in kindergarten, though now that I think of it, that was before the ESRB existed.

Still, though, I grew up playing games like MK, Doom, Duke Nukem 3D...all that fun stuff. And I came out pretty normal, I like to think.

The overly violent stuff isn't even really my cup of tea anymore, either. I'd take a Metroid or a Mario Kart over a Halo or Half-Life any day.

As someone who has to deal with implementing parental controls for media software I'd love for there to be one damn set.

commentotron

@tetracycloide: Right, "voluntary" in the sense that you're completely free to not use it, and never make any money off your film.

Tell me, when was the last time you saw an unrated, or independently rated, film in theaters? Do you think your answer is "never" because everyone thinks the MPAA is just so gosh darn swell?

@Paul_Is_Drunk: the goonies is PG rated.

Cheater87

@NekuSakuraba:
Uhh....I had a student ID ever since I was 12, then a learners permit at 15, and a license at 18. You can also get a state ID pretty much anytime.

Learn to DMV more.

Nslick

@G1bblets: Yeah, but my school doesn't get ID's (even though we take pictures for them? yeah weird...), I can't drive..yet and I can't get my State one right now.

NekuSakuraba just wants FRIENDS

@Sir Cabbage Hands: Last I knew, the US Government didn't govern the affairs of Canada.

A game intended for North America would likely contain both a rating for or by a Canadian ratings board and a US rating.

adinnieken

@Cronoedge: It seems nobody in any organization has the balls to take on the MPAA

@NekuSakuraba: Driver's license, school ID, State ID the list goes on and on there buddy. I'm 17 yet I still get M games.

@NekuSakuraba: I had a student ID when I was 14, and I had a drivers licence when I was 16.

adinnieken

It drove me crazy as a kid, but thank God my dad was actually a parent and watched what I would play. I'd get away with a few M-rated games, but only those which he had seen or read about and felt comfortable letting me and my younger brother play (Halo, Psi-Ops, Fatal Frame, etc).

Of course now I'm plenty old enough to play what I want. But even so, I really have no urge to play games like Counter Strike or GTA. Not that they're bad - they simply don't interest me.

Kovitlac

@Nitrokart knows CPR and took that guy's wallet: Not to mention that on any movie you buy, the rating is on the back, near the bottom, in such tiny print that I actually find myself having to search for it. Whereas for a game, it's right there on the front, plenty large.

I'm not suggesting that movies make it huge or even put it on the front, blocking the coverart. But at least in large enough print on the back that I don't have to squint to see it... that'd be at least a little more fair.

Kovitlac

@Cogito: HA! If they even try to use the letters, the MPAA will sue their ass.

And that's the last thing we need - a ratings board with a monopoly.

@Paul_Is_Drunk: Preach it, brother

The thing I truly despise about the ESRB is that they make M rated games 17+. So you walk into Gamestop, take example the time I went to buy Killer7. The lady asked me for an ID and of course I do not have one because you can't get an ID until your 18!

....WHAT. /end rant. Sorry everyone.

NekuSakuraba just wants FRIENDS

Wouldn't that screw up Canada since we we different rating systems for movies and such.

I've never understood why the video game industry can't just use the MPAA rating system. Everyone knows it, so people wouldn't have to relearn yet another new system. So long as the clerks of stores check ID (like they're supposed to, no matter the rating system), I think it would keep parents much better informed, and at least remove one of the common excuses regarding game ratings.

@icepick314: Wait didnt one country already have the ratings color coded?

@GoonerVance: "Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."

~Benjamin Franklin

At any rate, I'm sick of the claims that regulations are getting loser, just so they can make regulations stronger. The Goonies, a classic from my childhood, was a G rated movie that little kids using the word "shit" a handful of times.

If The Goonies were made today, it would be a PG-13 movie.

Paul_Is_Drunk

@Moral_Avenger:

Maybe not PG, but I would bet that if Halo was made into a movie with the content it had there would be a high chance of PG-13. The gore in it was pretty much alien colored blood, which allows a movie to get leeway as it's not human blood. So there is disparity.

VXXXJesterXXXV

As ever when one of these articles pop up, all the Americans are up in arms about their constitutional rights and how "it's the parents' responsibility, the government should keep out of it".

Could someone please explain to me (I'm from the UK) a valid reason why an enforced rating system which prevents violent or sexually explicit (or whatever other hangups a society might have) items being sold directly to children is such a terrible thing?

Please note that the keyword there was directly. If you think your kids can handle GTA4, there's nothing to prevent you from buying it for them. All it means is that there has to be some sort of adult supervision to the act of purchasing it. It's not foolproof by any means, but to my mind that is putting the parents in control.

So they want to converge TV, Cell Phones and Video game Ratings, but leave out Movies? Whats the matter? No one at the fcc has the balls to take on the Movie industries rating system.

Cronoedge

@kilikafinal:
If you buy it at Walmart it comes with porn xD

@zgreenwell:
'LOL the books have detailed descriptions of there content most of the times and shops have them by genre or age range so i dont think theres a mess there.
The only polluting books are vampire teen novels.-.-
"Why cant you be more like Edward?"
F*ck him a real man .

@BillyTheRatKing: Eww it has been done Atlantis now there all in hell playing Eco the Dolphin forever.

@GoonerVance: but the government cannot legally enforce the ratings system. the precedent established in the courts of the US is not only that access to content may only be denied in cases of blatent obsenity but that the threshold for what is considered obscene varies from jurisdiction to jurisdiction. a national standard for game ratings imposed by the US governemnt is a legal impossibility that would never stand up to scrutiny in a court of law. that's why voluntary ratings organisations like the ESRB and MPAA are both independant and non-compulsory.

you suggest that there is no incentive for a game publisher to pay the ESRB in the same way a movie producer pays the MPAA but there is. a movie without an MPAA rating will be a difficult sell in theaters and thus the purchase of an MPAA rating is value addative. it is much the same with games as you yourself point out since if a game bares no rating at all many parents might be disinclined to purchase it out of the fear it contains content they might find inappropriate.

How do people in congress not see the parallels of what they are doing now and censorship from the past that is so heavily scrutinized in present day? They should stay the fuck out my life when it comes to anything censorship related for myself and my future kids. This goes for video games, movies, even porn in my opinion.

runandgun

"whether the laws need to be changed to protect children".

I love how some people are ignorant enough to think this. Some parents use the rating systems, I'll admit it, but how many exactly? If you go into a Rated R movie, you'll still see kids there. On the gaming side of things, one round of COD4 will reveal that an M rating probably actually makes it more likely that little kids will have purchased the game, via their parents or an older brother.

That's why these regulation discussions are a hideous waste of everyone's time.

leimeisei909

@eatsleepdie: ya let's all go to The U.S.S.R!!

I understand why universal -anything- is eyed with massive scrutiny, and agree that it ought to be. But frequently we overlook the most important issue with universal anything: we are used to any of these things being of poor quality. I'm not opposed to universal ratings if a) they are informative (which will of course requires some flexibility... probably destroying the "universal" part), and b) they are primarily used as an information source, and not as a method of undue restriction.

I really think the ESRB serves as a strong model in this direction. I read more of the bullet-point "why" list next to the rating than the actual rating. Movies don't have that, though the information is usually available elsewhere. TV touches on this feature on some of its more extreme programming.

The only place the ESRB may have backfired is the AO rating. AO ought to behave like a Mature rating, only more strongly informing the parent that this is probably not appropriate for their minors. Instead, since Walmart won't carry AOs, it just means your game won't be sold.

Anyway, my point is that the ESRB's ratings don't cause nasty restrictions, really, and just inform. They are helpful, not controlling. So, universal ratings that behave in a similar fashion would simply unify the language, instead of having to be able to understand multiple, separate sets of ratings doing the same thing. Unless there are more heinous plans out there for this that I'm unaware of.

Tanneseph

@qwerty: enforcing morality is all government ever does. it is indeed their only purpose.

@sandmanfvrreturns: wow, where to begin. for starters the MPAA movie ratings are 100% voluntary, they are not enforced by law in most jurisdictions in the US. the only exception are NC-17 films which would frequently fall under laws that govern the sale of pornographic material to minors.

second, game companies are private institutions and their products are their own. freedom of speech does not apply because it's not a public venue.

@BillyTheRatKing: How about Otoh Gunga?

'360 Fanboy

Let's create an underwater city in which video games can be free of government scrutiny! We'll call it Rupture! Wait a second, that sounds familiar...

Adults watch their own kids! Not the government. A universal rating system would not enhance anything. Bad parents will still be bad parents!

@Ashkihyena: Yeah, I definitely didn't condone the government censoring everything. By the way, where was all this anti-censorship sentiment when that Seven Days in Fallujah(?) game got canned. Yeah, I know it was a "company" decision, which really means they got pressured by special interest groups until they decided it was less disruptive just to cancel the entire project, but in the end, it's still the loud cries of the few affecting the lives of the majority. Which essentially is the same thing as the government (the few) censoring the many (us), except at least in the government's case we have the choice to vote these idiots out of office every 2, 4, or 6 years.

GoonerVance

@Nitrokart knows CPR and took that guy's wallet: I agree with you and if parents can't understand the ESRB they shouldn't be parents in the first place.

They should include books in a universal rating. Everyone knows those novels out their are created to pollute the minds of our children anyway.

@Nitrokart knows CPR and took that guy's wallet:
Somebody vote this comment of the week! I can never remember how when I want to. Even searched for it... there needs to be a Kotaku FAQ.

The ESRB need to be forced BY LAW like the movie ratings. Not let kids buy M games. But this is something I hate: Console companies Sony, MS and Nintendo refuse to let AO games on their consoles. huh? That to me a violation of freedom of speech. What needs to happen is the ESRB be federal law and enforced in any store that sells them. Then also mandate to the main 3 console companies as long as they have consoles in the US, any game from E to AO is fine as the ratings are enforced and refusing to put a game out violates US law. It goes both ways to me.

sandmanfvrreturns

@Skyman747: They could have made it M but then Batmans one rule would be broken.

jojo13jojo233

@icepick314: As long as they rate them on how much controversy they get, Mass Effect rated code orange for whiny fox news teams.

jojo13jojo233

Quit sticking your nose where it's not wanted government.

Compulsory ratings are primary a First Amendment issue if government done. It's a Fifth (due process) if a third party like ESRB is mandated.

sqlrob

@Showmeyomoves!: Huh. Butt seks, eh?

@GoonerVance: Still doesn't mean that Government should censor everything as well. Sorry, but this "for the children" BS doesn't fly.

I don't know about you, but I don't think the ESRB rating system is trusted, understood or even vaguely logical. I discovered yesterday that in-touch, technology using gaming parents can be confused about the rating system.

I think we are taking entirely the wrong approach to game ratings. A game rating should absolutely mention if there's swearing, nudity or excessive gore (its not even worth putting "Mild cartoon fantasy violence" in there anymore, ok?!) but I think more importantly it should tell you what age the game is suited for. For example, if the game has a complex political plot or marriages, relationships etc. a younger kid probably won't understand the game, let alone enjoy it, and that will be a lot more useful for game shoppers than limiting sales of a game because it has alcohol reference, mild language, mild fantasy violence and "suggestive themes".

@puffa469: I'd watch what you wish for when saying fuck the FCC. They're a lot like the ACLU, you don't always like what they're up to, but they generally serve to help the general populace. This current FCC has just recently vowed to uphold Net Neutrality, and that's pretty damned fantastic.

@Skyman747: Just wait. In a few years we'll have kids who're bat-fuck insane because of Scarecrow. Next thing you know, we got guys scaling Buckingham Palace.

Lt. Archer

@subnet6: No, not really. The ESRB is great. Easy to understand ratings on the front, and informative content descriptions on the back. (You know, you can ask the store employee to get the game out from behind the glass so you can read the content descriptions.) The movies don't have that. Besides, movies can go unrated, games can't. If anything, movies should be rated by the ESRB.

Besides, anyone who can't understand what "M for Mature", with "Mature 17+" written above means, shouldn't have kids.

@dnadns: We have a similar system for movies in the Netherlands. From left to right:

Violence / Sex / Fear / Drug and alcohol abuse / Discrimination / Strong language

I'm partial to the icon indicating Sex. For some reason it took me a while before I got it...

Showmeyomoves!

First of all, the government has no right or need to protect The Children. They have Parents that should protect Their Children. It's very easy to understand the game ratings (more so than the movie ones). Look on the front: "E for Everyone or "M for Mature." Then, you look on the back and it has warnings about the game's content. If some parents can't understand this concept, then too bad. Maybe they should inform themselves better and look out for their little Jimmy instead of putting that responsibility into the hands of the gov't, who have no idea how to do much of anything. But guess what? The gov't isn't a babysitter!

Second, what the hell are cellphone ratings? Is it that a typo? Is it cellphone GAMES that will be rated? Oh yeah, this cellphone has Mature content. You must be over 18 to use this cellphone. LOL

I think the movie ratings system needs a major overhaul, though. Make it more like the ESRB. Games can't go on unrated, yet movies can. Ratings can be deceiving on movies. They don't have the content descriptions on the back. And yet, FOR SOME REASON, people still blame video gamers for the "destruction of Our Youth." Really? What about the R-rated movies that are released on DVDs unrated which even more inappropriate (and pointless) content?

@qwerty: The ratings system wouldn't have any teeth if the govt. didn't enforce it. So who would enforce them then? A private company? How would a private company make enough money to operate by imposing an arbitrary ratings system. The Motion Pictures Association (or w/e they're called) have been around since the beginning of movies and require fees in order for your movie to get made. There would be no reason for the gaming industry to all of a sudden adopt some newly created random entity and start paying fees to that same entity in order for them to be regulated and told what they can and can not do. Even if a regulatory body could be created out of thin air, independent from the government, with the EAs and Activisions of the world I wouldn't trust the system. As if EA wouldn't have their hand in the cookie jar in order to get a more favorable rating for one of their games.

GoonerVance

@puffa469: I sort of agree with you, but there is no way in hell that an M rated game is comparable to a PG rated movie.

You're right about an AO game being the same as an R movie, though, in some instances, like when the last-gen Punisher game almost got an AO rating or Manhunt 2.

Moral_Avenger

@TookiGuy:

There's a great quote in the movie 'Scream'. "Movies don't create psychos, movies make Pyschos more creative!"

I think the sentiment applies to games as well.

@No I wouldn't like tea and crumpets:

Close.

"TV, video games and cell phones"

cell phones?

do i have to be 16 or older to buy an iphone?

kilikafinal

"congressional inquiries"

NO, NO, NO.

It has to be *scientific* inquiries. Get your personal opinions out of the court!

@TookiGuy: I only keep myself from raping people because it's illegal. I mean if it wasn't, well... I'm quite sure it'd happen a lot more often.

I've played the most violent games, and seen most of the worst the internet has to offer, and I've never even been in a fight before. Not even close, actually, because I'm pretty non-violent.

Although I do really love extremely violent and gory video games... maybe they're my only suppression and the only thing stopping me from becoming a serial rapist murdering scumbag?

I don't want to see universal ratings if it means that TV shows and video games will be subjected to the same smoke and mirrors routine that happens to movies.

As it is now, two very similar movies can be given two very different ratings, say from R to PG-13, with little to no reasoning behind them.

We often hear about directors or producers appealing to the ratings board to get the rating of a movie toned down, and sometimes it is granted seemingly based on who it is.

All the problems over Manhunt 2 would have been 10x worse, and all given with no justification.

@GoonerVance: Did I say there should be no rating system? I think I just said government shouldn't be the one to try and enforce rating laws.

Universal Ratings: sure

Mandatory or compulsory ratings: No way!

Universal ratings could help videogames, as right now the standards on game content are harsher. Content that gives a games a Mature rating would only garner a movie a PG rating. AO game content is routinely seen in R rated films.

I do understand that films are not a part of this initiative, but the double standard between games and film still exists.

And finally: FUCK THE FCC!

@seo_ace: That's ridiculous! There can't be thought police! That's violating my first amend-

*End Transmission*

SuperSonik

Your tax dollars at work, people. Taylor couldn't have said it better and it bears repeating:

"Universal ratings... are a solution in search of a problem".

Thank your congressmen personally when they come to kiss your town's babies.

SuperSonik

@Save me: LG Cookie?

This appears to be a power grab by the FCC. They probably want to inch in on the movie industry which has handled their own rating system sans the government since early on, but they do not have precedence to win anything from the movie industry so they are gaining rationality. If the FCC gains control over video games or movies then our first amendment rights are in jeopardy as they are notorious for bans and other types of rights violations.

mrgregs

Well i suppose the bureaucrats need something to justify their continued existence and paychecks. It's not like there's anything else wrong in the country they might be able to try and fix.

@saulpimpson:

I could think of one phone that would be rated D for tools, sheep and douches.

@qwerty: You heard of grey area? This is grey area. If you want your country to be safe sometimes you have to deal with overzealous enforcement of morality. If we all put our two cents in I bet none of us could come to a clear consensus on where the line between morality and freedom of choice actually lies. By the way don't extend my argument to torturing terrorists and whatnot, I'm only talking about forms of entertainment here.

I guess the gaming industry would rather there be no rating system at all and then parents wouldn't buy video games out of fear that they may be inappropriate for their kids.

GoonerVance

WTB [Responsible Parenting] pst

John Trelow

There's a common misconception that showing kids violent stuff will make them go nuts.

You know, I was exposed to both violent and pornographic stuff in my childhood. Repeatedly.
And I consider my compulsions to be quite ordinary.
You don't make kids psychos by exposing them to violent imagery, you do it by making them IGNORANT.
You don't tell them "Don't kill people." You tell them WHY you shouldn't kill people.
You don't keep yourself from raping some because you weren't exposed to stuff in your childhood, you do it because you understand the person has rights. You understand that you wouldn't want it to be done to you.

Honestly I don't even begin to understand why this is necessary. The tools for parent to understand what content their children are viewing is easily accessible. Just look at the ESRB's review of games on their website. It describes everything in almost perfect detail. From the review of WET

"In one cutscene, a nurse wipes her mouth as she rises from a kneeling position in front of a man's lap. No sexual activity is depicted, but it can be inferred that she performed fellatio on the man."

If that isn't enough information to keep a parent informed I don't know what is.

If they are arguing the fact that too many rating systems is confusing then these people shouldn't even be having kids. If Teen: 13+ is to complicated for you to understand then please don't be procreating.

The larger part of the problem would be that parents just don't care what their kids see and don't take the time to talk about the content they are viewing. How about spending some of that time and energy on actually parenting and not just blaming the ratings system.

@subnet6: That's the only thing I do like about our USK ratings in Germany. They come with a simple number (-,6,12,16,18) and if your age is below that number, it's not for you.

On the other hand, I do also appreciate the PEGI approach of telling why a rating was given -> "comic violence,...etc.".
Especially for those parents you mentioned that have no idea what is inside a game.

Governments trying to enforce morality never end well.

@mooglegiant, @eatsleepdie:
you two are sick sick sick!!!

and yet i can't stop laughing.....

as long as we get easy color codes like Homeland Security terror alert, i'm all for it!!

No, thank you. While I think that, at the very least, the rating system for the movie industry needs an overhaul (more transparency, etc) I will continue to believe that ratings should be privatized and not government-controlled. I think that it would be a violation of first amendment rights and an easy path to stringent censorship of all mediums. I, for one, like the ESRB and praise them for what they have done with their website--detailing exactly why a game would receive a rating. It let's parents know what they need to know to make the right decision for their children.

@xguile: I was so happy when I found out it was T. I think the fact that batman doesn't "kill" the victims, just knocks them unconscious might have been what saved it.

Skyman747

@subnet6: But they have content their kid shouldn't be exposed to at that age. It's quite straightforward actually, what do these parents get confused about exactly? Legit question, I'm not being an asshole.

@tralfaz23: Thoughtcrime detected! Members of thinkpol have been dispatched to your location. Please sit there patiently.

I don't think this is a good idea. There's a distinct difference between a game and a movie which would make having a rating like PG-13 for a game ridiculous. I'm fine with the ESRB ratings as they are, and I don't favor the assimilation into a universal rating system.

@mooglegiant: I taste nothing wrong with it either.

eatsleepdie

Mike Dukakis loves gamers and video games! Vote Dukakis!

This message is approved by Michael Dukakis*

*Not really.

I say fuck the FCC. Mostly because, at least for now, I still can say it. Goddamn censors, leave us alone!

MechaTama31

@AngryEddy: I see nothing wrong with cannibalism.

I wish we could live in a totalitarian state where only a few select elite could decide what people can and can't see do an say.

eatsleepdie

I don't really care about ratings but anyone else think it's amazing that Batman: AA was rated T and not MA? The gore is kept to a minimum but the physical/psychological violence is pretty dramatic. Love the game though.

I wish the ratings system was the same as they use for Movies. I think it would help legitimize the industry as well as make a parents job easier. I think everyone understands G, PG, PG13, R, XXX etc (and I'm assuming their are equivalents in other countries that are just as commonly understood). Using "M" for mature is incredibly confusing to the parents I talk to. As a gamer and a parent, I have no problem making gaming decisions, but most parents are NOT gamers and have no idea what "m" mature means in games. Particularly because "mature" games are generally the most immature.

most importantly how could you possibly have a rating system that rates movies, video games and cell phones?

Rated R for nudity, blood and gore, and short battery life.

would somebody tell the government to stop being the morality thought police

@AngryEddy:
Won't somebody PLEASE think of the children!
/Simpsons

It's always about "the children", isn't it? Because opposing what's best for The Children makes you a bad person. Well...that and cannibalism.