Bull. This will be more like $200 to $250 market price for at least the first few months.

DMBainbridge

Upgrading is still to expensive, since in my case it means buying a new motherboard, RAM and CPU as well.

Also, how good is this card? It just looks to me like they're releasing their midrange part of this series first. There have been cheaper "x"600s for every line nVidia has come out with. This honestly doesn't seem any different from what they've been doing for years.

Luziphir

@Delano_J:

Is this the new "Will it blend?"

"Can it Crysis?"

Pretty catchy, actually.

man_in_gauze

It's a good card and anyone looking to build a rig on the cheap should consider it. hardocp has it beating the ATI HD 8370 in all the tests although it is a slightly overclocked model. Nothing you couldn't do with the stock model.[enthusiast.hardocp.com]

I know some people don't like hardocp but I believe they have the best gpu testing methods by far. Tomshardware and Anandtechs gpu benchmarks are from what I gather from the community not very reliable.

Although if you can find a good deal on the 8800gt go for that instead. Since it is still better especially at higher resolutions.

And guys don't be loyal to a certain brand that's just stupid. Who ever makes the best products at the most competitive prices should get your money. My rig used to be AMD and ATI and now its Intel and Nvidia best products get my money simple.

FtGF

@Irenicus-the one and only:

haha i (kind of) understand what you are getting at. I think you need not worry however. I think from their point of view the best thing would be to keep the PC gaming industry alive so that they can sell to a wider audience.

jrghoull

@cybereality: Nope, and I wouldn't hold my breath. The next big thing is the 9800GX2 as mentioned above (by me).

Also, don't count on a 9600GTS/GTX let alone more performance from that than a 8800GT/GTS-512. The specs simply don't cut it as there is zero new technology involved in the current and to-come 9-series.

Even the "new" flagship will consist of two 8800 G92 cores ;)

Candlejack

@Patient: Yeah me too! I've got 2 evga 8800gts for an SLI setup waiting in my newegg cart. I looked at some benchmarks and the 8800gts is still a superior card in many respects. But I might hold out for a 9600GTX/GTS is it becomes available soon. Anyone know the ETA on the high end 9xxx series cards?

cybereality

@Phantom_Photon: Yes, true. But PC enthusiasts value the superior graphics that come to show about 2 years after console launch, lastest.

Candlejack

@Phantom_Photon: 18 months? jesus no wonder you think its a waste.

Flawless101

$169 - $189 every 18 months for a graphics card

vs

$400 - $500 every 4 years for a console

And that's JUST the graphics card. Honestly, if you are going to game seriously on a PC, it's going to cost you at minimum a new $1500 - $2000 system every 2 years. It's nice companies are trying to bring PC gaming closer to the mainstream, but it's still far too expensivve.

(And before anyone breaks out the whole "but the PC can do so much more than just game" argument: If you buy a PC for everything BUT gaming, it will last you on average 4 - 5 years at a cost of $800 - $1200.)

Phantom_Photon

@Shijirou:

You are right. If they make a good cheap proc as well, I might have to convert to PC gaming for the first time ever. I always keep a PC handy but costs mean It is usually behind consoles power wise. N-vidia might just be saving the PC games market from certain death here...

EdwinJ85

My gawd and i was looking at PNY's GX card ...lol so basically the question for this graphic card is that can it play Crysis's insane graphics with out lags and low resolution...and will it go any cheaper..lol

OtakuHat

Awesome, I'll pick it up when it goes under $100. Yes, because I do find over $150 far too expensive.

SSJPabs

Why are they releasing a new video card so soon? The 8800 GT still rips every game (besides Crysis and HellFate) a new one..

Voteforme2020

Gives Me more incentive to build my own PC

MXs219

@EdwinJ85: ATI is still generous to the AGP market but nVidia hasn't released an AGP model since the 7000 series. It's a two-plus year old interface so it shouldn't come as a big surprise.

I like nVidia's strategy on this one, releasing the mid-market card first. I've read reports that it under-preforms the 8800GT by 30 to 15%-- not bad at all considering it costs about half as much.

I am disappointed that the new 9000 series doesn't seem to be based off of any new technology though. I haven't followed graphics cards specifically for a very long time, so I don't know if this has been done before but I know it's being done now. I currently have an 8800GTS 640 and have no intention to upgrade to any 9800 model for a while, not until it's version of the 8800GT rolls out.

Absent Blue

Where are our DisplayPort cards?
Why can't they make a card that is q u i e t?
B-stards..both nVidia and ATI/AMD...

SigmundTheSeaMonster

Are they making any of these for AGP boards?

I imagine not. :(

EdwinJ85

This is basically for those who would normally buy an 8600GT. The 8600 underperforms a lot, and is more of a low-end card than the mid-end card that it should be. I see the 9600GT as nvidia correcting their mistake.

Nayl

@Asper:

the 9600 is worst than your 8800 anyway

Waza

@Asper: Its fine. Toms had the whole chart, 8800 GT still rocks the 9600.

Now, if you had a 8400 or any previous generation, the 9600 is mighty fine upgrade.

I wish they would stay away from the 9.xxx, it clashes with the once-flgaship series of ATI.

Fyren

@magic_envelope: triple sli 8800 ultras! that should do the trick :P and also kill you bank ;)

necrozim

Bah, come on Nvidia, bring out something ludicrously expensive! My 8800gtx is 14 months old and I fancy an upgrade :)

in5ane

I think it's a pretty damn good deal the 9600 is the mid range card with a mid range price. It's performance is just below the 8800 so I'm pretty excited to see how the 9800 turns out.

incazteca

$169-189? Reasonable I suppose. But will it run Crysis.

xiphos

Bold new territory indeed. My first reaction when the 9600 GT popped up on specialized websites was: "Did I somehow miss the 9800 ?" And reviews aren't half bad, too! Sure, it's no top-of-the-line, but for most users, the 9600 is more than enough to upgrade their PC without ruining themselves.
Shame there hasn't been anything for me on the PC since BioShock and The Witcher...

And after this our exile

specifications are near identical to the 8800gt~ I wonder how it fares out in performance?

iRloading

@jpelles:

No offense, but a $20 case? a $30 power supply?

How long do you want that computer to last, anyway? The Fry's near me is like a big garage sale. They sell those crappy 100 dollar CPU/mobo combos using ECS motherboards to sucker in cheapass system builders who don't know better. ECS makes the 360 look like a bastion of reliability.

Good computers cost real money. They're just like everything else.

SeeOne

Perhaps you people should read some reviews of the 9600GT. All it is is a gpu based off of the G92 architecture aka the 8800 GT and the new 8800 GTS. It is much slower than the 8800 GT so quit worrying just because nvidia threw a 9xxx card on the market. The 9 series is just the 8xxx but with smaller transistors.

fumar

Whoa! I have evga 8800GTS in the "Cart" at Newegg.com. I think I'll wait a bit and see how this turns out.

Patient

And here I am, stuck with PCI.

C'est la vie. At least there are some 6 series PCI cards on the market now.

justhesh

@Eltigro:
i hate VERY MUCH those ugly arts that are printed in the videocard boxes and now even in the videocards themselves... The one that was reviewed by Tom's Hardware actually had a very clean look.

anyway... who cares about the appearance of something that is inside our case?

carbonelli

This card isn't any new tech yet. It is just a die shrink with some improvements of the G80 core. Just like the 8800 GT (G92). Nvidia needs to be able to make money and the money is made on the mainstream market and OEM's. This card is supposed to help raise the amount of chips they get from a single wafer, with the 8800 cards that number isn't as high as they want it to be. Which is why there were shortages.

nox

@Usama:
They just released some benchmarks regarding the 9600GT in SLI.. I have to admit, I'm incredibly impressed. They scale amazingly well. So much so, that it's almost unbelievable.
Heres the link:

[translate.google.com]

relic2279

@Codexx: 9600GT is most certainly not going to be the high-end card.. but if it drops to a cheaper price in a few months it will be a VERY attractive card for SLI setup (assuming the 8800GT doesn't also drop)

Usama

I'm so glad I got my 8800GT for $192 (tax included!), or I would've been upset about this 9600GT coming out. This would've been the appropriate upgrade from my 7600GT. Oh well, worked out OK.

Usama

So now I CAN get 2 GeForce 9 series cards.

Wonderful. Now to compare the specs.

So what? Is the 9600 the high end card? Or what. I don't want to get a cheap card at a cheap price only to find out some higher number like 9800 or 9900 is WAY better for 3 times as much or something.

Codexx

The real question is...

What kind of terrible art will grace the box? I'm putting money on either a robot of some kind or a wild animal.

Eltigro

@Candlejack: I heart ATI :)I love my x1950 pro

Irenicus-the one and only

My power supply right now is 850 Watts and cost me $50. It was on sale at Frys. Great deal.

Anyway, the CPU was Intel Core 2 Duo E6750 2.66 ghz.

These prices are ones you have to look for though. But places like Fry's and MircoCenter have great deals all the time.

jpelles

Also, another site to check out for these sub-$200 cards:
HD3870 vs 9600GT: [anandtech.com]

Arttemis

@Candlejack: Yeah, I wanted to point that out in a few posts above that the HD3870 got a huge price drop to sub-$200.

This is all really good news, especially for me due to the fact that I'm still using my AGP Radeon X800XT and need to upgrade everything for my next computer... heh.

Arttemis

The common tip they give all the people on the pc hardware reviewers is that you should wait a year or two before update your hardware, by that time everything drop its price a lot...

TOCATL

@Arttemis: Nah, I meant the advantage. However, I'd choose the HD3870 any day over it.

@OneFreeMan: Fine. Can we agree the HD3870 is weaker on average than the 8800GT-512MB? Yes, we can.

Taken from the same review: "As can be seen clearly, STALKER and Age of Empires III are the exceptions: the only games for which the GeForce 9600 GT managed to edge the HD 3870. In all the other cases, the HD 3870 was fairly clearly ahead of its rival, with spreads of 13 to 15% with Call of Duty 4 and World In Conflict, and smaller ones with Unreal Tournament 3 and Supreme Commander."

Conclusion? 8800GT-512MB > HD3870 > 9600GT.

Also, just looking at the spec sheets of the two cards, it is clear which card has more raw power. [www.tomshardware.com]

Candlejack

@Candlejack: "it is way inferior"
It's 15% less performance on a card gives more than a 15% price discount.

Also, my remark about the 256MB version of the 8800GT was directed toward the remark you made about 10FPS. I thought you were saying the card was only able to handle 10 FPS, when that happened to the 8800GT 256MB, instead of meaning a 10FPS advantage for the 8800GT 512MB.

That being said, I still say it's an amazing card for it's far below $200 price.

Arttemis

I love how ATi and Nvidia name their graphics cards :)

ABigSmall

@Candlejack:
10FPS in a GPU-intense game like Crysis are saying A LOT.

Uhh, no. That actually says very little. It's one data point. Show me benchmarks and numbers across a variety of titles at a variety of settings. Then we'll talk about whether the card is "way inferior."

OneFreeMan

It also might be interesting for those who don't know that AMD/ATi dropped the price of the HD 3870, which has a very slight lead on many games, to $190.

Both seem like winners for those short on cash and looking to upgrade to an acceptable card for this year's games on not-the-worst settings.

Arttemis

@Arttemis: Yes...so? I was saying the 8800GT is more powerful, as you can see in the benches. It should be obvious that I'm comparing 512MB to 512MB models, right?

Candlejack

@PATSCRU: There also were 7800GT, 7800GTX, 6800GT....you get the idea. Usually the x900 is a newer revision of the x800 model, often using smaller chip architecture. We have not yet seen this with the 8800 series, as their revision, the 8800GT & 8800GTS-512 (G92), are not called that.

However, there will be a 9800GX2, which will have two 8800GTS-512 chips on one PCB.

Candlejack

@Candlejack: WTF are you talking about? [www.tomshardware.com]

The only card to get single digits on that review was the 256MB 8800GT.

Arttemis

awesome. I'm definitely geting this.

Hylian

@negative bro:

I know, I was being sarcastic, LOL. On Newegg that specific card has listed under it for "also purchased" a nice 700+W PSupply.

I could justify spending $200 for a graphics card. I can't justify spending another 150 or so for a decent Psupply just to run it. Part of the reason I dislike PC's. Its one thing to upgrade item X. Its another entirely to upgrade Item Y so you can upgrade item X.

SnakeCL

Yup....good to know that the gpu companies are starting to shoot for great products at middle of the road prices....ATI did a great job with the HD3870, which is now at newegg for $189, and now this...it's all good news

one more thing, why is everyone assuming that there would be a 9800....wouldn't it be a 9900, as there was a 7900 a few generations back?

PATSCRU

@Interwebs: No pal. It is way inferior. [images.tomshardware.com]

10FPS in a GPU-intense game like Crysis are saying A LOT.
They might as well have called the card 8700GT.

Candlejack

9600GT is the Midrange Card :/ , thought it's only slightly slower than the 8800GT, it makes me wonder about the 9800 series release?

Interwebs

@Asper: Don't get this wrong. The 9600GT is less powerful than your card. I assure you ;)

Candlejack

@BobbyMcPresscott: I'm sorry but PC is not a console, no one can own it, so please no special motherboard that can't be upgraded for 5 years time to match consoles life span. What you need is a 360 or ps3.

So hold it there messiah, you are not needed in PC gaming, I play PC and doing fine, go save the poor or someone who needs it.

Irenicus-the one and only

@magic_envelope:
Yes, there is. At 1024x768.

I hope that prices for high-end cards will drop in this generation though. $650 for a single piece of hardware can feel a little bit ridiculous no matter how powerful/long-lasting it is.

Here's waiting for a 9800GT/GTS/GTX/whatever.

cqdemal

Everyone should check out Anandtech's review from a view days ago.
This card sells for sub-$200 and it's quite competitive to the 8800GT.

[anandtech.com]

Arttemis

@Spartan1308: Yes, that too. But then it won't match the 9600 price.

wicko

The 9600GT uses the same family chip set as the 8800s, just that it got less stream processors, so its really more of a 8600GT revision, just a little bit below the 8800GT in graphical power. the price point is pretty good too starting around $170.

OmegaKulu

@BobbyMcPresscott: Arbitrarily drop? The PCI-e specification was long in the coming. Looming over AGP rather than AGP being randomly done away with.

ABigSmall

@SnakeCL: jpelles is full of shit. You can't get a $30 power supply capable of running ANY video card that was invented past 2000. I would suggest looking up newegg.com for reliability and good deals. You honestly shouldn't skimp on a good power supply because it's arguably as important as the GPU, CPU, etc. itself.

negative bro

@kuzuboshii: No they will just go roman numeral 10 bucks says Nvidia X is next.

Warik

@Asper:

i am pretty sure that 8800(GTX or NV92) will still have a edge over it.

I want to see(and only see) the high-end goodness.

carbonelli

"CPU+Motherboard combo: $100"
@jpelles:

I'm guessing that is a garbage CPU and Motherboard.

DigitalHero

@jpelles:

You can get a reliable 500W PSupply for 30 bucks?

That's pretty much what's stopping me from upgrading my rig, since I have a 7600 without a 6-pin connector. Anything newer and I need a whooole new PSupply.

SnakeCL

If all the allies follow suit, they will be very close to overcoming the severe handicaps of PC gaming.

Ya know what would heal all wounds? Uniting to create a motherboard that can last say... at least 5 years. Create a fully interchangeable backbone for computer parts. Make a world where upgrading doesn't require you to buy a whole new set of parts because the pin connections or notch locations keep changing, or because companies decide to arbitrarily drop AGP slots...

If we lived in a world where anyone could upgrade a single part without fear of throwing their money away at obsolete hardware, we would be living in a world where PC gaming decimates consoles. A world where you can upgrade your system one part at a time, without ever having to reset the whole configuration? What kind of ubertard would buy a console in that brave new world?

Oh, and if this happens I expect to be considered the messiah of the new age of computer gaming.

BobbyMcPresscott

I just purchased an 8800GTX, and I originally was flabbergasted that the next generation of cards was actually (significantly) cheaper than what I had just purchased. Then I realized it's not really the "next generation", obviously.

I think this is a great idea, can really help bring people back to the PC market, and is tailor-made for college students :-]

Barob

It's a trap, I'm telling you!

Anyway, I hope their gaming alliance dies, an alliance made up of companies all famous for monopolies working together to "save" the PC gaming is terrible. I hope it fails, and that the failure gets through to these companies that PC is an open platform and not a freaking console for gaming and DLC+DRM and getting screwed over your money is not the way to go with computers period.

I bet some don't agree but only bad things can come from it, mark my words and heed my warning or something.

Irenicus-the one and only

@wicko: or a 3870 which costs maybe 30 more than the 3850.

Spartan1308

Nvidia is going to have a HUGE problem on their hands in a very short amount of time. They are in the 9,000 with their card names. Where are they going to go next? You can't make a card called the 10800 GT, it just doesn't sound right.

Sell your stock now, they are DOOMED.

kuzuboshii

I took a good look at the reviews of this card and opted to go with an eVGA 8800 GT instead. Found it on sale for $250, and considering how it outperforms the 9600 entirely, I'm glad I did. I must admit though, I was surprised and delighted to see nvidia releasing a mid-range card for such a reasonable price.

Atheist Jew

Just looked at my Fry's ad and online real quick and came up with these numbers. Plus you can find XP for like $10 if you place a bid on Ebay, in case you don't have a copy.

Case $20
Ram 2 GB: $40
Power Supply: $30
CPU+Motherboard combo: $100
Video Card listed $169
Hard Drive $50
DVD drive $40
Total $449

jpelles

@Delano_J: lol... there isn't a graphics card on the market that is 'crysis capable' =)

not at very high settings, at least.

magic_envelope

I am definately buying this card, I don't have a lot of money being in high school so I will now be able to play spore for sure when it comes out this fall.

Balmung576

This card is slower than the 8800GT's, so don't worry if you bought one! Unless you were looking for a cheaper card, in that case you probably should have went with a 3850.

wicko

@Asper: The 8800gt is still a better card than the 9600 but only slightly. Im gonna wait for the 9800gt before i upgrade from my 8600. Funnily enough before i built a new rig my old rig had a 9800 in it....

snakepliskin

cool now i can throw away my 3Dfx Voodoo Graphics 4Mb card

Kprimed

@Delano_J: Quite capable. Just dont max the settings without throwing in more than one of these in SLI

NitrousO

Dang it Nvidia! Just when I thought I'd fully given up on PC games. Now this???

If Nvidia is doing this then probably the processor manufacturers will follow suit. *cough*intel*cough* The video card is only one part of the equation. We need a cheap and powerful processor too...

Shijirou

So is it fairly Crysis capable?

Delano_J

That is sexy.

Glare

Not to mention that 3 weeks later they release and actual upgrade which costs around 599....

jboze84

true but the rest of the cost of a good pc still adds up... bloody expensive pc's

mossberg

Right after I buy an 8800 GT. You bastards.

Asper