editorial
The Xbox Live Police
Posted by Luke Plunkett at 4:00 AM on March 15, 2008
For the civil, Xbox Live can be a wondrous place. Chatting with friends, gaming with loved ones over vast distances, the crossing of cultural and national borders, it's just great. Indeed, it's probably the strongest weapon in Microsoft's console wars arsenal. Thing is, a lot of people on Xbox Live aren't civil. They're Asshats. And I'll have you note that's with a capital "A". Bigotry, unfair play and general, well, asshattery amongst a lot of users mean that for every pleasant experience on Xbox Live you may well end up having one that's thoroughly unpleasant. Maybe even offensive.
Which is where Stephen "Stepto" Toulouse (pictured, above) and his Xbox Live Police step in. Employed to fight injustice wherever it is found, serve the law and protect the (gold subscription customers') public trust, Toulouse and his team are responsible for policing Xbox Live and enforcing its code of conduct policies across the globe. In other words, when you complain about someone over Xbox Live, the complaint goes to them. And if you get banned from Xbox Live, they're the ones who banned you.
Working mostly out of Microsoft's Redmond HQ (though some members are spread across the globe), the Xbox Live Policy Team and Toulouse, the team's Lead Program Manager are the guys responsible for - as their name suggests - overseeing the policing of Xbox Live so that, as Toulouse puts it, "members have a positive experience while using the service". They work "365 days a year", and even "process complaints even on holidays". Which they must. Because crime never sleeps.
Stepto's quick to stress that the majority of players have nothing but great experiences on Xbox Live. But Microsoft will also be the first to admit that, as their company stance on offensive XBL users states, when it comes to communication over the internet "unfortunately some of it can be negative". Those engaging in negative communications are the ones that come to the attention of the Policy Team, who have a variety of methods for both catching and dealing with anyone violating the service's guidelines.
COMPLAINTS: The first, and most obvious means of discovering and punishing offensive gamers are via public complaints. With millions of XBL users, this might seem like a huge undertaking, but Toulouse says that, thankfully, the vast majority of them are bogus, submitted either due to mistake or a player having a whine when they lose a game fair and square. Oh, and to those who feel like they're achieving something by hammering away 50 complaints against the same user in a night, you're not: the Policy Team's system screens for duplicate complaints and automatically bins them.
Any complaint that's not a duplicate, however, gets looked at. Every single one. In many cases, the violation is clear, and they can move on to any possible punitive steps. But for others, things can get messy. Where does good-natured shit-talking end and genuine offensive behaviour begin? Just because someone finds something offensive, does that mean it is offensive?
"Context can be a challenge", Toulouse says. "There's no context to tell someone your motto is a joke. What might not get a single complaint in one type of game suddenly might get a bunch of complaints in a more family friendly game. Even words you might hear in prime time television can be in violation of our Code of Conduct".
In these cases, the team has what Toulouse calls "online resources" to fall back on and consult with. Dictionaries, encyclopaedias, things like that. "But those resources are just simple guidelines", he says, "not the final authority. In the end, my team uses our best judgement in many instances on what violates the Code of Conduct". "Best Judgement" means they often will talk the more difficult cases over as a team, exploring whether the source of a complaint is in the intent of the accused, or simply the perception of those issuing the complaint.
Interestingly, Toulouse says that the volume of complaints is always consistent, and that he and his team are able to work through every complaint during a day's work, so as not to create a backlog. If the numbers are consistent, and don't spike on weekends or holidays, it says a lot about the kind of people that are gaming enough on Xbox Live to be issuing or causing complaints: they don't leave the house very often.
UNDERCOVER AGENTS: While the majority of complaints and disciplinary action result from user complaints - it's impossible to actively police that many users and games, after all - the Policy Team do engage in a spot of undercover work. Stepto says these are "employees who are out there on the system actually gaming and watching for situations where it's clear someone is impacting the LIVE experience negatively for everyone, or clearly violating the Terms of Use or Code of Conduct".
They don't just sit around playing Halo 3 all day, either: they play all kinds of games at all times of the day in order to best cover the entire spectrum of Xbox Live matches. So the next time you're at home, lose a PGR4 race and are about to let fly with a torrent of naughty words, remember: they could be watching you. Listening to you. At that very moment. And they're not just in the US, either, Microsoft have these guys spread out all over the world.
But it's not just cussing that can bring the hammer down. There are all kinds of things you can do that will cause other gamers to issue a complaint against you, and all kinds of things will give the Policy Team grounds to limit or even ban your account.
Boobs, for example. If it pops up in your Gamertag, or your bio, that's not cool. And no, you can't hide it. The Policy Team spend a lot of time labouring over alternative and slang spellings for naughty words (even going so far as to research global variations on offensive terms), so b00bs, 800bs and Bo0b5 are all just as bad. As are the Spanish, Korean and Latvian alternatives. If you're caught with a word like that in your Gamertag, you won't be able to sign into XBL again until you change it. If you're caught with it in something like your bio, it'll be automatically deleted.
(NSFW)
Those kind of issues are the minor ones. The more troubling, and more offensive stuff (like racism, religious intolerance, sexism, homophobia, etc), comes from the 360's ability to use voice and - in some cases - video chat. While big-time games like Halo 3 and Gears of War are naturally rife with douche bags, Toulouse also says you'd be surprised where else complaints can turn up. Uno, for example. Which uses the 360's camera. Let's just say the Policy Team are not big fans of genital footage.
Some of the more base-level stuff can result in temporary voice-bans. Repeat offences or really serious stuff, however? Your punishment will severe, Stepto saying that if you're guilty of this you can be "suspended from accessing the service either temporarily or, in very rare cases, for good". Which they're perfectly entitled to do, by the way, as when you pay your Gold subscription, you're also signing onto Microsoft's guidelines for XBL, which state that if you break the rules, they can break your account.
Though that happens, Stepto assures me, very, very rarely.

Comments (AU Comments · US Comments)
Coldplayer
Posted March 16, 2008 1:21 AM
That was an awesome article! It's good to actually know that there are these men and women out there cleaning up the trash.
What we really need is to have the above video shown on ads on TV, so those doosh-bags are well aware that they are being watched.
I got a lot of respect for u foke.
Ken
Posted March 16, 2008 11:24 AM
That should have an option to select to complain about a person flashing their d*ck on UNO
Edidid
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@WatershipDown: You are completely correct. Sad sign of the times though.
The whole "I can do whatever I want on the internet" feeling is what has really destroyed many promising concepts from social networking to wikipedia. All great ideas negated by the user base.
Edidid
Kojiro
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Purple-Penguin: I'd LOVE that job, seriously. But I would probably get fired, for perma-banning every ten minutes.
Kojiro
SeeOne
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@JustThisGuy:
I agree with you completely. People should be sensitive to the context and history of the expletives they use. If someone uses the N-word, they should be sensitive to what that means and how it makes people feel, even if it means nothing to you personally.
Now let's talk about your use of "Christ" as an "alternative swear word"
SeeOne
SeeOne
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@I_Hate_This_Place:
I'm with you on the mute. Now if MS could just make is really easy (and consistent) to mute people.
They did a fine job with Halo 3 (I can silence the morons in a couple seconds), vs. CoD4, which isn't so elegant
SeeOne
robinandtami
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@valleyshrew:
There's a world of difference between "feeling" how you want to about others, and verbally harrassing others. As for words like "fag" and "nigger" being just another cuss word like "shit" and "hell" ..... Are you serious? Really? I guess you've never had your local christian youth group scream things like "you fags are going to hell, you should all die" at you through a megaphone while you were just walking down the street in the "gay" section of town. Free speech does not = verbal harrasment.
robinandtami
inphanta
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Wow. And people wonder why Nintendo doesn't put voice chat in its games.
inphanta
invisiblewok
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
no need to call valleyshrew any names, just call it like you see it. S/he is the person saying these things that people like me hit the file complaint button all the time.
invisiblewok
invisiblewok
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@dabu: because more people join xbl everyday?
invisiblewok
Pornosaur
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Valleyshrew is a complete an utter douchebag and not getting point one of this post. (free speech) I don't think you can make that point about a service that costs money to be on that clearly states they will ban-monday your ass regardless of the amount of money you have given them.
Pornosaur
Blake Snow
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Nice read, Luke. I simply refuse to use my headset for this very reason.
Blake Snow
JustThisGuy
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@valleyshrew: Oh, Christ. This isn't a violation of free speech. You have no right to free speech on a private service that you essentially signed into a contract with. MS is perfectly within their rights to ban/suspend anyone they wish, if the conduct violates the TOS.
Free speech only guarantees that the government won't censor you (more or less, exceptions abound, etc. etc.). MS has absolutely no obligation to let you say whatever you please.
Also, for the record: go up to a black stranger and call them a "nigger." Go up to a homosexual stranger and call them a "fag." See what happens. Learn a lesson. These are not just "alternative swear words." They're hateful pejoratives with a very long history that should not and must not be forgotten.
Really: "alternative swear words?" Do you scream "motherfucking nigger" when you stub your toe? Please. Grow the fuck up.
JustThisGuy
fullmetal7
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@valleyshrew: They can think and feel any way they want but harassing and insulting others is what's wrong. Come on, use your brain, moron.
fullmetal7
gusiskirby
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
They said some pretty horrible things to the guy in that video.
gusiskirby
Glare
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
The nerdiest police ever then?
Glare
Mr. Pie
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@valleyshrew:
"Homophobes aren't doing anything wrong, they have every right to feel any way they want about anyone else"
They are not doing anything wrogn UNTILL they start shouting inapropriate slogans, insulting and shouting "YOU'RE A F*G!" to whoever is their target of their ignorance at the moment. The same applies to racism.
I won't even start telling how many times i've heard "lol!1!! you are eurotrash!!1!lolol!1lol, eurotard!" etc etc.
Not sharing someone's life style/religion/ideals... doesn't necessarily mean they've got to hate that someone, or humiliate that someone.
And I think we're losing the focus on the article.
Mr. Pie
VAMP
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I wonder how effectively these guys can do their job considering that Live users are paying customers and are entitled to certain consumer rights. It seems to me like they'd have an easier time filtering out the douchebags if Live were free.
VAMP
valleyshrew
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
This strikes me as unfair and a violation of freedom of speech. You can always mute people, I think swearing is good in games like call of duty. Surely they don't ban people for swearing in games where killing is the objective? I like that people feel free to say what they want on the internet. Words such as "fag" and "nigger" are no longer hateful, they're just alternative swear words with no meaning, like bastard or dickhead.
@Atheist Jew:
"People should be permanently banned far more often. The ratio of douche bags to non-douche bags is off the fucking charts, and bigots, fascists, homophobes, and other scum should have the privilege of XBL taken away on the FIRST offense."
Bullshit, we're all bigots about some things. I suppose you want them kicked out of the country too? What you're saying is bigotry. Homophobes aren't doing anything wrong, they have every right to feel any way they want about anyone else. If someone said on xbox live that "happy is he who seizes your children and smashes them against the rocks!" would you get offended? Would you ban someone for being Jewish and quoting their scripture? It's funny you complain about fascism as this is exactly what fascist people want, to ban things. "I may not agree with what they're saying but I'll defend to the death their right to say it." I understand free speech rules don't apply in a private service but in violent games they certainly should. It strikes me as consistent with your ideals that you would make GTA illegal. You're a hypocrite.
valleyshrew
Kickstone
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Xbox Live if full of idiots...but it makes me laugh how a lot of people get hung up on it. I never mute people for no reason or set it to friends-only chat, we call that biting your nose off to spite your face. Unfortunately in the world of online video games, especially console fps's, you get a high proportion of adolescent fools. I'm not going to get stressed about it though. Just mute them when they start shouting off. But I wouldn't mute everyone as soon as I enter a room, I don't let it bug me that much. In fact, I tend to find myself laughing at it. Laugh at them and they soon shut up.
And the only reason I think PSN hasn't got it is because their service isn't a patch on Xbox. But don't worry, all the idiots will be on there soon enough.
Kickstone
lionkitten
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@N-Bomb: Extreme foul language is inappropriate in M-rated games or T-rated games on Live because it violates the Terms of Service. It doesn't matter what game you're in. If someone violates the T.O.S. they can/should be reported, just like a banhammer Monday here on kotaku.
lionkitten
lionkitten
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
To those commenting on inappropriate gamertags and mottos - this same guy (or one of his teammates) the article's about was on Major Nelson's podcast, and he said that the filter doesn't catch all the leet speak and stuff all the time and they can't possibly just scroll through every one of the millions of tags.
But if you report the tag or motto they look at every one that comes in. So if you see "j3w ki113r 360" or whatever, you need to report it and it will be gone.
I reported a couple and tried to search for them on xbox.com later and it said they did not exist or "no gamertag found" or whatever the message is.
The way to make it better is to use the system.
lionkitten
N-Bomb
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@illdaddyj:
I think you have a point. When complaints are reviewed, I wonder if the game's age rating is taken into account.
Foul language in an M game would be more acceptable, IMO, than foul language in a T or E game.
N-Bomb
Collapse The Control
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Norellicus: Maybe, but like I said, I don't talk shit unless they start it. I will throw down a comment first and then the shitstorm brews at times. I never leave feedback unless the players talk a lot of shit and don't back it up.
Example, everytime i'm on COD4, we'll have a group of guys come in and say the usual "we're gonna beat you noobs" and we reply with "You will not win, you're garbage!" Then the insults fly for about 20 seconds (mother this, fag that) and the match starts. About 2 minutes into any match we get a massive lead and they drop out like bitches.
Feedback time.
Of course i'm not talking about COMPLAINTS, it is different for that, you have to be a complete and utter d-bag or cheater for me to file a complaint.
Collapse The Control
khronos27
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
lol undercover my ass, microsoft aint that smart.
the guys' gamertags will probly be like "XBL-Policy-Team Frank".
khronos27
I_Hate_This_Place
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@robinandtami: Thats weird, because I tried to put a religious phrase in my motto and it wouldn't let me. Then again, a guy on my friendslsit is named "RunawayJesus" with a motto that says "What Judas whispered..."
So maybe it was just a fluke for me. Oh Well, I would think they would ban all mention of religion in a gamertag, but it could very well be due the the spanish name "jesus" also.
I_Hate_This_Place
iamnotdryad
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
itt: we get our panties in a twist over words
iamnotdryad
WatershipDown
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
This isn't Xbox live. This is the anonymous internet.
WatershipDown
UncleScrotar
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Give a 13 year old a mic when he doesn't have to show his face and this is what you get. I've only just begun (to liiivvvvvee) to get paired with douchers in CoD4, previously doucheness had only been experienced in Halo. It's funny for the first 10 seconds, and then everyone's a tough guy. I always mute all unless i'm playing with folks on my friends list, and my skills usually speak loud enough for me. When i'm getting 40 kills with 5 deaths it's time for you to shut up...
UncleScrotar
adventchild08
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I think the first step to reducing asshattery and douchebaggery on live is to ban the word pwned and all of its variation. And disallow references to 420 in gamertags (we get it: you like weed).
adventchild08
Norellicus
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Collapse The Control: Actually, I'm pretty sure they're flagging you to avoid because they don't want to hear you talk like an assmunch.
Kind of takes the fun out of the game period, win or lose. Cause they probably figure like I do, that if you lose there's gonna be a verbal shitstorm out of it, and nobody wants to listen to that.
Norellicus
Pornosaur
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I got the same user ID that I use here banned I guess for being offensive. Seems pretty tame to me but oh well, they should probably hire about 10x as many people as they have now. Call of Duty 4 since chrismtas has turned into the "counterstrike" of consoles. It's the new haven for racisists, singing into the mic 11 year olds, and whining 15 year olds. Oh yeah and ban everyone on Winning eleven 07 that I swear is turning torrents on when I have the ball on offense, then the game play magically goes lag free once I lose it :P
Pornosaur
reptile168
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Xbox live users are indeed uncivilized. One dude rated me negatively and used the excuse of "inappropriate language" but I never used my mic -_-
reptile168
Archaic Stigma
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I hope they do something I've had to but up with a lot of BS while playing Halo 3 and such.
-AS
Archaic Stigma
cavingman
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
awesome, so the guy that repeatedly drops the n-bomb all the time, who i added to my friend list after reporting just so see what happened. the guy who i play with every once in awhile just to hear him say the n-word ALL THE TIME... these guys are the reason he's still there.
just, awesome job guys.
cavingman
robinandtami
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@I_Hate_This_Place:
I don't think so. I had a friend that had the gamertag JesusDied4U. Again, something that would clearly be against XBox Live terms of service on the grounds that it could incite bigotry, but again, I don't think they would ever actually ban that tag. Selective enforcement is my beef.
robinandtami
Mr. Pie
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
While I agree with most of the article, I must say sometimes is really difficult not to get carried away when your playing with certain kind of people. I mean: for example, there are some guys playing COD4 that , ''just for fun'' start shooting at teammates (not killing, just SHOOTING at them with a low powered gun) ALL rounds, ALL maps...
Oh boy, after a couple of maps you want to call him ''pretty things''. After 4 or 5 maps, you just need to tell him how much you love him, and, oh, in the name of mario bros, after 8 maps, you HAVE to crush his skull with his controller... I don't know if you get my point here :/
Anyways, I'm not THAT much obsessed with gaming to just get mad and yell at some random teenager over an argument in a videogame, and I really pity those who just insult, threaten, make fun of others through xboxlive or (insert any online gaming service here), even if they're just kids. PARENTS, GET YOUR EYES ON THEM, DAMNIT! :P
Mr. Pie
sbarbati
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
They've gone a little too far with researching ways to cut out certain words. For instance: Basement is a term not allowed anywhere in your profile. Why, you may ask? Ba-semen-t. It took me and my friend hours to figure out why it wouldn't let us use that word in his profile.
sbarbati
OrionTheSmiter
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Am I the only one who wishes it would happen 'very very often?' rather than very rarely?
OrionTheSmiter
thoruen
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I'm guessing that the Communications Assistance for Law Enforcement Act allows the FBI into xbox live pretty easily. for more info on the Communications Assistance for Law Enforcement Act go to Wikipeda.
[en.wikipedia.org]
thoruen
Bruce Skillis
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@TheHun: I don't know if I'd be willing to compare trash talking on Live to trash talking on a Basketball court. If you're some skinny ass 12-year-old whimp on the basketball court and you start talking trash, you're fixing to get a new asshole stomped in. Then again, I played hockey as a kid, a sport where you fight for fun, usually without any animosity.
The point of this whole story/discussion is the fact that good-natured, polite gamers trying to have a good time shouldn't HAVE to deal with morons.
I took a few years off Live, got hooked on WoW, and when I quit WoW and started playing on Live again, the difference in the communities was astounding. Live is like the puberty of the online gaming world.
Bruce Skillis
Gam3r
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Wow those guys in the video are pathetically lame, stupid, and yet they think they're so cool. It's ridiculous and laughable at the same time.
Gam3r
OT79
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
In the PSN I'll almost never found a lame-ass talking.
OT79
I_Hate_This_Place
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@robinandtami: Garuntee that would be reverse if it said "ChristianGamer". Anyway, I think LIVE has a program that detects any religious language in a gamertag, and won't let you use any name involving religion. As always, there are ways around it, but its rare
I_Hate_This_Place
dabu
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@TiberianViper: LOL, you regret not being able to use racially offensive words because "hard-core" bigots use them too much? Dood, ur smart!
And to the fools who think muting is the option- there's no reason rational, sensible people should be excluded from using the online service FULLY because loud-mouthed nitwits enjoy trying to offend/anger as many people as possible.
dabu
thoruen
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I really want to know if AT&T & Verizon are giving access to our voice conversations and text messages is Microsoft doing the same thing? I know they're not the same type of services but do the Xbox live police call the local police if they happen to catch a text message or her a conversation that may seem like a crime is going to occur? What are Microsoft's policies on conversations about drug use?
I have at least 15 friends that have 420 in their gamertag or some other reference to something called "pot".
would turning in all the drug users drastically reduce their subscription rates?
thoruen
ShaggE
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@TheHun: There's a difference between talking shit and being an insufferable prick. Shit talking is perfectly acceptable, and is 99% of the time all in good fun.
On the other hand, bigotry and mic spamming falls under "being an insufferable prick".
ShaggE
thoruen
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@TheHun:
He's right, why should you ruin someone else's fun of being an a$$hat?
If TheHun where to walk by me with an ice cream cone and I decide to take a crap on it, he should shut up and eat it or, go somewhere else if he doesn't want crapped on ice cream.
thoruen
tonjohn
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Naurgul:
Stalker.
tonjohn
Amiash
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
ow well, atleast we know that someone outthere is doing their job!
Amiash
Tull
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
As for gamertags what if someone makes their SonySux...I'm sure there's a Sony fan who also plays on Live who will find that offensive (why, no idea, but the chance exist) then should that gamertag be banned?
Tull
robinandtami
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Dude From Dubai:
MuslimGamer would not be in and of itself offensive. If it were MuslimGamerSux... then yes. And I think it should be up to you if you want to make yourself a target. Gamertags should not be banned unless the tags themselves are offensive.
robinandtami
wisconsinista
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
PSN needs this now. Or alternatively just ban the "myspace generation" who seemingly do whatever is necessary to get attention (singing, dropping the n-bomb, calling everything "gay" etc.)
wisconsinista
Naurgul
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
BurtonJ from Valve needs to be featured in a similar article. He's the guy that disables Steam accounts. Rumour has it that each time he's done with his work, the users database ends up surprisingly thin.
Naurgul
Ma9nuM
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Who polices Microsoft Support though? I am still pissed that my Gold account was broken for a month. I logged about 100 phone calls trying to get my corrupted account fixed. Every call I made, I had to explain the same situation over and over and over....they also wanted me to try logging into my account from another xbox over and over and over...
In my opinion, focus less on policing something that can't really be policed and FIX YOUR DAMN TECHNICAL SUPPORT. Apparently there is one guy on the entire planet that can fix a corrupted account, and I guess he doesn't have a phone or an email address.
I didn't even get a "sorry" or an account credit for the month I couldn't use my Live Gold. And to top it off, one of the many techs I spoke with ran me through several steps (unsucessfully), to try to correct my account issue...well he deleted all my saved games.
Problem was on their end the whole time.
Thanks Microsoft!
like the console, hate the company
my 2 cents
Ma9nuM
dead_red_eyes
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
"I also notice that a lot of people say heinous shit at the Call of Duty 4 loading screen because you can't see who's talking."
Isn't that the truth? I finally just got tired of it and started muting everyone but my friends.
dead_red_eyes
SFLegend
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
"Though that happens, Stepto assures me, very, very rarely."
I think I've found the problem!
SFLegend
Charlie Kerfelds Jetsons Tee
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@AnEternalEnigma: And yet names like "J3w Ki113r 420" get to stay around.
I realize the task of policing XBox Live is difficult, but c'mon.
Charlie Kerfelds Jetsons Tee
AnEternalEnigma
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
The idiots are already hitting Condemned 2. I got on the mutliplayer back on Wednesday and in my second game, somebody in the room said, "What's up, dirty n***ers?" I would have sent him feedback, but oops! Monolith didn't put in an indication to see who's talking.
I also notice that a lot of people say heinous shit at the Call of Duty 4 loading screen because you can't see who's talking.
AnEternalEnigma
RickyTV
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
PSN FTW!
RickyTV
FLegion
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Bruce Skillis: I hear you. Trash-talking and the like is totally fine (and should be expected in most cases), but I just can't stand bigotry. Can't we all just kill each other online in peace?! :P
FLegion
NateN
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Trying to keep idiots off the internet, even the private walled garden internet of XBL, must be like digging a hole at the beach with a pitchfork. Yes, you're putting a lot of effort into it, but at the end of the day you probably aren't getting a whole lot done.
NateN
TheHun
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
you are all such whiners, jeez there are plenty of things you can do: mute, report, leave, play with friends.
Online play is competitive, it's like all of you expecting people to be modest, polite on the basketball court. People talk lots of shit, even more so online, when they are anonymous, live with it. You can always go read a book or play offline or anything else.
How about you all just share your gamertags in this thread, so you can play with just the well mannered kotakuettes.
TheHun
XvCowboyvX
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@KindaGamey: I agree that some sort of alternative Gamerzone should be created. I've always played in Recreation and I'm still surprised at the sheer amount of hateful assholes I'm consistently matched up with, Recreation or otherwise.
XvCowboyvX
Atheist Jew
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
People should be permanently banned far more often. The ratio of douche bags to non-douche bags is off the fucking charts, and bigots, fascists, homophobes, and other scum should have the privilege of XBL taken away on the FIRST offense.
Atheist Jew
dilpickies
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I must admit that I am a bit disappointed with this article.
Everything was flowing smoothly, it captured my attention, and there was so much depth... and then it just stopped. This really felt like a great piece of in-depth investigative reporting, but lacking the little part that would make it fantastic.
This could have been an awesome feature story. All it needs is a day of Luke working with the undercover team. Make it a narrative. "My Day With the Xbox Live Police," or whatnot. Kind of like a ride-along with Cops: Intertubes, if you will. Go with them into an Uno sting. See them in action as they decide to take a Halo 3 asshat down. Slow motion non-steadycam banhammer action!
I know you guys are constantly under deadline pressures (broadcast reporting spouse here), and I'm sure they're exacerbated by the constant updating focus of Kotaku, but this story really just needed another day or so to add that extra little oomf to make it shine as a feature. As it stands, very solid. But man, when I think about what could have been...
That said, kudos to Luke for the solid piece.
dilpickies
doubtful
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Crack:
Genital footage on Uno??? Sweet baby moses.
Yeah, it gets pretty rough when you play a Draw Four Wild on someone.
@dabu:
If they've been operating for so long, then how come there's been no appreciable decrease in asshattery?
Greater Internet Dickwad Theory's transitive properties?
@wildknight:
Personally I think they need to bring down the Perma-Banhammer down more often.
Live is too important for them to go banning paying customers.
doubtful
hotfiredude123
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Mildly offensive is the way to go.
Par exemple, the gamertag 'I HATE UGLIES'
Though i think some stupidly articulate and ruggedly good looking person may have already taken it..
hotfiredude123
XvCowboyvX
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Surprisingly, the only game I've played in which I suffered the worst verbal abuse was Uno on XBLA. It boggled my mind--trash talking? On Uno? Some guy tore into me for using a wild card incorrectly. I'd expect that kind of thing in CoD4 or Halo 3..not family friendly card games.
XvCowboyvX
Collapse The Control
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Hagame: also, with the 67% avoided, majority of it is from because when people lose they avoid the person. And out of every 20 games I play with friends we'd win 19, so I get a lot of avoids because people just don't want to play & lose again.
Collapse The Control
KindaGamey
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
My comment on that youtube video:
How hypocritical -- Halo 3 is one of the most homo-erotic games out there. "Come over here and get on my warthog!" "I'm riding the man cannon!" "He just stuck me from behind!" If I ever have the time I'll make a video of all of the gay Halo innuendo I hear. Listen out for it next time.
KindaGamey
TiberianViper
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
a bit off topic, but dya know what i hate?
bigots.
not for the usual reasons, but for ruining so many good insults.
take the big two for example, ni**er and fa**ot.
horrible, ignorant terms... that sound really offensive.
now imagine they didn't have anything to do with skin color or sexual preference.. imagine they were as plainly insulting to anyone as calling them an a**hole or a dickhead.
if only you could call just anybody a ni**er or a fa**ot, for that extra "F**K YOU!" factor... like an upgrade to the word 'moron,' with just the intent to insult.
such horribly, awesomely offensive terms, and i cant use them because they have roots set in bigotry.
oh well, guess ill stick with a**hole.
TiberianViper
smitty1123
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Bon5ai: Elaborate please. The constitution outlines what the US government can't do. I really don't see how this is even remotely relevant to what Microsoft does with it's private property and services.
smitty1123
Bruce Skillis
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I'm pretty thick skinned, so good-natured trash talk is a part of the game for me, and it's weird when there's not a bit of trash talk. The key word there is "good-natured."
I don't think it's "whining" to complain when someone is throwing around racial slurs or the ever popular "faggot," mainly because shit like that is just in bad taste. If you want to be a tactless asshole, be my guest, but if you do it around me, I'm going to call you out/report you/do whatever I can to get you banned. I go on Live to play games and have fun, not to be swore at by some squeaky voiced 13 year old who has the world's worst parents.
As some other people said, I have a few friends with accents, one of them is from Spain, another from Barbados, so when they talk they stick out. People just tear into them for no reason, it's completely absurd. In some rare cases, I run into Europeans who just rip into any Americans they run into (me being Canadian, we don't sound much different). It's absurd, I guess they think we're all little George Bushs.
It's just disgusting at times, and I don't get offended easily. If they ever gave a job like this to me, Live would run red with the blood of the offenders.
Bruce Skillis
KindaGamey
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Could you all please use your Kotaku powers to plead for an over-25 section of xbox LIVE cordoned off from the LIVE public at large? We should be able to choose: casual, hardcore, or ADULT. So many players either don't use mics or avoid LIVE entirely because of the amount of screaming kids and a*holes and Microsoft would do well to have an adult area where these kinds of things can be avoided. I'm not saying it is all children, but they do have a statistically higher rate of being annoying. Sad, but true. Or how about a 'Laid-Back and Polite' section for intelligent pot smokers? Ok, now I'm pushing it.
KindaGamey
AnEternalEnigma
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I'm still pissed off they made one of my female friend's change her gamertag because they thought "twinkiestuffer" was too offensive.
AnEternalEnigma
Collapse The Control
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Hagame: Plain & simple: ENTERTAINMENT.
My friends and I play competitive, we don't play to lose, it isn't that much fun losing. When we win and "gamers" cry/complain we let them know we don't care and they will never beat us.
It really is funny hearing some people's responses.
If you can't handle smack talk, sign out or mute us.
Shit talking & gaming has been hand in hand forever, it is just evolving.
Collapse The Control
cornunderscore2x
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@jollydwarf: It's funny you should mention males, haha.. I really don't game online much anymore unless I'm with people I know, and the only notable run-in I've had in recent memory was with a *girl* on Worms(yeah, I'm sure it was a girl - it was even in her gamertag), who went on about how stupid/gay/etc I was for a particular move I made against her worm. Then, like two turns later she loses and throws a fit.
I'm definately not defending male gamers, just thought it was humorous. :)
cornunderscore2x
JonRemedy
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
My ears are very sensitive; they can hear almost anything!
JonRemedy
frank0127
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Toulouse-lautrec?
frank0127
Tull
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Really I hear a lot of people complaining yet other than taking away voice chat I have heard no viable solution other than what Live is already doing. I'm sure Live can find a way to record everyone who is in a multiplayer match (which will take money to set-up) so it would be easier to find out who has been conducting some assfoolery over Live but then we'll get people complaining about invasion of privacy.
It's like people who complain about violence and sex on TV. They'll complain about the companies not doing anything to solve the problem when the solution (easiest one) is already available. Just mute the offending gamertag and/or play with people you know.
Tull
kneehighspy
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@TheSonicGamer:
i hear the same stuff on psn while every asshat on psn blast out rap music through their mics.
both psn and xbl have too many asshats, the service is totally unenjoyable on both because of it and a main reason people only play against others they know.
kneehighspy
Figcoinc
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I think they need to hire more police. I don't mind the occasional cursing and all, but the more popular games like Halo is a mess. Joined 10 games straight, and all ten games one person was dropping racial slurs....randomly. Just to get a reaction.
If I can run into that without a problem, these "cops" need to up their game big time.
Figcoinc
JohnnyHundo
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Witzbold: Hey Witzbold - I could see you turning this gig into great experience for joining the XBL Police... Not sure of your situation, but I would think you would be top of the list of applicants if you applied.
On another note, I wish you could limit the people allowed to talk to you in a match to those over 21. I was playing COD4 yesterday and ended up in a game with a 13 year old from Georgia (guessing the location) with diahrea of the mouth.... Nothing offensive, but nothing productive or wanted either.
Yes, I know you can mute... and I did.
JohnnyHundo
Rhawb
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I've found two things to help with this issue:
1) Only play brand new games or "old" games. Aside from HUGE releases, the idiots usually won't show up for the first few weeks, then the game becomes a living hell. Eventually, they get tired of the game and move on and thus, the community improves again.
For example, I played Forza with probably 95% good people when it first came out. About a month later I was happy if I could find a race that wasn't a "Let's race backwards!" or a "Let's demolition derby!" race. Now, it's getting back to the dedicated and I am happy(even if they tend to be way better than me :S).
2) Like TinyLightning said: mute all whenever you have any intention of playing an FPS or action game online. These genres seem to draw idiots like mosquitoes to a bug zapper. It's probably best for your sanity just to force yourself to not listen.
Rhawb
COLDBLOODED_BMC
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I have found that @AstrayPenguin: You will find very polite people playing Chessmaster on LIVE, other than that, good luck. I personally have negative scores on my reputations pertaining to Offensive Language. Ok, I use bad words, I use bad words a lot, I use even MORE bad words while playing video games, but my zone is Underground, so why is anyone complaining? I get sick of hearing a 10 year old tell me I should not curse because their parents don't like it, well, change your zone to Family, Mute me, but why complain? I am never purposefully offensive, or rag on someone for no reason.
COLDBLOODED_BMC
excel_excel
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@illdaddyj: Your one of the asshats aren't you??
excel_excel
MKS
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Although the 'freedom' of anarchy is as sweet as it can be - some don't have the ethical flexibility to live / play / fight with complete strangers of all cultures, backgrounds, races and opinions.
After receiving pictures swollen, unkempt privates from two completely different users on two entirely seperate titles (and yes, they were different sets of Frank & Beans)including an 'E' rated XBLA title (Carcassone) I had given up on ever ever ever using my headset online again.
It's not as though I had done anything to invite such behavior - and am still feeling hesitant on using my headset in the future - but having someone around to wrangle those... ethically challenged crack-puppets... would be most welcome.
On the other hand, the idea of giving up that freedom - even on the terms of offensive words - I also feel that it would be preferable to allow people to group by title rating. If loading an 'E' title, 'E' naming conventions for user profiles etc should be displayed, whilst if I'm on a 'Mature' or '18+' title - terms like 'Boobs', 'Gusset' & 'Nobber' shouldn't be as much of a concern really.
Goes to show that young ones shouldn't be playing the M/18 titles anyways... Yet it doesn't impede on adult 'entertainment'...
MKS
Bon5ai
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
It is hilarious to see that the US is creating so many virtual worlds and communities and that the first thing they do is take a huge shit on their own Constitution.
Bon5ai
wildknight
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
"suspended from accessing the service....in very rare cases, for good".
Personally I think they need to bring down the Perma-Banhammer down more often. Make an example out of some to show that dickery and asshatery will not be tolerated. Of course they won't do that since every member they ban is a lost customer.
wildknight
OGHowie
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I don't like playing on PSN because a lot less people have headsets. Multiplayer games with no teamwork isn't my thing.
OGHowie
aveneyer
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
They clear up the entire queue of complaints in one day? Sounds like they just dismiss 90% of what they see. GoW, Halo, CoD4... it's the same banter being spewed in every game I join. My girlfriend and I laugh every time we hear someone say "Fu***ng Fa**ot" - because we hear it at least five times a day.
aveneyer
Dude From Dubai
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
You dont think having a gamertag of "MuslimGamer" or or anything else would bo offensive/make me a target ??
Dude From Dubai
I_Hate_This_Place
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
push
I_Hate_This_Place
robinandtami
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@icerink:
Actually XBL caters to the homophobes and racists. See my previous post. We wouldn't want gamertags that offend the delicate sensibilities of racists and homophobes.
robinandtami
smitty1123
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@icepick314: People are civil in real life because there are repercussions if they aren't. You mouth off to a stanger in real life, there is a chance you'll get your ass kicked. Mouth off to a stranger on line and all they can do is mouth off back. Simple cowardliness really.
smitty1123
I_Hate_This_Place
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Hmm, I just hit "mute", file a complaint and use my RIGHT TO NOT BE OFFENDED. All of these comments sound so whiny. "Oh no, someone said something offensive". Seriously, are your ears that innocent that this really bothers you as much as some of you say? Is it politically correct to have thin-skin now?
I_Hate_This_Place
robinandtami
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@lionkitten:
They probably have really low gamerscores because they just created that account after their previous account got banned.
I think these guys do the best they can most of the time, but sometimes it is too strict.
For example, one term of service is that you can not create a gamertag that could "incite bigotry." This was used against me when I created a tag with the phrase LezBeOwn in it. My tag was banned because it was too similar to the word lesbian (yeah one guy at XBL actually told me that word is OFFENSIVE) the ban is of course covered in the TOS because of the "incite bigotry" clause. Of course under that clause, anything that showed your race, nationality, gender... almost ANY kind of personal descriptor would be against TOS. Somehow though, I don't see them banning tags like "Lady Ranger" or "Southern Boy" or "UK General" even though they are clearly against the terms of service, in that they could incite bigotry. I've heard tons of bigotry against women on XBL. Same goes for bigotry against non-Americans and southern Americans. No, they reserve the actual tag ban for homosexuals. Who's the real bigots? Oh well, still love my 360's and XBL though.
robinandtami
icerink
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I call BS. If MS had a system that worked, I wouldn't have to play every COD4 game with racists and homophobes.
icerink
keyrat
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
My good friend was banned for having "twat do you want?" in his profile. it's a little inside joke, but I guess any instance of the word 'twat' deserves a ban...which is retarded.
keyrat
dabu
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
This whole article is a joke. If they've been operating for so long, then how come there's been no appreciable decrease in asshattery? It seems like they're spending a lot of effort on the least bothersome offenses, AND THEN, they're not meting out enough harsh justice. What they should be doing is having a lot of moderator players playing and banning/suspending obvious bad behavior. People would shape up real quickly when they can't play halo for a week because they're being immature or racist.
dabu
Hagame
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Collapse The Control: Is that something to be proud of? Why do you bother playing online? It seems, from what you said, that you instigate this in the first place. If that is what you need to feel good about yourself perhaps it's time to try a new hobby. One that doesn't direct aggressions at others. The sad thing about cyber bullying is that so many people do it. Sadly, many people are strengthened over showing they have power over others. The internet gives them a place where there are no ramifications for their actions.
I have not played a ranked game or online with anyone other than those on my friends list since the original xbox entirely because of those who can't play nice.
Collapse, I have no issue with you, it's just that I am curious to better my own understanding. What do you get out of it?
Hagame
TheBoxNinja
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
What xbl needs is a maturity filter that you can turn on and turn off if you pleace. and it would censor all the naughty, racist, and general "asshattery". Then if people report you for swearing and such you can tell them to turn on their filter if they dont like it. That makes a lot more sense then this does. Banning people for "swearing". Ooh he said "son of a bitch" REPORTED. There are plenty of times (like someone said before me) that you are just trash talking and such and then people start swearing at you and bringing up "yo momma" shit. So you gotta retaliate. Ok, so what if you a lot more crude and better at insulting, random ass people will still report you for your retaliation.
TheBoxNinja
ShaggE
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@SeeOne: Heh, Witz would have XBL cleaned up in a week or two. :P Prinny powah!
ShaggE
mafakka
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Yeah, they go after folks with Boob in the name (and not something like FinalSolution88) because the geniuses at microsoft know what a boob is (its a naughty place). Yet it seems that none of them took history class. If they had they would understand that the final solution was Hitler's ultimate plan for the jews. Go look online, this is a real guy. he also has F4gg0t in his profile. I guess Microsoft can't speak 1337 speak either.
mafakka
Mr.SithNinja
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I hope they don't crack down on T-bagging..... It's the only reason I put up with all the idiots on Live. Speaking of which a friend of mine welcomed me to the 360 community by sending me a pic of his own t-bag. I have always wondered about him.....
Mr.SithNinja
Crack
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Genital footage on Uno??? Sweet baby moses.
Crack
DarkDragonDave
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I have yet to run into anyone saying anything derogatory. And you won't find me saying much at all. Yes, games have voice support but I prefer to not speak.
The only thing I have run into are those people with the speaker to close to thier noses and shouters. Maybe they have been saying something horrible but I'm too busy removing my head set so I don't go deaf.
DarkDragonDave
icepick314
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
what happened to simple civility among people?
is it THAT hard NOT to be a douche and play games to have fun?
a few gloating i can dig but going racist and homophobe is not why we have online chats....
icepick314
HurricaneDave
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Xbox Live police are probably as ineffective as TSA. If they made the service free they wouldn't have to employ people to monitor the service ineffectually.
HurricaneDave
Witzbold
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@SeeOne: I would most likely just blow up all the servers to save humanity so I dont think it would be a good idea for me to take such a job.
Witzbold
Cchrist
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Purple-Penguin: I wouldn't mind being one of those undercover guys :P
Cchrist
AxelHunter
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I have a best friend who lives four hours away. When we play, we go into private chat so we don't have to deal with the assholes. And if we feel like complaining about other people, they can't hear us, so we're not hurting anyone
AxelHunter
GPman
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
These guys need to login with with a handle similar to that gayboy one in the video above and go on a ban fest. Teach those asshats a lesson big time!
I'd like a job doing that as well.
GPman
yashichi8bit
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Is Stepto pronounced (Step-to) or (Step Toe)?
yashichi8bit
Cchrist
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@TinyLightning: Actually i've had more asshattery on .skate and burnout paradise than on all the shooters i've played combined.
Cchrist
Purple-Penguin
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I'd like a job doing this, it Sound like the type of thing I would enjoy doing. I'm a bit odd, I know.
Purple-Penguin
Friendly_Nemesis
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
well you know what people are like on Live so he was kind of asking for it with the gamertag of xxxGayBoyxxx.
Friendly_Nemesis
RaepGoblin
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@axiomatic: XBL Has more fun per square inch?
Anyway, it's a good thing when every single person doesn't have a headset, only the committed do. You really do get a lot less dickery.
RaepGoblin
T3kNi9e
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
They say alot of complaints are bogus. How do they know which ones are? Because when I make a complaint usually to people who are completely offensive there's nothing for me to explain what happened. All I can do is choose "voice chat".
This one guy was calling people faggots and acting like he knew where everyone lives so he could "kill their asses" but how do they know whether im lying or telling the truth if I can't even explain exactly what happened?
T3kNi9e
SeeOne
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
It's a thankless job, but I would probably be a lot of fun.
Hey, Witzbold... it sounds like this may be your next job after you master the Kotaku Banhammer :)
Level up your weapon, so to speak.
SeeOne
lionkitten
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@illdaddyj: What's your gamertag so I can avoid you now and save myself the hassle later?
lionkitten
TinyLightning
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I'd like to hear that these bans happen very very regularly. I've been called more racial and sexual slurs than i can find on urban dictionary. Halo is the worst. I'll sit down and play PGR and get set up with a group that's quite amicable. But once i get on those FPS's...particulary halo, the behavior goes down hill. No, i just turn voice chat off all together when i'm not playing with my friends. Which of course makes it hard to make new friends to play with online. Point being, the problem is worse than they're making it sound. There are some SERIOUS issues that need fixing.
TinyLightning
jollydwarf
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Being an alcoholic is certainly not a prerequisite for this job, but it is almost certainly an inevitable outcome. I cannot fathom how they can cope otherwise.
Aside from that, I really don't believe that Microsoft wants to TRULY clean up Live, because they know that a good chunk of users--maybe even a slight majority--find the "asshattery" more important than the actual gaming experience. As the Internet proves thousands of times a second every single day, people love drama and are looking for the slightest excuse to verbally and anonymously 'throw down' or provoke. Especially dipshit white males ages 8-38.* And yes, I fall in that 'demo', even if I'm apparently an 'outlier point' on that graph.
*--This is not to excuse/exclude other ethnicities, but just to describe the massive, massive hump in the Live 'community's' bell-shaped curve.
jollydwarf
Beyene
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Tull:
My ears arent sensitive. They just hate being called/hearing Nigger/Mistake.
=/
Beyene
Fox609
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
There's a handy little feature that has made my xbox live experience wonderful every time. It's called the mute all option. ^_^ No annoying kids, rappers, or asshats screaming obscenities when I beat them.
Fox609
SigmundTheSeaMonster
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I have mild turrets. That is why (CENSORED) need to keep their (CENSORED) mouths shut and just play the (CENSORED) game.
Have a nice (CENSORED) day!
BTW, I applaud these guys. Some folks think they can talk hatred and get away with it. Smack is one thing, but dissing a player based on race, creed and color is just not welcome. Time out achievement unlocked!
SigmundTheSeaMonster
Billy Bob Joe
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I'm glad I've had voice chat to be friends-only ever since I got my Xbox
Billy Bob Joe
Cchrist
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I filed a complaint against someone for the first time a couple of weeks ago. I can stand the occasional fuck but don't go sending me pics of you flipping me the bird for no reason...
Cchrist
lionkitten
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
My experience on the 360 version of Xbox Live is this: if I have a problem with some "Asshat" spouting hate or quitting early or whatever the reason to Avoid Player/Mute/ or in the big cases like racist/hoophobic/sexist foulness File Complaint, it's almost always someone with like 110 gamerscore.
It's almost always the new people. I've been watching this over the past few months and it's true like 80% of the time. It's almost as if they read these articles and say "Hey I should buy that. It sounds like my cup of tea."
We saw it when Halo 3 first launched too. The peeps that were so wrong and foul with no consequences in Halo 2 came over with new 360s and continued quitting and screaming. Well guess what. They now either have 2 star rep, bans, learned their lessons or have given up. Because they are largely not in my 5-star rep games any more.
People complain about this and then I ask them if they filed a complaint and they say "No." Did you avoid them for future games? "No." The system only works if you use it and the community only gets better if you make it better: "Good game." Try it. It sounds nice.
lionkitten
Habits
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@AstrayPenguin:I find it hard to believe that you've ever played a full hour of Halo without being called a fag. YOUR CREDIBILITY IS IN QUESTION HERE
Habits
Scruffay
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
whew, i like how gayboy was their friend in the end...
Scruffay
sir_carrot
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Yeah, so much racism on Halo 3 at least - haven't had many other games with a online system that works very well, so Halo's the only place I've really noticed it.
sir_carrot
Billy Bob Joe
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
That video is just sad.
Billy Bob Joe
Tull
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@goldwings: But at times I actually like having the ability to voice chat with team members when playing team deathmatches...or in the case of COD4...team HQ and Domination. As someone mentioned earlier there is a mute option one can use to block out those whose words may not be for one's sensitive ears.
Tull
MrSoursop
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
When I'm playing COD 4 I just ignore the rubbish talk and keep to myself. Doesn't really bother me, if a kid wants to shoot his mouth off over nothing (a bloody computer game) he can go ahead and make a fool of himself.
MrSoursop
Morberis
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
"Though that happens, Stepto assures me, very, very rarely"
Thats a shame, it really is.
Morberis
goldwings
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
-Vid doesn't exist anymore-
I hope these guys good luck because anyone of my friends with an accent is bombarded with racial slurs. He reported it before, but he stopped because it seemed to do nothing. That and he didn't want to report 7-15 people at a time. This is the only one good reason I think keeping the headsets out of the PS3 is a good thing. Quiet matches you say? Hell it's better than 10+ people bitching at eachother. Thank goodness for mute though, you can always do that.
goldwings
axiomatic
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Hat off for sure to this team of guys.
Immature bigotry is by far the largest of the issues and generally the gamers police themselves but every now and then I sure feel like turning in a complaint for some of it.
One thing I think could really help it the ability for the "host" to boot people. Yes this can be abused as well, but I still think it is needed.
I ran in to a ignorant bigot spewing southern american confederate hate at anyone with an foreign accent in COD4 recently, and the whole server wanted him booted. I eventually just left the game because it was just too much and I'm even from Texas so I should be used to this kind of vitriol!
All things concerned though, XBL is still the best thing going for online multiplayer. The PS3 has a LONG way to go to even catch up to the fun going on with XBL.
axiomatic
Sailorcancer
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
so does this mean XBL is going to be dull now?
Sailorcancer
illdaddyj
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Whatever, these guys are the real asshats. I got code of conduct for having my dogs myspace link in my motto. and as far as cussing online, I only play M rated games so I should be able to say whatever the fuck I want.
illdaddyj
Tull
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@TheSonicGamer: But how many people actually spend hours upon hours playing online on PSN.
While I've never had experienced the truly racist and homophobic rantings on Live I do think having a job just trying to police a place that his several million active users is a thankless one. Why thankless? Because no matter how good a job they do there will always be people who will blame them for letting someone not get banned fast enough or not respond to complaints in what they think is a reasonable time.
But then these are the same people who will complain about Live because its a Microsoft product and service. People like these look through the world through Sony-tinted eyes.
Tull
Zeuxis
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I got about 10 messages from one guy once after I beat him in PES, I didn't have a mic so I didn't even speak to him. They were VERY offensive about my partents etc, I filled a complain and nothing happened to him, so whatever, I don't believe anyone gets banned unless the say "Major Nelson is gay!" or "Hillary for President!"
:P
Zeuxis
ShaggE
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
@Brine: Exactly. They need to implement a "type out your complaint" option for when the generic options don't fit.
ShaggE
Tiberian
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Thats thing thing though. With a community as big as XBL, its very hard to police. Of course, if all members actively use the complaint feature. It makes these guys jobs easier.
I play Halo 3 and CoD4 quite a lot and there are quite a few trash talkers that will use some quite disgusting language. I'll use the complaints against them and so will my party, but its not like i'll ever see them again anyway because you rarely get paired up with the same people twice and you certainly are less likely if you "avoid" them using the avoid feature.
My final thoughts: Just because you might not see action or even hear of it, doesn't mean its not happening. Policing anything online is hard but Xbox Live has Mute, filing complaints and an avoid feature. Use it people.
Tiberian
Collapse The Control
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
BTW....
67% avoided
Collapse The Control
exkon
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Glad to know there someone watching, but we all know how hard it can really be.
It something that will NEVER go away with online gaming. People assume a new personality when they realize they can't be tracked down and say whatever they want.
exkon
Collapse The Control
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I am a huge shit talker, but I keep it game related until the real douchebags come out bring up "yo momma" (really dumb, get original) or "get a life" (we are both doing the same thing at the same time, makes no sense). That is when I turn it up a notch and unleash the fury of you can't outplay or outspeak me. So I may make fun of your lack of skill at the game, but turn it personal and i'll unleash hell.
Collapse The Control
AstrayPenguin
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
This is all very interesting but how effective is it? Me and a friend used to joke about how sad we were if we weren't called a fag in the first hour of a Halo night.
Live is full of assholes, to the point where if someone is pilot and acts nicely it's almost double take worthy.
But hey apparently I'm repeatedly reviewed as "unsportsman like", even though I've never done any such thing to my knowledge.
AstrayPenguin
Brine
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I never understood how public complaints were any help. You only get a couple generic options to choose from, such as "cheating" or "offensive language," with no explanation. How do they determine anything from that?
Brine
TheSonicGamer
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Luckily, I'm on PSN.
Zing!
Though really, those annoying little kids really get annoying. I'm sometimes glad Brawl doesnt have voice chat.
TheSonicGamer
TheNonGenius
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
So cursing and having bad words in your name isn't allowed, but running hacks, exploiting glitches, and just downright cheating are ok? That seems to be the point of the article, they've got a FORCE patrolling XBL, but only for bad words? Not to do something about the MASSIVE cheating going on? What a joke MSoft, what a joke.
TheNonGenius
wheezo
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
A little cynical, are we?
wheezo
Witzbold
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
I can dig it.
Not to mention feel for the folks behind the scenes doing that shit since I mean hell its what I do here multiplied by 1000000000000000.
Witzbold
TheIrishNinja
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Damn. i do not envy these guys' jobs. keep at it though, there's a lot of asshatery about.
TheIrishNinja
subterfunk
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
ha i just played someone with the gamertag Asshat
subterfunk
MisterSleep
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Good lord. If the amount of crap currently on XBL makes it through, I'd be willing to bet the garbage that gets weeded out would make your hair turn white.
MisterSleep
excel_excel
Posted 11:01 PM 19/3/08
Yeah yeah sure, show me some evidence that the person doesn't get there banned account back the next day and then we'll see if these guys are helping
excel_excel
AxelHunter
Posted 7:46 PM 26/3/08
@Bon5ai:
The US didn't make XBL. Microsoft did. And that makes XBL suseptable to legal catches like, "Don't call everyone you don't like a f**got." It's bad business to let the decent ppl be berrated by small-minded insignificants who can't think of more than two words to belittle everyone around him. XBL is a private orginization, and the Constitution, for better or worse, has nothing to do with it. Get over it.
AxelHunter
lawless
Posted 7:46 PM 26/3/08
What impact to avoids have. I looked at my rep one week and then the next, and my avoids went up. They said Trashtalking and bad language, but I only use voice in private chat. So how could I have trashtalked, and what does it really do to my rep.
lawless
freespeech
Posted 7:46 PM 26/3/08
These guys police what now???? I have to admit that in general I have a great time playing with good people, even in the supposed bad games like gears and halo. Not to say I don't enter a game where there are a bunch of idiots but I have to say that's pretty rare.
One thing, how do you play unfair exactly, it's not like you can mod or cheat on x360 (well I guess you could but you should probably get a job at ms or some game developer if you can)!!!!!! glitch, no matter how many people say it is, is not a cheat, granted it shouldn't be in the game but it's not like the user did something to cause the glitch. It was just missed in the testing of the game, so stop calling it a CHEAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
freespeech
SatansPistol
Posted 2:02 AM 27/3/08
Alright everyone be honest... if the XBL experience didnt include a whole bunch of bastards trashtalking how much fun would the online games be? if they were able to ban everyone that did so the XBL community would shut down entirely. thats the fun in XBL. And it majorly occurs in the most popular games like COD4 GOW and Halo and those games are all rated either "T" or "M" meaning you should be able to handle the verbal abbuse.. and if it is honestly pissing you off that much use the mute function... then you wont be able to ever hear that person again. NO MATTER WHAT WAY YOU LOOK AT IT (HALO ESPECIALLY) WOULD HARDLY BE PLAYED WITHOUT THE TRASH. in my opion that is the best part of the game.
XBL gamertag - Satans Pistol
PS3 ID - DEMONSofHADES
SatansPistol