I have had my 360 since launch and I fine with the 20GB. I have ton arcade games and music ripped to my HD and I still have 6 GB left. If I ever have to time to watch a downloaded movie then I will think about upgrade my harddrive.

pupaboy3

@Toprem:
Uhm. quite the opposite. I meant that you pay that price for a quality product with Apple, and even though Microsoft takes all the precautions of having it internally controlled, they still make a product that is broken. Sorry for the confusion, I should have written it better.

Theoutlet

@Spartan1308: I pointed out an answer to the hacking problem posed in the external kit solution. Remember that.

NKato

@NKato: Agreed on the external drive kit. There's no way MS is going to agree to that b/c of hacking. It would likely leave the system more vulnerable to allowing ripped games to be played.

Spartan1308

@erac3rx: True. All you have to do is partition. Thats what i did, and works like a charm.

Wait

@NKato: Perhaps it's semantics, but if Sony fully supports replacing the internal hard drive with another of your choice, how is using a cable that allows you to connect a 3.5" drive externally instead of a 2.5" drive 'unauthorized'? We're not talking about console modification here, were talking about attaching a cable to it.

erac3rx

People from back in the day never complained on Add-Ons as long as added features that you could just plug in and use. The good thing about buying add on is to reduce cost of system. It helps everyone into the mix and add more features as they get the funds. So even a 360 Arcade box does HD, HDMI and now wireless controller with 256 memory card. So you could actually buy this buy any game play it and save your game. So though you can't download alot to it you can get right in and play games.

JorgieX

@erac3rx: Or just use the USB ports in the front. :"> I've got mine connected to a 500GB USB external hard drive that has all of my movies ripped into DivX...erm...many fine public domain and independent films.

killingdrew

Anybody here got the phone number for Xbox HQ?

-

I posted this before, but:

Since 360s need a special HDD connector, you can't just buy a HDD and attach it.

Why don't MS sell a HDD case that fits on the 360?

They could make at least $10 profit selling it for $30...
I bet they'd sell over a million!

Since they are paranoid about losing control of the data, make the cases single use.

When the case is first attached, the drive is formatted my the 360.

Data is secure and people save big $.

-

Just remember a huge warning sticker for fools who want to put their own data and hacks onto the 360:

"Any data contained on this drive will be lost!"

kNZA

20gb is not too small. You don't have to have all your game content downloaded at once. Because once you buy something you can download it again for free. So if you, for instance, were gonna stop playing Halo 3 for awhile you could delete the maps you bought to save space.

Right now I have like around 8-9 gb free space, and that's with some demos and videos that I could easily delete.

Although I agree that it would be nice to be able to use our own hard drive.

kojirodensetsu

@NKato: i thought age of conan was supposed to come out on 360!?!??!?!?! I READ THAT SOMEWHERE! DONT YOU TAKE THAT AWAY FROM ME!!!!

ArmyofJuan

You know, I've had my 360 since the launch window and, to be honest, 20 gigs has never been a problem. I don't think most people NEED a huge HDD, but its nice to have the option.

Personally I think this is all part of the preparation for when Halo Chronicles is released ...

DARTH_TIGRIS

@jynxycat: Which is probably why I'm not going to be interested in having anything to do with Microsoft in the future involving my personal work.

NKato

Microsoft charges $100 for an external enclosure for a 120gb internal 2.5" HDD.

Plain and simple.

A piece of plastic, that costs them probably $3 to make.

How anyone cannot be outraged by this, is astounding. I'm a big a 360 fan as any, but Microsoft's pricing scheme is asinine.

jynxycat

@jfx316: Well, think about it. Why do you think Microsoft has been banning XBL accounts that have been found to falsify achievements and the like?

Cheating. Spoils the fun for everyone else.

Therefore, Microsoft has a very serious hard line against data hacking in their hardware and software. (Although, when it comes to hacking in their software unrelated to X360, they're pussies.)

NKato

@NKato: that's weak. hope MS smartens up.

jfx316

@erac3rx: Oh, and additionally, the idea of using an external USB drive that is not designed to be fully interfaced with an X360, well...I already explained why it wouldn't work.

Hacking the content on the hard drive.

Look, the solution is to have a fully dedicated external drive for specific purposes such as XBLA games, MMO content, and so on while protecting that content and ensuring that it can't be tampered with.

Without this, the limitations for today's "next-generation" games will not change.

Before anyone else writes a response to me, look at the problem from all angles before you even open your mouth. And I mean ALL angles. Not just yours.

NKato

@erac3rx: I was not suggesting an unauthorized, third-party method of doing it. I was suggesting a fully-supported, first-party solution.

NKato

@Spartan1308: You have a point. And clearly, Microsoft would not want to have anything to do with my idea of an external hard drive kit, heh. Their loss.

NKato

Microsoft probably doesn't want to put a 500GB HDD in there because they want to avoid reliability problems. *Ahem*.

psychicfriend

@Moonshadow101: You must not download a lot of stuff, especially not anything in HD. I've got several hundred burned DVDs sitting behind me along with ~1.3 TB in storage across seven HDDs, of that I have about 300 GB of free space when I get around to formatting a couple of partitions and moving data back on to them thats on two of my other discs (roughly 180GB)

Toprem

@NKato: Hey, not to burst your bubble or anything, but you can use external hard drives on PS3 today, with virtually no hassle. You can buy a kit such as the one linked below-- which gives you an eSATA port where your ps3s hard drive used to be, or you can simply buy the right cable to take the ps3s internal SATA connector and turn it into one that your external drive can connect to via eSATA. It's pretty straightforward.

Re: the Xbox 360, what they could very easily do to eliminate a ton of this ridiculousness is let you use your USB connected hard drives for something useful, instead of allowing you to store ZERO useful content (read: anything from Live Marketplace). Or they could make the system software compatible with any 2.5" drive you want, assuming you don't mind opening up your existing hard drive's shell to swap it out. Or they could make the hard drives reasonably priced (they are currently at rape prices, even considering the fact that they are laptop drives).

Pachter is pretty much a bonehead, but he has it right that the more hard drive space people have the more stuff they will buy. The Sony folks have it right, if we really care we can upgrade the internal HD to as big as we want, be it 320gb inside or a 1tb outside via eSATA. This will become a huge bonus when the PS Store begins carrying video.

PS3 eSATA Kit:
[www.destructoid.com]

erac3rx

@Theoutlet: Did you just call the XBox / hardware related to it as a "quality product?" aaahahahahahahahah

Toprem

Oh, I don't doubt that larger drives are coming, but I think this is more because they aren't going to be able to source 20GB drives for much longer, it's larger than the 40GB PS3, and they need to keep costs low for competition against the Wii (new price cuts if need-be, as rumored).

CZroe

@NKato: Laptop drives aren't as cheap as he is saying but they are a ton cheaper than the prices MS is charging. They have a huge markup on the things.

$170 for a 320GB

[www.newegg.com]

$130 for a 250GB

[www.newegg.com]

$70 for a 120GB

[www.newegg.com]

You can't even buy a 20GB drive at Newegg b/c no one would want one when you can spend just a bit more for a lot more memory. Say what you want but MS is raping people w/the prices they are charging for peripherals.

Spartan1308

@Wait: My answer to you? Take your rhetoric and stuff it up your ass.

The reason the prices for the console hard drves are high is because they are LAPTOP FORM FACTOR DRIVES.

In other words, tiny, itty-bitty sized drives are not like your average PC drive. Which obviously is more expensive.

So can it, tightwad.

NKato

"Persoanlly I'd rather they just let us use our own, but that's just me."

+1

dechire

I'm sorry, drop the price of the 20 gig hdd to $34.99, 60 gig $79.99, and the 120 gig $134.99. But still too much.
A 500 gig external cost me 90 dollars, at sams club.
MICROSOFT GET REAL NOW. COME ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Wait

Now were getting somewhere. If this is true, then MS should just, take the 20 gig, put that on the core, and drop the price to about $34.99. If MS does that, they will sell more.
P.S. Also,drop the price of the wifi. $100 bucks is RIDICULOUS

Wait

@okenny :): GFW = Games For WINDOWS, man. That's PC. GFW is just a marketing ploy by Microsoft to get more games under the DirectX 10 banner. It doesn't mean it'll come to the 360. Look at Lord of the Rings Online. Is that on the 360? No. It's been advertised as a Games For Windows branded product.

NKato

Ok. I just wrote a nice, tidy article on my website about the "External Console Content Storage Kit" solution that is related to the article's subject.

Have a gander: [www.venthyrll-saga.com]

NKato

When I first heard that the Xbox360 was not going to have an internal HDD I immediately saw the obvious problem: it's a step back from the Xbox1. The next Xbox needs to have... let's say... a built-in 60GB drive (which cannot be removed), but also an attachment for existing Xbox360 drives. I don't care about the inflated prices or the DRM issues as I don't buy videos and don't care about extra space. What I *DO* care about is the quality of the games. There is significant evidence that the developers can make bigger, better performing games when they can COUNT ON a good amount of HDD caching. Hopefully Xbox720 will be a return to form for Microsoft in that there will be one standard console with a *minimum* of 10GB dedicated to the the system cache.

ectogamut

we still need our linux and apple game consoles :P Linux could cure microsoft's rip-off-ness with the power of FREE and apple could downsize the 360, but still make it able to hold more space.

But then with apple you'd have to buy a new 360 every year or two when they come out with a better one, and yours won't be very durable... and with linux lol you'll have to enter a command line to open your microsoft dashboard.

SpartanQ77

Pachter should stick to money analysis and not hardware as 2.5" 500gb don't even exist and would surely cost more than the xbox itself.

Xirj

Nope, it @jfx316: Nope, it can't for a wide variety of reasons. Ranging from incompatibility to software security concerns by Microsoft. I'm talking about hackers. They would need to release a specialized external HDD enclosure for the console first.

NKato

can the 360 use external hard drives like the PS3? i've got a 160gig western digital my book hooked up to mine for all non-game related media. seems like that would be the best solution since the price for the 360 HD is weak sauce.

jfx316

@NKato: Color me confussed...

These sites all say yes:
[IGN]
[1UP]

The main Funcom site says PC and GFW as if that's the only thing it knows
[Funcom]

The MS press kit also says PC and GFW as well([MS Press Kit for AoC])

...so for some reason, major press outlets know something we don't to be classifying this as a PC and 360 title. Like I said, color me confused :(

okenny :)

@SG79: That's why I suggested it as a console peripheral for the current generation.

And as an option, MS, Sony and Nintendo can offer pre-built external drives for the tech-illiterate. It's still cheap.

Really, people. Standard HDD's are increasingly getting cheaper, this is such an obvious business decision: Sell specialized enclosure kits for the consoles, and prebuilts, and everyone wins. Developers, Manufacturers (HDD and Console), and ultimately, the End-user, because this enables a serious content storage solution to be provided to game creators that are seriously interested in true-definition games for the current generation.

In fact, if the solution is used, we can see consoles increasingly becoming more similar to the PC in terms of game usage (install/content reading).

NKato

@okenny :): FunCom says that they have no plans to bring Age of Conan to the console yet. It's still being mulled over. This is the MMO, by the way.

Reason: It uses a huge load of content, much more than FFXI does because AoC is DX10, has higher detail files, while FFXI is based on the PlayStation 2 standard.

NKato

Why do people give credence and publicity to this friggin' boob? He's wrong half the time, and his opinions are only valuable to the type of person who can't set a digital clock.

Sherlock_the_Barbarian

@NKato:

Sounds fine, however, there are two factors:

- Developers love a standard HDD, though there should be a cap on the amount of cache they can use. An internal HDD is the only way to go in that scenario.

- Consumers. Do not overestimate the intelligence or simple tech knowledge of the average consumer. Having such a system will confuse many until the day swapping a HDD or any simple matter becomes as common as changing batteries in a remote.

SG79

@daizyujin: THAT IS FRIGGIN' CORRECT! Standard HDD with a special enclosure/interface for the console!

NKato

Age of Conan is NOT OC only. it is coming out for the 360, too.

LaserJudas

@NKato: Age of Conan is PC only? Can someone get Witzbold to check this fact!? Stat!

okenny :)

@2NinjasTapedTogether: Good luck my brother is on his third.

daizyujin

@NKato: HAHA you have made your point man. ;) Seriously though, are you basically saying to use a standard HDD which would just need a special enclosure from MS or Sony to operate with the system?

daizyujin

Yet another reason I'm glad I'm waiting on my X360. I want to own one. But I just want it to have enough HD space and not... ya know, shit the bed on me a month after I get it.

2NinjasTapedTogether

@daizyujin: Hah, that came to mind just now. :D Having the option to use a larger-than-usual HDD that you would cannibalize from an old computer or bought used (and cheap) from a computer shop would be a very, VERY cheap option compared to a 200GB addon.

It would also allow for reduced necessity of compression in downloadable content, as I mentioned recently about true HD MMO's - even CAPCOM is having a hard time compressing their Street Fighter game into a 200MB download.

The solution, therefore, is to have an external hard drive kit that endusers can build with their own purchased, cannibalized or otherwise hard drives.

The average size of a SATA hard drive on the market as a used item is around 60GB up to 160GB. And their price is considerably less than a brand-new unit.

The merits of the solution far outweigh the one necessary evil of protecting console-centric data. Trust me, daizyujin, if Microsoft/Sony takes this idea seriously, you could start seeing a much less painful hit to the wallet for future consoles.

(Cheap/Reused Hard Drives + Console-Specific External Kit = Mega Storage Space for uber-cheap!)

It doesn't take rocket science, man.

NKato

@Moonshadow101: Sorry for the double post. It might also be worth stating that XBLA games are starting to have to be downsized because of a lack of space. Super Street Fighter 2 Turbo Remix and Bionic Commando Rearmed are already officially going to be of a lower graphic quality than the PS3 versions because Sony allows games to be over 150MB. Xbox Originals are another good reason. Ninja Gaiden Black is a whopping 5 gigs. That is absolutely huge for a 20 gig HDD. Phantasy Star Universe had an expansion come out that was over a gig as well. If companies truly want to go to a complete internet based distribution model then 500GB is nothing overly large. Especially when you consider that a 50 gig blu-ray is already not large enough for Metal Gear Solid 4.

daizyujin

It's kinda silly to suggest a 500GB model when the form-factor only goes up to 320GB on 1.8" and 2.5" HDs.
Twenty GB is indeed too small for a segment of the consumers out their but considering that most DTV and some HDTV DVRs ship with similar sizes back in 2006-2007 makes that statement seem "obvious" as storage would obviously grow with the demand of consumer demand. Good one Michael *face palm*

okenny :)

@Moonshadow101: Video. Keep in mind that the PS3 and 360 have DIVX support. If I have a HD video in DIVX I play it on my 360 so I can see it on my TV (and cause my PC is a piece).

daizyujin

@Moonshadow101: MMOs. If you play a lot of high-definition MMO's (Age of Conan comes to mind), or games with a ton of pre-made high-def DLC like the Street Fighter XBLA download that Capcom is working on, you could fill that up in a hurry.

Of course, Age of Conan is PC-only. Future MMO's on consoles could concievably become true High-Definition if my solution is used.

NKato

@daizyujin: Well, that's why I said it sould be based on the software encryption used in the HDD, like a completely new file format. Like when they developed NTFS after the FAT format died out.

Decoders in a hardware board in the external drive kit or the console itself would unlock the data stored on the third party HDD. The fact that it would use hardware-based decoding ensures that the files cannot be hacked easily.

Additionally, since the decoding system would be tied to how a console communicates with a HDD, you would not have to worry about losing the content you downloaded unless the SATA drive you bought for it died on you.

The content downloading system, I agree, has a lot of work needed. The fact that you can't redownload your purchases is one very clear example - perhaps because the companies don't want to be arsed to maintain a purchase database for the accounts themselves.

I expect this could be solved with the next version of XBL with the launch of their next-gen console, a long time from now.

-NK

NKato

I never had any problems with space until I downloaded an Xbox original. 20gigs isn't very big, obviously, but it's generally adequate.

And 200-500gigs? Seriously? What the hell would you do with it? I can't even think of a reasonable way to fill that up on a PC.

Moonshadow101

@NKato: I see your point, I think it more comes from the attitude that I have of, I paid for it, its mine, if I want to open the fuckin thing up I will. I come from a group of people who are just tired of every damn company trying to tell us what we can do with the products we pay our hard earned money for so whenever I hear DRM or anything like it a flag flies up. I had a Wii die on me and I know first hand how big a hassel it is to get everything back the way it was. All of my problems were caused by Nintendo's boneheaded DRM. In fact it keeps their repair department from pulling anything from the system unless they can do a 100% copy of the flash memory from a working system. For instance, when I sent mine in, they couldn't get it to boot. Instead of just copying the flash memory's content over, they just said the DRM didn't allow it and sent me a new system with none of my save data, channels, games, or even updated firmware on it. So I had to spend 4 hours redownloading everything I had and still lost all my save games. So as far as I am concerned, DRM = bad.

daizyujin

Sorry for so many posts, but I should add one last thing: If this concept I suggested is used, why the fsck would you want to plug your SATA hard drive back into a PC if you've used it as an External Hard Drive for a console?

The answer is simple: Hackers. Therefore, a hardware or software DRM-like security feature is required to ensure that players cannot cheat, modify, or otherwise ruin the game experience for others. This is why Microsoft has taken a very hard-line stand against people who modify their games due to their intensive use of the Xbox Live system.

NKato

@QualityJeverage: A 40GB hard drive goes for around $50 ($90 for an MS 20GB) and a 120GB drive is about $70-$80 ($180 from MS)

droopy

I'm fine with my 20 gig so far. I've got 30+ games worth of saves/DLC and about 15 CDs ripped on there with 6 gigs left.

Although I actually do delete the DLC of games I don't play anymore. I know I can always get it back.

It still sucks Microsoft doesn't allow on option to use any HDD. Then I wouldn't have a problem ripping, like, 15,000 CDs.

Xiedo

@daizyujin: Of course, I should remember that peripherals can be disassembled, and the HDD removed to be connected to a regular computer. That's one other reason why the DRM feature is recommended. It would scramble the HDD's information, or just simply render it unreadable.

Additionaly, the enclosure's design could use a chipboard that would communicate between the HDD and the console for auth purposes, in terms of ensuring that it would function properly on a Console while preventing a PC from reading it. Hence the encryption idea.

There are a lot of different solutions, be they hardware or DRM-based, and they are not all destructive. You're looking at this problem from an unconventional-user perspective, and the companies don't cater to that market because unconventional users LOVE to mod their consoles - immediately voiding their warranties, of course.

NKato

@chunks4123: Sounds alot like apple to me, hehe.

Eh, it's the price you pay sometime for a quality product. It's funny that Microsoft took the idea of an internally controlled product out and still managed to ship you something that doesn't work.

Theoutlet

@daizyujin: I'm saying it doesn't have to be DRM. There's a reason software/hardware developers are trying to protect the code infrastructure in their consoles. This particular DRM, though, COULD optionally delete your harddrive, or just generally prevent you from connecting to it.

It's kind of like trying to boot up an Apple HDD on a PC system. I just thought I'd add in the DRM-esque bit for chuckles. Think about it. A malicious-minded gamer connects such a kitted peripheral to his PC.

It starts barking out a warning like an airplane out of control. He freaks out, and yanks it out of his computer. Alternately, he could persist, and end up losing his content to hard-drive scrambling.

It's a security feature, and obviously, when involving heavily-propietary hardware like the PlayStation and the Xbox, you can't really rule out the idea of a DRM to enable third-party hardware peripheral usage.

Besides, this kind of "DRM" would only happen if you would be an idiot to ignore a big, obvious warning telling you NOT to friggin' connect the unit to anything other than the console it is designed for.

-NK

NKato

For once, the oft complained-about prices on 360 drives is NOT Microsoft's fault. People think the prices are too high because they're comparing the prices to those of internal PC drives, which are much cheaper.

360 drives are closer to laptop drives than PC drives, and when compared to the prices of those, the cost of a 360 drive is pretty much average.

QualityJeverage

@3inst3in: I second everything you just said. I play my 360 more but Microsoft jumped the gun for sure. BTW I have all three, I am nobody's fanboy. I just call it like it is.

daizyujin

Yeah the pricing for the 360 hard drives have always been ridiculous but its no different from Sony charging you $99 for a HDMI cable that you can buy for $20 anywhere else. The only difference is, well, you can't buy a 360 hard drive from third party manufacturers which sucks a little.

However i strongly disagree 20gb isn't enough. If your downloading videos, or Xbox 1 games, then yes. I can see that sucker filling up fast. I've got a lot of 360 games now, the saves take up almost no room, Arcade games are small, again hardly taking up any room. Then there are the map packs, for Halo 2, Gears of War, GH3 map tracks, Naruto rise of a ninja voices and so on. I doubt i'll need a larger hard drive this gen.

So yeah, 20gb is fine for a lot of people. Patcher your wrong on this one. Not everyone is going to be downloading videos and Xbox 1 games and really, they are the only big files that would take up a lot of space. Most map packs don't really go over 100 or so mb.

Tiberian

@ErskinPig:
Sounds alot like apple to me, hehe. Although in the gaming industry microsoft seems to be doing it here too.

chunks4123

@NKato: Yeah that is what we need, more stinking DRM. Sorry it sounds nice in theory but more DRM is never the best way to do anything.

daizyujin

this is what sony meant when they said the ps3 would be "future proof".

caveat: i am not a sony fanboy, I am actualy an xbox fanboy, but lately I've realized that while xbox got a jump on market share, sony was smart to sit back and see where misrosoft would mess up. not mandating an HDD, i believe, was the second biggest mistake of the 360. not testing sufficiently for rrod, of course, was the first.

3inst3in

@SG79: I think it's not a bad idea for console manufacturers to eliminate the hard drive necessity as an internal/addon periphery to the console itself, reducing its size and weight.

My best recommendation to Sony and Microsoft for the next-generation console design:

Develop an external hard drive kit that can only interface with your respective propietary hardware. When a PC/third party Hard Drive (SATA, of course) is installed into said kit and powered on for the first time, the console interface system automatically wipes the HDD if it does not detect a proper serial key generated by the console's CPU unit.

Following that, the hard drive is then reformatted in an encrypted file format that can only be unlocked by a "regenerating" key in the PS/Xbox chipset. This would, in theory, ensure that users cannot "hack" the stored content to their desires - in fact, attempting to connect such a thing to a PC without the necessary hardware interface (such as a hardware development kit) would immediately wipe the hard drive.

Of course, there would be ample warnings to any hack-attempters - such as the unit giving a visible warning on the computer, or an audio warning telling you to disconnect the unit from the computer before time runs out. "Woop, woop. Disconnect the Unit, Thirty Seconds to Hard Drive Deletion. Woop. Woop," and such.

Such a key would also allow users to be able to share the external drive between two or more of the same console without losing that data. (IE, such as the Microsoft 360 debacle about receiving a new console, and not the Marketplace purchases you had made in the past since purchases are tied directly to the console)

A middleman solution offered by first-party hardware developers in the console market to introduce memory, data and information infrastructure management methods using pre-existing SATA-interface hard drives, is perhaps the best answer to the increasing demand for hard drive space on gaming consoles.

A 1-Terrabyte SATA Drive used as an external console peripheral? Would work if you're a Xbox Live Marketplace whore, or love to take loads, and loads of game screenshots and so on. Alternately, it would enable western MMO developers to take the console market much more seriously.

-NK

NKato

@meandering_drivel:
Wifi is only $100 if you're retarded.
----
I'd personally be fine with 20GB if they'd fucking let developers use it! And, what strikes me as really rediculous, is there is a memory card for the 360. It's 512 MB. You'd think that it would be 10 or 15 bucks right? No. It's fucking $50. So my choices are either $100 for 20 gigs, or $50 for 512 MB. For double the money, you get 40 times the storage space. The fact that MS manages to sell any memory cards at all proves that there are a lot of idiots out there.

gamadaya

@TOCATL: That is all fine and dandy. I have a 2 gig card in my Wii right now but it is for the most part worthless since I can't actually PLAY anything off of it. Microsoft for sure screwed up big time here but Nintendo is even more guilty. They could very easily allow you to play media off the SD slot but they continue to again and again refuse to allow it, and for whatever reason who knows. All I know is that after having to back 20 vc games to a card just to have a little room to dl new channels and such I quit buying games on their service altogether. Its been over 3 months since I have laid down a single wii point for a game and the way I see it, the only person loosing out is Nintendo. Likewise I am constantly checking my HDD on the 360 and deleting every day just download that new demo, it is just rediculous. For wanting to make downloadable content such a huge part of their systems, neither seemed to put much care into it.

daizyujin

WOW! $180 for a 120gb hdd. Somebody's being ripped off and it's not the billionaires.

Thoas

@Chopper_Mike: 2GB sd cards are very cheap now, or meybe they will release a patch so the wii can use a USB HDD, or even better a USBflash storage, the 8gb ones are very cheap now...

TOCATL

@Chopper_Mike: Oh man this has been a problem since like 3 months after getting it for me. The only one that got it right in this respect this gen was Sony. They at least let you use anything you want. Microsoft screwed up big and Nintendo even bigger. This is why both of they have to have a limit on how large their dlc can be.

daizyujin

@mva5580: It's just one of many examples of MS taking the piss with the Xbox 360 unfortunately. Subscription charge for online multiplayer, allowing and encouraging charges for trivial 'DLC', taking the lion's share of royalties from indie devs work published on XBL...the list goes on & on. A backlash is in order.

ErskinPig

.. and the Wii is still dealing with 512Mb O.o

I wanna see how Nintendo will handle the DLC, WiiWare, VC Updates, New Channels and Saves without a HDD. I'm even heraing the complains right now...

Chopper_Mike

Umm, about wresting squirrels... please explain.

gozirah

180 dollars for an 120gb Hard Drive is, beyond words. Why don't they just include a piece of paper with it that says "Thanks a lot, you fucking moron. We appreciate your business, it makes it very easy for us to justify these ridiculous prices."

mva5580

Hey, in the PC world, we're already looking forward for 1 TERRAbyets = 1000GB. I'm still waiting for an affordable price drop, currently just pick up a 500GB. Microsoft constricting console policy is coming to bite them in the ass this time....onwards & BEYOND!!!

"640K ought to be enough for anybody." - Bill Gates, 1981

ahmeng

@comedy:

Fujitsu's releasing one later this year but it's only 4200RPM.

SG79

"Persoanlly I'd rather they just let us use our own, but that's just me."

This is Microsoft we're talking about. They like to control everything with an iridium fist, squeezing our balls and wallets to impotent poverty.

ErskinPig

20 gigs IS too small. hell i have a 60 gig PS3 with only 22 gigs left. that's just game data and games. plus 2 gigs of media.

xbox 120 gig HDD is $180, correct?
2.5" SATA 250 gig HDD is only $120

microsoft charges more...

they should just allow you to use a External HDD instead. cheaper and, well more space.

and why's he so concerned about 20 gigs being too small? is the DLC really that big?

Akmed

Why anyone cares about what Pachter has to say is beyond me.

ErskinPig

nickles and dimes

wifi- 100$

20g hdd - 100$

120g hdd - 180$

XBL for 5 years - 250$

and, let's not forget...

hd-dvd drive- 180 (used to be) now completely useless ;)

meandering_drivel

I would have gotten an elite by now because i have like 3 gigs left on my xbox if it wasnt for the fear i have of losing all saved progress on any game i'v played ever.

But 60Gig seems about right. I mean all i download are tv shows really and i mostly delete them after viewing them. And i have only one xbox original downloaded, so unless someone is downloading every piece of content for every game under the sun then i don't see anyone running out of space for their 60/120 Gig xboxs

ArmyofJuan

dur. there are no 2.5" 500gig hdds. i should have thought 120 would be do-able.
personally thinking of one of those 320gig hdds for my psTriple.

comedy

Persoanlly I'd rather they just let us use our own, but that's just me.

And me. That's why my "20GB" PS3 turned into a 160GB one just about a year ago.

SG79