The Philips factory is a really nice touch. I'd certainly like to see more 'real world branding' like that. When done right, they add to the atmosphere. This is especially true with racing games like the Need for Speed series and Forza, which feature real brands like Kenwood, Momo, Hyundai, Ferrari and so forth.

Games like Grand Theft Auto can get away with the fake companies because those companies 'exist' in the Grand Theft Auto setting, and everyone who plays the GTA games aren't expecting to get a realistic experience out of the racing portions of the game. It's more fun to set things up in fictional cities like Liberty City and San Andreas because it gives the developers more leeway with the storyline and setting, in any case.

SolInvictus

Well, the example he uses in the article is one where it's a historical place they would not otherwise have access to. that is great, get the realism and get paid for it, if the advertisements become for companies who weren't around in WWII, then I'll be annoyed.

ggodo

I trust Gearbox with the use of in-game advertising. Although I can't think of any other locales to place in-game ads in a WWII game. The Philips factory is a cool idea, but where else can we see ads unless every other level is an abandoned factory. Brothers in Arms please come out soon.

Noks415

This pleases me. I always like seeing commercial advertisements in their right context. Especially pre-70s advertisements and their peculiar art style.

If it's an in-game ad that is a shameless plug for a product in return for more money, then it garners no such interest from me. Personally, the only games I have that have in-game ads are the Gran Turismo series, but I think that's for realism and the feel of the game more than anything. It's not shameless plugging.

RPharazonius

That was a very wise and thoughtful response. I completely agree with the content, and, if it turns out to be accurate, I'll fully support Gearbox. It is a slippery slope, though. Money can often affect judgement.

Then again, there is nothing wrong with synergy between companies. He's quite right that, if the money from ad revenue does go to the budget rather than then execs and shareholders, everyone will benefit in the long run.

jayntampa

Seriously though, what the heck happened to their game? What the heck happened? It was supposed to be out this time last year IIRC. And it still isn't. I don't even believe the "scheduled" release date.

To me, it's basically dead. Sorry Ubi/Gearbox, I'm not able to maintain interest in a title THAT long, especially if it's set in WW2 and using the plastic engine (UE3).

Candlejack

Nothing wrong with featuring brands, so long as it's not done in an I Robot/Blade Trinity fashion.

Jamie_W

*Waits for 1940s Intel advertisements*

RawSteelUT

Using real-life brands in games runs a fine line. If it is done right, you don't really notice, but if done incorrectly it can be very annoying.

An example of ads done right would be Crazy Taxi, it makes sense to have to take people to real-life restaurants and stores.

An example of annoying ads is EA running the same lousy 3-4 billboards promoting other EA games in one of the Burnout games (it was either Burnout 3 or Revenge).

So yeah, fighting in or near a factory that existed in the 1940's makes sense, but if they start shoehorning current brands where they don't make sense (as RawSteelUT mentioned) folks are going to complain.

randomizer9

So, in other words, the Gearbox head is full of crap.

He *says* he hates in-game ads - then stuffs BIA full of them. Historically accurate or not, ads are ads.

@jrhawk42: In-game ads ruin games. Period. No exceptions.

PooPooKaKaBumBum

I'm wondering how what appears to be a bombed out factory still has a the sign on top of the building, and in near perfect condition. They should at least like break part of the thing, or take out a letter or something, right now it looks really out of place.

boxofthegods

I highly doubt there's going to be any examples of where in-game advertising is going to ruin a game. Games with crappy in game advertising are going to suck w/ or w/out it, and good games will (hopefully) implement it well.

For example Taco Bell did not make Demolition Man a bad movie (personally I like Demolition Man, but for all the campy goodness).

jrhawk42

Here's the thing: The way in-game advertising is implemented in games now is totally blatant, and really behind the times. Advertisements has been in TV and movies (actually in the film or show, not just during commercial breaks) since the creation of the motion picture camera. They've got it down now so that advertising in this media is pretty subtle (save for MOUNTAIN DEWATRON in Transformers). The problem with in-game ads is that the ads are on fucking billboards in the middle of warzones, or that they're slapped on our virtual skateboards. They draw too much attention to themselves. If in-game ads could get to a point where they're much subtler, then guys like Pitchford wouldn't have to make excuses for why Gearbox is "synergizing" (or whatever they want to call it) with Double Fusion, because the gamers wouldn't even notice.

They need to take a lesson Advertising 101: it's all in the subliminal messaging. You can't brainwash people if you're telling them you're going to brainwash them, Pitchford. Come on. I mean, come on.

peAr_nectAr

This is the kind of in-game advertising I have no problem with. As long as it's theme-relative it's fine. In this case it wouldn't even be so bad if they put in modern companies as long as they advertised them in a style from the period. That much is cool.

IT's the dreaded word "targeted" that's my bugbear. Anything that tracks your browser activity or scans your hard drive in order to upload information to a 3rd party is spyware. Glad to hear no mention of it in this article!

Dajmin

Nice! If all the advertising is this well done, I will be very happy.

Erwin

You said it! I really wish they would just start saying tentative dates instead of using the words "release date". Just even typing that out I felt like, ok this is when they are expecting to do something with the game but I'm not going to hold my breath.

I don't think the advertising thing is really a bad thing. I think if they implemented some sort of extras that the company would provide paying for, such as extra content sponsored by x company the game ad stuff wouldn't be so frowned upon. I like additional content in games even if it has some companies logo on a car or what ever, but if we are looking at the ads in game the ad companies should want to make us happy with their advertising ways. (:

Grape-Drink

Sounds like it was damn reasonable ad placement to me. I really think theres nothing wrong with ad placement when it fits correctly.

Volomon

@PooPooKaKaBumBum: Yeah I really don't think that seeing sports logos on the sidelines in EA Soccer did that game any harm.

Huxleyhobbes

I don't mind advertising in-game as long as it doesn't disturb the game experience. For instance, the Diesel and Gillette vans in Burnout Paradise don't offend me in the slightest, especially since I can drive into them at 150mph- I'll only become outraged when the game is held up by an advert or something like that which detracts from the experience as a whole.

dannyb0y

Well this one is really a nice ad, that i've no problems with (unlike Dodge/Nivea/Wrigley's Airways in your friggin face ads, from Ubisoft games :( )

neojam

In game adds don't bother me as long as they fit. Rainbow Six Vegas adds don't really bother me, because they're movie posters in malls, where adds would be in real life anyways (every vehicle in the game being a Dodge on the other hand is another story). But a Philips factory, in WWII...? Oh wait, I just wikipedia-ed Philips, kind of cool part of WWII history. But how many people know that? I immediately thought of plasma TVs...

I see peAr_nectAr's point. The problem is, as a developer, you can track what players focus on and where players look while they play. This is one of the ways in-game "real estate" is sold to advertisers. The developers can guarantee the add companies that the players will look at their adds and can even estimate how long the adds will be looked at.

And CandleJack is right, there's a difference between hype excitement, and worried concern when a game is repeatedly delayed, especially if it's the studio's debut on the current gen consoles.

Kickinstuff13

I'm a bit torn on this one. One one hand I really fucking hate in-game ads and the worst example so far for me has been in the Battlefield: Bad Company beta. You can't go 2 meters in that game without running into a indestructible billboard or ad-supporting sign that, while empty right now, will be full of obnoxious AXE and INTEL ads soon enough. On the other hand ads that fit the era, style and consistency of the map in BIA might not be so bad since the advertisers will be forced to to go back to an old style and actually TRY one hopes.

Grey_Fox

@peAr_nectAr:
Mountain Dewatron?

I feel that in-game advertising shouldn't really be advertising, but just the presence of brands. Like the can that the Combine soldier in Half-Life 2(this one:
[hlcomic.com]
[hlcomic.com])

If that had a Coke logo or something on it, fine with me, as long as it wasn't the only brand in the game.

man_in_gauze

This old chestnut rears it's ugly head again. In-game advertising is here to stay, and as the medium grows in the space it'll become less and less obvious. There won't be "Intel" ads in Brothers in Arms...

UncleScrotar

i wonder if theyre gonna use ibms catalog machines,it looks cool and all but i dont think alot of companies want to be associated with the nazis they all want to forget how much they helped them.

Truepatriot

@jayntampa:

I've always liked Randy Pitchford. Gearbox nailed the HL1 sequel "Opposing Force" perfectly. When they got picked to do the Halo 1 port for PC people gave them a bunch of shit over the performance but they had to basically take an engine that was built from the ground up for the console and make it work on various PC's while having to implement network playability from scratch. All of that had to be done in 12 months. What people don't see is that Halo 1 for the PC now runs like butter while the Halo 2 port that was done by Bungie and Microsoft is pure garbage. They further spent 6 figures on making Halo CE which allowed people to build maps and have the multiplayer as a seperate .exe without having to install the entire game. BiA is simply a great series with some cool ideas

Pitchford has always gone out of his way to keep the community informed and always comes off as a gamer and not as some shallow suit from the publisher treating people like sheep with a bunch of catch-phrases and other bullshit.

Cell9song

probably the least obtrusive use of in game adds yet, but let's be clear...

If an advertisement does not catch your attention, then you do not see it, it merely becomes noise in the background...

Making advertisements that appeal to people is what both grabs their attention and gives them a fuzzy feeling about a product, which is why better in game adds is the effective way to implement them... so that it does more than anger consumers.... it's a win win for everyone.

As an example, does anyone even watch the superbowl for the game anymore?

lasttimeyouaskedme

@man_in_gauze: Here: [transformers.wikia.com]

And here: [www.vgcats.com]

Did you see Transformers? Product placement at its most obtrusive.

peAr_nectAr

Oh, and as for placement in general, I feel like it's better to show actual brands than to show made-up ones or none at all for fear of copyright infringement. You get your realism and more money for the budget/execs. Just don't go overboard, I guess is the key, isn't it?

Dewbot *shudder*

man_in_gauze

@peAr_nectAr:
I saw it, but don't remember that guy. I missed part of the middle (bladder waits for no man), but was the Mountain Dew guy actually in the movie, or just the game? If the movie...that's just shameful :\ I did notice the other product placement though. Although I've sworn off of buying Nokia phones for fear that they're evil miniature robots in disguise xP

man_in_gauze

I pity all the people who support ads. You do not see it now, but ads will fubar the gaming industry in the long run. You think advertisers will put money in fantasy/original/future games? No, only racing/sports/real world settings,etc.. will get the money and gaming companies will move away from anything else. All media has suffered because of ads in the long run, Going to the movie theater used to be an enjoyable experience until you had to sit through those horrible ads before the movies, radio is just unbearable with ads after each song, Some channels on TV are near unwatchable because they keep showing ads every few minutes, ad placement isn't bad on some shows but on others they are getting horrible, like hiro's rental car in season one of HEROES, and basically the last couple of season of smallville(hell one episode was a giant ad for bubblegum!!!).

Azriel77

@Azriel77: And I pity doomsayers. There was a time when advertisers got their own games. Granted it was a long time ago (although occasionally you'll still see it occur), but advertisements are far from saturating the game market. I don't see it happening and getting worked up about it won't change anything, anyway.

Captain Impulse

Doublefusion will kill this game - maybe they ought to have the CEO play guitar hero inside the game

DFKiller

@man_in_gauze: Definitely in the movie. Makes me cringe just thinking about it.

peAr_nectAr

@Captain Impulse:

Only example I can recall was an old game with the 7up guy, if I think that was the name. Oh, and the burger king things.

I say its best to be cautious with ads. It is very possible it'll get to some point where it is like pop-up crazy.

In-game ads are getting bad, and if they can get away with major ads, it'll be harder for them to let go of the revenue and keep on doing it until its as bad as movies.
Ticket prices get higher and higher and ads get longer and longer and can't be skipped on DVDs unless you have specific software for it.
Wouldn't surprise me if they start having in-game cutscenes with a first person view and having your character look at the ads for about 10 seconds or so.

Even if most are subtle now, many will try to get the ball rolling on more in-game ads; it is best to attempt to deter them now. People had the same thoughts on movie theaters long ago, and now they can't get rid of the damn ads.

超外人

Normally, I wouldn't be so happy to hear of in-game advertising, but in this case it might actually be somewhat of a good thing:

"In the past, our publisher's legal department had to ask us to change or remove the logo on the front of the Opel blitz truck that the Germans used in WW2. They asked us to do that because we don't have the rights to use the Opel logo from 1944. If we did a product placement deal with Opel, we could use the logo and actually better fulfill the authentic promise we're making with our game."

At least Gearbox is attempting to really make the ads fit with the art-design, which is already much better than what you can see in other games.

mexxxant

I'm not against advertising as such, but I've really got to question the reasoning here.

The reason you attach a brandname to a sports stadium is to reduce the price of the upkeep to consumers. The reason adverts appear on TV is to reduces the cost of airing the shows we love. The reason they appear in magazines is to keep the cost low.

Gearbox claim advertising increases budgets - but you have to pay a licensing fee to have to logos and representation (which is paid via the fee to Double Fusion)

If Gearbox didn't pay this fee and created their own brand for the factory (or simply left it unnamed - because does it really matter what the place is called when you're trying to survive?) they would have around the same budget anyway.

If advertising is going to occur in games, it needs to reduce the price to the consumer, otherwise it's unfair and unjust to the consumer.

FunkyJ

man, all the hate for in-game ads kind of makes me sick. I think ads make the experience more realistic when it is tastefully done. I actually like the ads on Xbox 360's dashboard because they constantly change and make my dash have something new every time I turn it on.

However, I do not like it when it overdone. For example, every vehicle in Rainbow Six: Vegas was a Dodge and their was a ton of signs with AXE on them. Now, that was so overdone that it actually made me sick. Even in the R6V2, the fact that they have a map called COMCAST is a little much.

Gearbox's ad in BIA3 seems to be very tasteful, since it is a modeling after an actual Philips factory, not just put on some building. It would be neat if one of the soldiers had a conversation and mentioned that the candy was Hershey's, even if it was in a distasteful way (example: Sgt: "man, not this Hershey crap again..."
Private: "what? I love this stuff, reminds me of home"
Sgt: "...yea, I guess...well, might as well eat it anyways since it's all we get"). You know, something like that, but with a much better script...

Soralinkyuna

@超外人: There's more than that. Here's just a few:

[kotaku.com]
[kotaku.com]
[kotaku.com]
[kotaku.com]

Captain Impulse

Remember the game company devs/publishers still make money.

But know they make more money.

What does the gamer get most of the time? NOTHING!

bloodbat

I like this example of ingame advertising, especially since this former factory is in my hometown. It is still there, but now functions as an apartment building, fitness centre and hotel. Recent pictures: [www.edhv.nl] and [i24.photobucket.com]

Mel_Funktion