@Scuba Steve: I instantly like you.

I will now stalk your activity.

Atheist Jew

I think people can make a very nice mid-range system that can look just as nice as an xbox 360 or PS3 and can play a lot of the latest games thats pretty cheap. Not 400 dollars, but then again you can do so much more on the PC than anything else.

This coming from someone who has all 3 systems, and a gaming PC (which is anything but mid-range).

Scuba Steve

@grumbel:
One of the new "features" are the revamped menus. I did find clicking them through on the 360 a tad unwieldy, but not as horribly unintuitive as many reviewers seemed to find them. Then again, efter +40 hours with a game you'd might hate them, and since I only had the opportunity to try the game on the 360 for a short amount of time...

...This will be totally awesome. And forgive me, but I think I'll find the pc version of Mass Effect preferable to the 360 version, with improved aiming, less texture popin and better menus. Basically the very few things that wasn't good about the game fixed.

Bioshock... was... buggy.... I mean, physics capped at 30 fps? That works if it's capped at 30, like the 360 version, but otherwise it just looks very wrong. And it's not like the physics in Bioshock are demanding, so there's no reason to do it. Mouse control was badly implemented and uerrrgh, I need to go and barf.

Melonfodder

@mcderek3000: As does Crytek, as does Blizzard, as does Valve, as does Maxis, as does Petroglyph, as does Gas Powered Games, as does Firaxis (Sid Meier), as does Bethesda, as does EA, as does Microsoft, as does Lionhead, etc, etc, etc.

PC gaming is not dying. It's certainly diminishing as it seems most people are too fucking lazy to bother dealing with their PCs, but the PC is always going to be a powerful platform, and gaming will never die on PCs as long as the right companies keep developing for it.

Atheist Jew

@LowNemesis: Yeh...You're ignorant

Most LCD flatscreens have PC ports now. Mine does, and I play all my PC games on my 46' LCD flatscreen. I'm pretty sure other do it as well. Seriously, the whole hunching over argument is getting old.

JollyGoodChap8

I'm a PC owner and I have to admit that PC gaming is dying. While we still get a lot of stuff from X360, the conversions are becoming poorer in quality (with extraordinary system requirements) and the games are now showing certain signs of being simplified (Bioware games going from Baldur's Gate 2 to Jade Empire being a prime example). It's fantastic to see that Bioware still cares for the likes of us.

mcderek3000

For those having a go at Toprem, I hope you realise that just because Bioshock had a quick release on the PC too and was a 'port' didn't mean it wasn't a VERY BAD VERSION of the game. Forget the extra water effects in DX10 the fact is the PC version was an absolute stinker. The controls were terrible (I resorted to using my 360 controller on the PC version that's how bad they implemented mouse/kbd!), not to mention the thousands of bugs (the sounds cutting out being a particularly annoying one). This was on a freshly built 8800gtx/e6850/4gb ram system that since played Crysis beautifully.

Oh yes Bioshock was indeed a prime example of an inferior PC version of a 'top rated' game (though the game really wasn't all that even on 360, dull dull gameplay doesn't become irradicated by sticking on a load of convoluted story and some cool but poorly executed ideas).

And as the PC version was handed off to 2kAus rather than the main developers, no wonder if didn't have much of a chance of a decent PC CENTRIC version. Seriously it was as if the developers hadn't played a PC FPS games ever. YOu think they would at least have given System Shock 2 a run through to see how the basics should/could be done!

As for this game, I'm glad they seem to be passionate about it not just being 'a lazy port' but time will tell. After the Bioshock debacle I no longer believe any developer or reviewer.

Sharpfish

Framerate issues remain.

Allen750

WOW and I thought that the ludicrous system specs were so high because this was going to be a non-optimized port...

So WTF!

Kris_

I've nothing but respect for bioware (okay, had, at least), but how could anyone possibly say this and not realize that it makes them look like a complete and utter moron?

Luziphir

So does this mean the PC version won't be filled with bugs and perform like dog crap?

cowondinosaur

@ggodo:
Porter is a type of dark ale that is typically thicker in character than most other ales. The exact way in which this beer got it's name is highly contended, but many believe it due to the large number of rail workers who desired thicker, stronger beer to sate their thirst from their long hard labors.

Porter was also the variety of ale that spilled forth during the 1814 flood that resulted after an 80,000+ gallon brewery vat ruptured. The flood killed a total of 8 people.

1814 Beer Flood

Bewildered_Ronin

Don't mess with Priestly. >:(

Bewildered_Ronin

@Xerxes 8933A:
i hope your not talking about the first halflife, because the PS2 port was pretty solid.

matteblender

Right! Just like how the FF VII they put out on the PC wasn't a port!

Wait...

Insomnia Bob

@Atheist Jew:
That'd take far too much work on the gameplay engine to do, I imagine. I hope they do it for the sequel, though.

Demaar

@Atheist Jew: But instead we get "System Shock was perfect, why'd them idiots have to fuck it all up with this gay action-shooter shit?" Someone will always complain.
You can't escape it!
But I can still dream...

Erwin

if were still discussing port/conversion, imo a port is like what ubi did when they made r6v for ps3. a conversion is when they made r6v for the psp.

so yes, this will probably suck.

Xeros606

Got it. Conversion, not port. Whatever you say!

ca$h

@Erwin: I certainly hope they decide to add the RPG elements back in, but I really doubt they'll do that. Bioshock proved it could sell shit-tons of units without them. I doubt they'll suddenly up and decide to reintegrate purposely removed mechanics all of a sudden like that. I imagine they'd recieve more negative reactions than positive ones.

I can imagine many forum posts along the lines of "Bioshock was perfect, why'd them idiots have to fuck it all up with this gay RPG shit?" etc.

@Pezdispenser: Links to those maps?

Atheist Jew

@ViRtUaThEoRy: Very nice it is too.

Here's a wine tip for you all: If you want a cheap red wine to taste like something more expensive, simply pour a bit of port into the glass and fill the rest up with your cheapo wine.

ErskinPig

Geez, so much PC vs Console debating here. It's really just a matter of preference guys, no one is inherently better than the other. Although I must admit that I do enjoy playing maps like Castle3, Magnetic, Snofort, Wolf, Mach2, Warpath, Rats, Toyfort, and Science on Team Fortress 2 while you consolers are stuck with little more than Gravelpit and Dustbowl.

:) That's right, there's more than four of us.

Pezdispenser

@DuctTape:
actually a Port is a wine. A very sweet and dark desert wine.

[en.wikipedia.org]

ViRtUaThEoRy

I like the part where PC users are snobs for getting an application with reasonable system requirements.

I also like the part where PC users are snobs for getting applications with UNreasonable system requirements.

liquidnumb

@KirbyMorph: Grrrr, nash nash nash!

Be silent.

ErskinPig

@Torgen thinks AAA means "Costs $60": Well said.

Hopefully calling it a conversion is something more and we are getting a better built game that can utilize the difference in PC and console gaming. Hopefully.

sevendash

I swear I didn't read Chef's post before I typed that. lol

Mohican

Thus we need a new term: "Porversion."

Mohican

Port = Poor conversion, a porversion of the original if you would.

Chef

@ErskinPig: You're an idiot. A keyboard and mouse is complex? You use WASD (which is easier to use move on an analog stick or d-pad), space, Q, R, G and and maybe 1-5 for switching guns. Oh and enter and every other key on the thing to type (so complex!). Console players probably use more buttons for any game than the equivilent computer unless you're some freak that maps all 26 letters to random functions, making it the most retarded system ever. YOu still only have the left hand to use the keyboard with and the other one on the mouse.

The only thing dumbing down is random PC fanatcis like yourself that think because you can map a million functions to 50 different keys makes it impossible to play a game. Guess what, I don't need a macro to teabag someone or tag some hentai picture in CS on a console. Just because you need random keys for stupid shit doesn't meant a controller makes a game inferior or dumbed down.

MMORPG and RTS are the only game that probably get dumbed down on consoles, which is why they rarely show up there.

Pull your head out of your arse and stop humping your water cooled tower and realize that game you're playing on the PC is the same as the console version with the only difference being a mandatory 10-20 minute install, numerous patches and better aiming.

KirbyMorph

@Atheist Jew: Hey, I wasn't disagreeing with him, I was just stating he needs to grow up. I know it was dumbed down, but that doesn't mean that we're all a bunch of idiots. I wish Bioshock was more like SS2, but apparently we can't figure out any game with RPG elements. Hopefully Bioshock 2 or whatever comes next will be a little more complex.
If not they might as well give it to us straight and subtitle it Mystic Quest.

Erwin

@PATSCRU: 40-60%? Get real.

KirbySS

KOTOR was good, but Jade Empire felt a bit like a port due to the clunky low-resolution GUI.

SolInvictus

@Xenigma: Consoles = compromise. Tailoring complex games for controllers is always, ALWAYS going to result in a certain level of dumbing down. You just have to accept that.

ErskinPig

Being able to run xbox360 games on my PC with twice the resolution and twice the framerate as well as with 40-60% more content always brings a huge smile to my smug PC gaming face.

Gears on PC was beautiful (although the multiplayer was gimped by the absence of dedicated servers due to GFW Live)

I know Bioware is going to do an even better job with their port, as Bioware, unlike Epic, still get the PC gaming market.

PATSCRU

@FLYBOY611: Or a city in Canada.

ggodo

@Atheist Jew: Well said.

homernoy

So its.....a really well done port?

FLYBOY611

“I'll have a large.”
“You mean a deici?”
«20 seconds of madness»
“What's a deici?”
“It's a large.”

Torgen thinks AAA means “Costs $60”

@Erwin: Toprem's comment might have been a tad juvenile but it doesn't have the distinction of being wrong.

Bioshock was supposed to be a spiritual sequel to System Shock 2. Instead it was really only a partial sequel, because a lot of the gameplay elements of SS2 that made the game so fantastic were stripped out of Bioshock to make the game more accessible for console players. Insults aren't necessary, nor are calls of bullshit. The evidence is right there, and there's no other reason Irrational would remove all of the great RPG mechanics, replace the hacking mechanics, remove weapon damage/repair, etc, etc etc. Anyone who's played SS2 will see, plain as day, that Bioshock was dumbed down, severely. The only reason they would have eventually done that is that it was primarily a console game, and they figured the RPG mechanics and all that other shit would make it too convoluted for gamers who were expecting an amazing action-packed art-deco romp.

Which is what we got. And it's still a fantastic game! But it's not what it could have been. Blame consoles for that.

Atheist Jew

@Konstrix: xplain plx

-AS

Archaic Stigma

@Custom Reality: D:< You do realize the 360 is a glorified PC right? Its impossible to slander one without slandering the other. The only problem is that I cant do my homework/work/internet browsing/email/shopping/etc. on one besides gaming. I have a PC and a PSii60 just to put things in perspective.

NitrousO

@Toprem: Bioshock came out on the PC simultaneously. Mass Effect didn't. There would have been a lot more complaining if PC people had to wait. You're lucky you get it at all. PC game sales pale in comparison to console game sales. They might be just as well off spending their time on more DLC for 360 or a new game altogether.

Spartan1308

@Toprem: Hey nitwit, the game was developed on console hardware, then tweaked for PC. Much like how the Splinter Cell titles (up until 4) were all developed using Xbox hardware.

beem

Call it a conversion, if you like. All I care is that some of the more important features (better inventory screen!) make there way into a patch for the 360 version. The console gamers bought it first, seems fair they should get a similar quality game that the PC players do. Convert both versions and I'll never mention the word "port" regarding Bioware again.

Xenigma

Wasn't this same nonsense term used for the Xbox ports of Half Life 2 and Tron 2.0?
@Toprem: Hey there little buddy! Why don't you run along now and meet some real console gamers? Then you can get over your pointless insults and you may just someday become a decent person. Wouldn't that be great?

Erwin

@kuraitenshikun: Oh you did not just drop the Phantom bomb.

Pata-pwn(TM?)

EDIT: "the new Vegas BETTER** run awesome"

orangeclover

@orangeclover: I agree, hopefully the PC gaming alliance thing can help to bring prices of decent hardware down. It's nearly impossible to find a decent gaming machine at retail, it seems these days if you want it built right you have to do it yourself. Which is excluding everyone without abit of technical know how.

LowNemesis

@Kyle81:
Wow.. so NOT true.
guitar hero 3, rainbow 6: vegas (although ran well on my powered machine, not so great on just about all of my friends)

its in the programming, man. its how much attention is put onto the actual conversion and optimization. those lazy bastards.

orangeclover

If the PC version gets extra content, hopefully we console owners will get it sometime in the future as well.

LowNemesis

I always "convert" flash video files into MP4s. is that considered porting?

Sweet Tooth

@dsmx:
Technically it would still be a "port", yes. However this sounds like great news to me as PC ports are gimped WAYY too often. they are not given proper attention. NHL 08, MADDEN, Rainbow 6: Vegas, Guitar Hero 3. I swear, the new Vegas run awesome for ALL my friends AND let me use my webcam to create a custom character.

To be completely honest, though. I only care cause I upgraded a while ago and haven't been playing too many worthwhile games. Consoles are where it's at.

orangeclover

conversion = "rewritting" the engine of the "same" game on a "different" system...sounds like a port

Sweet Tooth

@Toprem: wow! Typical PC snobbery. I'm interested in playing games, not in tweaking hardware and worrying about how many pixels and frames per second my system is pushing. Also sitting on a comfy couch with surround sound is rather enjoyable as well. I much prefer it to hunching over on my desk.

LowNemesis

yup...sure! keep saying that! "conversion" not a port...whatever you say...ya loone

NocturnOwl357

@godot: All the Hitman games after the original were console to PC conversions, and besides the graphics being compromised the games were very good

Bon5ai

@Ruglia: So they're making a boat landing not an Mexican band? That makes sense now.

ggodo

Anyone who's ever tried to play the lame PC port of Resident Evil 4 knows the difference.

godot

Not sure if this is the case, but when I think port, I think Half-Life on Console, bad controls, bad graphics, just barely enough to get it to run, without caring what it looks or plays like.

Conversion makes me think of Conversion mods, where they replace all the textures, rewrite some code, balance the units out, basically make the game better then it was.

Oh, and if BioWare is thinking the same as me, then screw you BioWare, I wanted that game on the 360 to start with.

Xerxes 8933A

@ggodo: No, Porter is a Mexican indie band =)

Ruglia

@ErskinPig: He's refering to the fact that the game doesn't have an inventory screen, or most of the other RPG elements that have been so utterly ingrained into his mind that he can't comprehend the idea of a game being anything more than idiotic without them.

Moonshadow101

@Kyle81: for sure, all bioware games are better on pc

symphony_of_the_night

I hope by "conversion" they mean that they will write a proper userinterface for the PC instead of just slapping some crappy mouse control over an interface originally designed for the controller.

grumbel

@Custom Reality: Count me as one of those proud four. I'd rather pay for a Phantom I'd never get.

kuraitenshikun

boo hiss 360, yay PC

Bon5ai

Who cares? Even if its a "port", it's going to run 10 times better than it did on the 360.

Kyle81

I tend to agree with BioWare, "port" has a developed a pretty nasty connotation over the years.

Whatever they call it, though, let's hope the PC version is great. My 360 copy of Mass Effect is still in the plastic and I'm eager to play through it my first time on the PC.

unmarkedone

Sure............................That's what they said about Lost Planet. I mean, better be better.

MysteryMeat

It's a Portversion. =)

Blanku

@Custom Reality: The hate is swelling in you now.

ErskinPig

@dexterr: Thats a good choice

The only downside i will see on this is that it will need above average pc hardware to run it properly...

TOCATL

You can call it whatever you like it's still a port.

dsmx

Yes there is difference. a port is basically still using the file structure of the original system while a conversion could pretty much be compared to a revamp of the whole code with imported recourses from the other version (models, textures, sounds)

Acunia

Can we please get more devs out there like Bioware and Insomniac?!?

mpmaley

I'm sure the four PC gamers who don't own an Xbox 360 will be happy to hear this spin on a game most people have moved on from by now.

Keep on, keepin' on, you four special souls.

Custom Reality

You can call a hooker a friend but there still a hooker. Dickhead of a designer just needs to admit a port is a port of course.

bigd7387

I'm not adopting a new religion. I don't care what Bioware selling.

KeroseneClimax

@Toprem: Nah, Bioshock had a proper PC version. It even has DX10 stuff that the console version obviously doesn't.

ErskinPig

Its got inventory tweak and graphic tweaks here and there.

Still same cookie-cutter sidequest garbage exists. Choose a planet of an element of your choice, same structure, same layout, same mobs, same drops, snoozefest.

Its a port.

Fyren

@Likwit: And is pratically plug and play.

PeterQC

I told you so mass effect would end up o pc. That why i prefer not to purchase an xbox i rather wait with patience. I bet 73% good games will end pu through pc.

dexterr

So what's the big deal?

kyosen

I guess it could also mean that they are actually adapting the game play for a separate platform, too. Seems less likely, though.

liquidnumb

It's not a purse, it's European.

TRAMS_AM

@Toprem: My hardware was $400 and can play any game on the platform for 4 or more years. Who's the idiot here?

Likwit

To-ma-to, To-mah-to. As long as it's good.

blackadvent

@DuctTape: I thought that was porter?

@mx5: So Victoria B.C. is a conversion city?

ggodo

Speaking of Port, if you mix it into a bowl with some green mushrooms and a rotworm corspe, you can make yourself a fine stew!

Obscure Ultima Underworld Reference FTW!

Pezdispenser

If I understand correctly, he means they are not taking x-box optimized software and making it run on PC hardware, but are actually writing new code for the PC version.

liquidnumb

P-p-p-p-port! Nah. Let's call everything Conversions now.

Amazon_Chris

conversion make it sound more like something about a couple and family problems because of religion..

symphony_of_the_night

Shame the people at 2k didn't have the same kind of ethics about ports. BioShock on the PC is :O/ because it was dumbed down for the console idiots.

Toprem

@JeffPaine: the difference is: "conversion" is Canadian for "port" ... :) :)

mx5

Conversion makes it sound like it's a complete rewrite of the engine, instead of bare minimum tweaks to allow it to run on the platform.

topato

@ggodo: No no no, you've got it wrong. Port is a type of alcoholic beverage, kind of like brandy.

DuctTape

@ErskinPig: You're forgetting the Sonic RPG that Bioware is making. I'm pretty sure EA has no say in what direction that's going in.

Lezard

i call shenanigans on BioWare's Chris Priestly

mossberg

So um what exactly is the difference between a "port" and a "conversion"?

JeffPaine

Semantics! I only see this ending in tears.

Dorphat the Insomniac

@Ghede: Isn't a port where boats land?

ggodo

@ggodo: A conversion has more letters than a port.

Ghede

Port, conversion. Whatever. It'll be the last creation of Bioware that isn't blighted by EA's influence.

ErskinPig

@Konstrix: Could you enlighten me?

ggodo

@Konstrix: Care to explain lol

jip100

i know all the differences between the two, too!

Konstrix

Of course it isn't a port, it's the real version. The 360 version was a beta. Don't you know how bioware does things?

Akin

@railskins: I can totally understand that you like to tweak the hardware and I completely agree. Its like fixing up a car, but what I don't like is when people cant understand that some people don't like to mess with their hardware or fix cars. I want to buy something and I want it to work, plain and simple. Oh and I do have one thing to be proud of with my xbox. I am the owner of a launch console that has never red ringed or even froze for that matter. While I am definitely in the minority here, I am still happy about avoiding all that hassle.

LowNemesis

@ggodo: "So Victoria B.C. is a conversion city?"

Maybe I'm tired but that really cracked me up!

Harteex

port or conversion, just please spend more time on it than 2K did on that awful bioshock port/conversion.

2K hates ports too, and the people who buy theirs..

consoleitis is strange. a box you can't upgrade in any real way is a money hole. computers have many components that last through several upgrades.

pc owners are more computer savvy than the typical console owner I'd guess. the more you know about them the less likely you'll be to yak about their limitations compared to a console designed 3 years ago.

pc owners like to TWEAK! it's very satisfying building your own pc from scratch and having it run like a top with all your fave games that are properly designed for PC..

not sure how people can take 'pride' in an xbox... you just opened the box it came in. the specs can never improve and you are just marking time until it overheats because of bad design.. yay for you..

railskins

@JollyGoodChap8: Wow, yeah you can hook it up to an LCD with a VGA or DVI-HDMI cable but at that resolution why bother with the PC. If you have a screen that big you have to sit back and use a game pad anyway. It's pretty difficult to use a mouse and keyboard on you're lap which is one of the reasons why many die hard PC fans stick to PC gaming is for the Mouse and keyboard combo. But yeah you're right I'm the ignorant one. Go ahead and go around calling people ignorant without justification. It shows what you're really like, a typical PC snob with a false sense of superiority. My main point obviously went way over you're head though so I will state it again in greater detail.

I myself have little gaming time so I would rather spend it gaming than tweaking performance for the next game. It's just easier to plug a console into a tv than it is to set up a computer in an entertainment center. It takes far less time. Games will be custom tailored to my machine, not the other way around. And when it comes to upgrading I can go to a store five years from now and say One PS3/Xbox 720 please. No hassle guaranteed. No having to build something from the ground up and then tweak it regularly. I don't care about frame rate or super high resolutions so long as it doesn't affect game play and looks decent.

LowNemesis

@Sharpfish: Absolute bullshit. I played the PC version & it was just fine. Stop talking crap.

ErskinPig

@Atheist Jew:

I usually just download them directly from the server, but I think the guy gets them from here: [www.fpsbanana.com]

Science is a really fun CP map [www.fpsbanana.com]
Wolf's pretty good, but points B and C are a bitch to get to.[www.fpsbanana.com]
Castle3 is a pretty big one, and very popular last I checked [www.fpsbanana.com]

I'm sure you can find the rest on your own.

Pezdispenser