Well I never said anything about being sane. Though I appreciate the concern. ;)

Now if I had Crisis Core in my hand now, I wouldn't even care about Bully..hehe.

outbackerdave

I don't work for Rockstar, but all I'm saying is there are plenty of good games out there other than Bully. You should just forget about the patch until it comes out cuz it'll only you drive you madder.

mmaadness

Who's the bigger loser? The one making the post or the one reading them then commenting on them?

I simply want my product to work as it was suppose to and I'm not alone. Look around at other sites, plenty of people are ticked about the issue. They were the ones who told us a week, not I. The least they can do is get another PR mouthpiece to give us an update. Yet we don't even get that.

If that irritates you, sorry for that but my comments were not directed to you, just Rockstar, Microsoft, and Mad Doc. Though if you work for one of them in QA, then I guess my comments could be directed to you. I don't know so I guess I will just apologize to you and leave it at that.

outbackerdave

Hey Kotaku, can you see if you can get any word from Rockstar? It's been way over the week they said and we still have nothing.

outbackerdave

I'd rather have them take their time and make the patch perfect than have the patch come out and still cause problems. outbackerdave, You need to do something more productive with your life than wait for a damn patch. Loser.

mmaadness

Ahhh...that's right kiddies, it's 3/17/08 and STILL no patch!

outbackerdave

3/16/08 guess what? No patch!

outbackerdave

3/15/08 and still no patch..batting 1000 Rockstar.

outbackerdave

I just got off the phone with Rockstar support. The guy I spoke with said they don't know when the patch will be ready, but that they are working on it. He also said it would most likely auto-install, if you have Xbox live. Luckily, I have XBL, but I think its really horrible for those who don't. I assume they would have to offer refunds. Here's to saving every fricking second.

aleceiffel

Now it's 3/14/08 and still no patch...Rockstar seriously letting us down here!

outbackerdave

Yet another day goes by and still no patch. Guess another week will go by before they give us one. So it may end up being that two of our weeks equals one Rockstar week.

outbackerdave

This is stuff a beginner QA should have caught. MS, Rockstar, and Mad Doc's QA all missed these issues? Come on, give them more credit than that. They knew but most likely they could not fix the issues before going to press. Thus here we still wait for a fix.

outbackerdave

I really think this is an issue they couldn't have controlled for. Who would have ever thought anything owuld cause issue on old vs. new xbox? It's supposed to be the same experience on either console. Give Rockstar a break. They're fixing it, and on the upside they expose a flaw in the xbox 360 system that will help to keep others from making the same mistakes.

Hooray for progress.

Zombie_Crunch

Yep, gotta love that. 21 freezes now. Can't even go to music class as the game has a serious issue with detecting pressing both buttons at the same time. So you can't get a passing grade because the stupid game won't see it when you press both triggers. So to summerize:

1. Iffy framerates
2. Audio cutting in and out
3. Freezes, stinking annoying freezes!
4. Game not seeing both triggers being pushed in music class.
5. Achievements unlocking by themselves.

Another day, no patch...thanks ever so much R*.

outbackerdave

i wrote somewhere saying it didnt freeze on me. then BAM! froze on me 6 times this weekend.

at least i read about this problem and is saving every day (in game time) which isn't nearly enough as I had to backtrack most of the day most of the time (once i was so pissed, i was on my way to save and sleep at the jock's hideout, got into a fight with jocks and it froze on me!!! ARGH!)

diablofreak

(looks at xbox live)

Nope, no patch yet.

Way to go Rockstar for your patch or lack thereof!

outbackerdave

*looks at Xbox Live*

Nope, no patch yet.

Way to go Rockstar on your 'speedy' patch or lack thereof.

outbackerdave

Same here!!! I got the Halo version and my 1st copy froze on me twice and glitched during a dodge ball match. And, my 2nd copy only froze once in three days.

TheNeptunesFan

Day 8

Consumers Held Hostage!
No Patch Yet From Rockstar!
Game Freezing Faster Then Ohio!
Game Framerates As Erratic as Britney!
Game Audio Cutting In And Out More Than A Bad Campaign Speech!
When Will The Torture End?

Oh wait, the President vetoed the bill that would stop torture. Guess it will never end! Nevermind.

outbackerdave

this is seriously upsetting me. so far, in my short tenure as a 360 owner, i had laughed off the games that didn't work on other people's systems.

i had laughed off this one too, as rockstar was claiming that only old 360's were affected.

in a horrible karmic reaction to my holier-than-thou attitude to game issues, my copy of bully is completely unplayable.

every 2 minutes it freezes. i've only completed 1 mission and must wait until a patch arrives or take it back. arghhhhhhhhh! KARMA!

PGGB

@metallicorphan:

How the blazes is a week 'quickly fixing the problem?'. The dropped the ball, they should have had a fix out before the weekend but nooo, they gotta have their weekends off. Screw the consumer. They have no problems with taking our cash but they sure have an issue with getting a fix out quickly.

Btw Jonas, awesome post!

outbackerdave

Dear RockStar,

We've had some good times together, but recently, you've let yourself go. I'm used to seeing you take the time and dress yourself up nice, and warmly present yourself to me, but recently well, you've kind of gotten a bit fat around the quality control.

I've had you hard freeze once where you have to physically reset your gameplay, and have no further control, including pulling up the system dashboard. I can't stand it when you don't put out.

I've had multiple frame rate hiccups, walk animation issues (where Jimmy will just abjectly spin around for no reason while running straight), and have constant 10 second hiccups while handing flowers to people in the main lobby of the school. I try to show you my love, but you spurn me further.

This is unacceptable, I hold you in the highest regard, but for this pap to issue forth from your tried and true quality tested game-lab-womb, I am unamused.

Girl, you're telling me that it'll be okay in a week's time. I look at all the great games you've put out since having very poor memories of GTA III's glitches, driving around and randomly falling through the ground, and I am seeing a falter in your work. You were doing so well. I ask no quarter and give none, but needless to say, I do not enjoy spending my money on a pleasure that forces me to waste further time replaying the same thing over and over, if I wanted to do that, I'd just put in Devil May Cry 4 again, and be done with it. She's a fiesty senorita.

I love you baby, and some times we say things that hurt, but you're worth it, so don't make me hurt you. I love you so much that I wouldn't be able to stop my love swings of joy into your soft baby blue eyes if you keep on thinking that I'll accept you for your deep down game play. Honey, I'm shallow, I'm all about the looks and how you handle, and right now, taking you out for a spin is about as fun as giving a wolverine a hand job with a scouring pad.

Don't be that way. Come back and make sweet game love.

Yours truly,

Jonas '18 pack of Abs' B.

JonasNG

Okay, I take it back. Frozen! And my console's a six-month old elite. Quelle bummer!

tk.

rocxkstar just went up a notch in my books,sure there shouldnt of been a problem with this title to start with,..but at least rockstar as A) admitted the problem and B)are quick to fix the problem....i am buying this game on monday,i loved it on the ps2,and i am sure i will love it even more on the 360..funnily enough,this will prolly be the last game i want(that i can think off)until GTA4....unless manhunt 2 sees the light of day here in the UK

metallicorphan

@Eric: I have to disagree with you. You're being pretty liberal to a product that is causing a whole lot of people grief and should not have been released as it was. Plus, it had already been established that it was primarily affecting older systems.

What worries me about your comment is something that has been bugging me lately. "OH GOD A GAME CAME OUT ON A CONSOLE AND IT DOESN'T FART KITTENS AND RAINBOWS OUT OF THE BOX." I'm beginning to think that our expectations have gotten a little on the weak side. What we should expect is a game that WORKS. No freezes. No updates. No bullshit. I don't remember Bionic Commando freezing up on me on the NES. Don't think FFVII or Metal Gear Solid ever forced me to restart my system.

Do you see my point?

Smadubaku

@EnigmaNemesis: Agreed. Remember this was the big fear a few years ago. That developers would shit the bed on QA and start releasing with the idea that they could patch it later? It sucks but it is becomming the reality. I think what will turn it around is the idea that most games sell the majority of their lifetime sales in the early going, and if they release a shoddy product, no one will buy. Then again, people seem to gobble up some pretty strange games regardless...

Smadubaku

@BryanGuitarDude: I agree with everything you just said. Is if possible to say such things without sounding like a fanboy?

I LOVE my 360. (fourth due to RROD) But damn! I can't get through lost Odyssey now without a disk read error every ten minutes on the 4th disk. GRRRRR!!!!!!! When will it end??? My PS3? Never had a problem. Guess that extra year accounted for something.

Smadubaku

not to defend rockstar or anything but i mean the 360 as good as the games it might have is still a poorly (rushed) designed console with its share of pretty big problems, and with all the different skus and falcon and monkey butt procs they have in them, it seems like they might as well start testing their games in the many diferent SKUs that ms has released. And this is why people you should never rush a console out or try to "patch up" the console half assed as time goes by cuz it just makes problems for who? for you guys the gamers.

BryanGuitarDude

@Eric:

"OH GOD A GAME CAME OUT ON A CONSOLE AND IT DOESN'T FART KITTENS AND RAINBOWS OUT OF THE BOX."

well... when it came for PS2 it didn't had any issues

Gambare

Things like this should not be allowed to release if it causes these issues.

EnigmaNemesis

@lostpuppies: Totally. I'm just glad we live in an age where you can patch a game post-release. That being said, I haven't had any issues so far, except for girls with mouth sores kissin' on me. Bleeech!

tk.

I can't complain, at least we live in a console age where when the developer fucks up, they can fix their mistakes. Imagine all the crap games that could've been patched back in the day.

Good to see their conscious of the errors and ready to fix them...and can.

lostpuppies

@BadSector:
here here, I've got an elite made late last year and have experienced lockups and audio glitches as well. Such a great game deserves to be bug free.

ca$h

The "older consoles" was BS. I bought a falcon chipset unit a month ago that has locked up. Only once in ~6 hours, but still happened.

BadSector

The game in itself is great, and I'd say anyone who (like me) didn't play it on the PS2 (or didn't have a PS2) would do well to buy it.

But in levels of polish, of graphics, stability and all, it's all so very last-gen.

But those technical issues will, for most, not hinder the core fun of the game significantly. Like, for instance, Mass Effect.

Guizzy

OH GOD A GAME CAME OUT ON A CONSOLE AND IT DOESN'T FART KITTENS AND RAINBOWS OUT OF THE BOX.

Honestly, these overreactions are quite irritating. From a technical perspective, porting games is harder than developing new ones. It's not just a matter of "The 360 is more powerful so it should be able to run PS2 games easily." While the system hardware is perfectly capable of displaying the number of polygons and the complexity of the textures and whatnot, the code behiind it all is completely different, and making it run on another platform is by no means easy. It's like trying to make Legos fit into an Erector set.

Having issues with console games is nothing new, and the only reason it's more common these days is because as the technology progresses so will the complexity of the software, and more unpredictable problems will arise. I can only assume that Rockstar (who have developed some of my all-time favorite video games) is not trying to rush sub-par software out the door just to make a quick buck. If they did know about the problems, why the fuck would they go gold with it instead of taking an extra week or so to fix the issue first. Believe it or not, most studios try to make good games, and Rockstar's track record speaks for itself.

I played the game for like 10 hours straight yesterday and it froze on me once. Aside from the single freeze (which happens now and then with any game), I haven't experienced any noticeable problems other than some low framerates here and there. Not sure why people complain about saving when the save point is literally 4 feet away from the bed that the character has to sleep in every day. My hardware is new though (I only just got a 360 about a month ago), perhaps the problem is really bad for people with older systems.

Eric

"While I'm sure we all appreciate the rapid response, next time try to make sure your game works before selling it to people, 'kay?"

How's about the company that made the system it's on make sure the fucking console works before they sell to people; let's try that.

EvoAnubis

I don't think things like this are excusable. If I wanted to buy software that would need patching I would just go ahead and buy _insert favorite whipping boy_.
But, all kidding aside, being able to patch things up is not a good reason for being lazy. If you're shipping games which have fatal flaws in them, you really ought to take a step back and properly look at what you're doing.

Channing

Very odd, they say older systems has this issue, that's not correct. I've tried it on my Halo 3 360, my buds brand new elite (less than a week old), and my neighbors launch day 360. Each of them has the same issues but they occur randomly. So RS excuse saying it happens to 'older 360's' is seriously incorrect.

outbackerdave

I hadn't had any audio issues, but the framerate for cutscenes was horrible and the game did freeze on me. I haven't bothered trying to play it again since it froze.

nox

a sad sign indeed. they need to do more QA testing before shipping the damn products out

how hard is that, get one or two testers with 2 360s, test it by playing the game through once or twice!

i doubt anyone tested Bully SE

just because most people have an internet connection, doesn't mean you can get lazy and ship out untested/unfinished products and expect consumers to pay full price for it

diablofreak

I'm guessing the "problem with older 360s" is complete BS. There are really no substantialy differences between old hardware and new hardware from a game's perspective (cooling, power consumption- yes). Plus, the QA guys usually get the older dev systems so it likely was tested on the older hardware. My guess is Rockstar didn't want to delve into the specifics and just said "older 360s" which could be like the cache issue we saw in Oblivion. People having problems should try manually clearing their HDD cache or playing without the HDD altogether and see if the problems go away.

TrettOff

I know you were kidding, Fahey, but don't be too hard on console developers. As these machines increase in both functionality and complexity, console developers have to deal the same issues PC developers have been "patching" for years, only they must also check Microsoft / Sony Technical Console Standards requirements (a complete pain in the arse, believe me), and they're required to squeeze all this into the typical console release schedule, and they must get it perfect the first time or risk a shitstorm. If anything it's a surprise MORE games don't get released with these kinds of oversights. This unholy marriage of console technical and quality standards on (essentially) PC software is already seriously starting to undermine the quality of titles. And the bugs will only get worse. Knowing you can patch a title, no matter how "horrifying" it is to developers, just makes executives rub their hands in glee, because they can meet their schedules and just fix it later.

Sustenance

@Komrade_Kayce:

You need just an internet connection. Dial-up through a router to the Xbox would still connect you.

Xirj

@maxax: - "I still remember the times when we played games on consoles to avoid this shit."

Isn't that the truth. It's fucking ridiculous and completely uncalled for when a console game needs a patch. Usually PC game companies have to test their game to make sure that it scales well on many different PCs, and even then they still have to patch up some issues. But a console doesn't have that problem, it's all the same architecture .... so what gives? Are companies just not play testing these damn games or what?! Where's the fucking quality assurance these days?

dead_red_eyes

It's very disappointing to know that developers are using the concept of DLC as a safety net for qaulity control.

Please do it once and do it right. It's as simple as that.

german-s

Console owners are having the same issues as PC gamers. I remember all the games i played on PC (well, i still play) and there were some like for example Daikatana which didn't work out of the box, so you had to wait for the patch. Guess we don't care anymore and that's why companies just rush the games even if not fully tested (or even missing content).

I liked console games because they worked very well at very good performance, if not, you return it or just don't buy. But now it's the same burden. DLC is cool to add content or minor problems, but now you can really see they don't really test the games. Can you miss the freezing/lockups? i mean, even a person working in QA for the first time can't miss those problems.

Tech Support Guy: "Oh sorry sir, yes, you picked Guitar Hero IV and there is no audio from the game and screen is flipped, don't worry, patch will be out shortly".

(yes, i'm still mad about the audio problem in GH3 Wii version)

KamuZ

Looks like people without access to Xbox Live and a hard drive are screwed.

garytek

@Komrade_Kayce: @maxax: @Mr.SithNinja:

I imagine if loack of internet connection and memory storage was a problem you could get Rockstar to replace the disk.

SAKY

I don't understand how the game can be so wildly different on old 360 revisions. I wasn't aware there were really any major revisions since launch systems and I thought that was only shrinkage of chips and better cooling. To my knowledge, no other game has has problems with this and I'd be interested to know the technical details as to what the issue is. Has anyone experienced the issues on a recent 360? If Rockstar aren't piling out the PR bullshit, then the least they could do is be fully honest and explain the technical issue.

shufflemoomin

Ok so what happens to all the cheap a$$es who don't have a HDD? Do they have to store that patch on their Memory Card? Can you even DL str8 to a mem card?

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!! That will teach them to get jobs so they can afford hard drives!!!! BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!

Mr.SithNinja

@maxax: Well, yeah, but it didn't bother me much at all. It also happened the first night, before I knew of a widespread problem.

Collapse The Control

I don't think you can really beat up R* for this. They never put out buggy games, in fact, this is the only one I can remember that had any real issues...

Rizzo88

@Collapse The Control:
Honestly, 1 freeze is already way too much.

maxax

@nlyonssmith: I was thinking the same thing. Sounds kinda fishy that they can bang out a patch to fix multiple problems within a couple of days. At least they fessed' up and are trying to take care of it quickly.

mydogisdexter

This game was great on PS2 and I'll probably rent it for the 360 just for the achievements. Good on Rockstar for dealing with this pronto.

DaPress

I'm 6 hours in with 13 achievements and I only had 1 freeze issue within the first hour or so, nothing since.

I just save the game often just to be safe.

Great game, great fun!

Collapse The Control

you'd think porting a ps2 game to the 360 would be an incredibly easy task... this is nearing the precipice of mental retardation.

meandering_drivel

And maybe because of the constant flux of Hardware sets/SKU's that get shipped. Thank god that these things can get patched at least for those who got a HD in their system or is it possible on all SKU's?

bOOmStiCK83

At the very least they were quick to address the problem. I just hope they are truly able to correct the issues. I really enjoyed this game on the ps2 and didnt get the chance to finish it, so I was very excited to pick this up for my 360...Intersetingly I was relieved to discover it was the game and not my system red ringing again!

ALLoGISTIC1

@kickass solo(my GT): The 360 has been around the longest out of all the current gen machines. If anything it should be getting easier to develop for, much less port to.

bleeps

I don't understand why everyone is so upset. It seems like they were being honest about not being aware of the problem with older 360s and have addressed the problem quicker than most would. Sure it sucks...but would you rather they just leave it broken? Obviously there is a bigger issue of compatibility with older machines that maybe MS needs address, but I think Rockstar should be commended for admiting and fixing the problem so quickly.

Datacide

i don't think this is a problem caused by the ability to fix games after their release. i think its a problem that was prevalent in pretty much all generations of gaming, but just got progressively worse as the technology of the consoles got harder and harder to develop for.

kickass solo(my GT)

I thought MS had a policy against "fix" patches to discourage releasing incomplete products? They might need to roll content into this Fix as well? Yeah I use consoles because I was sick of buying broken games. But then again the 360 is a OFTEN broken console so broken games are par for the course?

kingmanic

@SAGA:A bit too late for that now. I imagine GTA4 will have a patch in the first couple months.

Jim Reilly

Mine still hasn't had any problems. This patch better not screw mine up!

Benjamin Linus

Good one for Rockstar, well done. :)

BWolf06

i bought it yesterday and i hope they release the patch for this...like soon!

NocturnOwl357

@maxax: Yeah they were good times, when games came out shitty and devs could do nothing to fix it for early adopters. Good times indeed.

slomo788

Hopefully this will be good in the long run, as now Rockstar will probably test GTA IV on older launch 360's

SAGA

@maxax: Ain't that the truth? I fear for the day when consoles become PC-ified to the point where you buy a game just to find out you need to upgrade your video card or RAM to run it.

I'm a PC gamer at heart, but I go to consoles to avoid worrying about system specs.

ShaggE

At least they are getting to it quickly... I'm still waiting on the analog patch for Lair.

Part-Time-Viking

@maxax:

Im assuming the patch would be a small one, and thus could go to a memory card.

But you're absolutely correct. wtf is this bullshit, Rockstar.

Komrade_Kayce

Did the Wii version have an issue?

Setzer IIDX

Is this game worth buying again for either the 360 or Wii? cause Ive already beat the PS2 version 100% ages ago but does the extras in the new ones make up for it on the other consoles?

MURDERFACE

Rapid response, as in they knew there were problems and were already working on it?

nlyonssmith

Would this have ever happened if DLC patches weren't part of console gaming now? I'm pretty sure that's what everyone was worried about... half baked games and 'we'll fix it later' attitudes.

Perdew

I still remember the times when we played games on consoles to avoid this shit.
Those were good times.

What do people without HDs do in this case anyway?

maxax

So, allow me to put the obvious on everyones mind question out there:

What happens to the Troglodytes with a 360 and no high speed internet (like my father)?

Komrade_Kayce