Windows, Mac and Linux? That's really nice, but selling the thing for XBLA and not on a disc can be a good financial thing, but from a marketing perspective it can be a little screwed up.
People don't see XBL Arcade games as full games and probably woudn't pay that money for a physical disc, as the PC folks will have to.
Well, I'm gonna get the game anyway.

rospaya

nothing to do with the fact it sucks?

nolifedopestar (PSN: noliferuin)

@Torgen got his apology faceplate but not his fixed GH3 disc:

Exactly. PA isn't 7-11, nor is Hothead. They have nothing to threaten with. 7-11 has massive upon massive stores and sales to threaten to cut products out of. All Hothead and PA can do is obey.

With GameStop, they could say no, because boxed isn't in their interest anyway. It would have been nice, sure (which is why they had the meeting), but it's digital delivery they're placing their bets on, as indicated by that Greenhouse, Greenpowered, Gaswhatever thing Steam clone that they're creating to distribute games online.

If digital delivery is that important, then I'm fairly certain the 20 million Xboxes are equally as important to be reached as potential sales.

Personally, I'd scrap PSN support too, lower install base, lower attach rate, lower United States everything overall.

But if the GameStop thing tells you anything, it's really how these things work. GameStop did not want online distribution to occur if they were going to carry the game (and if it did, they wanted a cut), because that is completely counter-productive to them (meaning it's competition), and it's a fairly safe bet that Microsoft would not want its competition to have any distribution rights either.

I'm just connecting the dots here people. The whole "PS3 does not support Torque" and "It's a hardware thing" is dopey talk. Of course it supports both the engine and the game.

It's just that business gets in the way sometimes. A shame really, but I would make the deal too if I were in their shoes.

BlackDove

Good god why would anyone think PA has an anti-sony bias?

If you read the posts and strips, you would probably remember the nerdgasm they had over Eye of judgement, or the fact that Kingdom Hearts is probably Gabe's favorite game. Or their huge love for Final Fantasy games, or Shadow Hearts, or Odin Sphere, and tons of other Sony games.

I guess for that full year when the 360 was out before the PS3 and they, suprise suprise, mainly talked about the 360 (what all the gaming nerds were playing), that really hurt them.

If you were really dedicated to gaming, AS A WHOLE, then you would see they aren't biased. The 360 exists, a bunch of people own one, and they are going to talk about it. It's all the Sony Fanboys just wetting their pants "OMG they're doing a stip about Mass Effect again? That's not what I like! THEY HATE WHAT I LIKE!"

EVERY post about PA must have these comments:

"Man, PA has really gone downhill lately, I never read it anymore" (Really? Right about the time the 360 came out and they stopped talking about PS2 games all the time? Shocking!)

"Oh yeah, well I'm so cool I NEEEEEEver liked PA. I hate them so much!" (or, you were totally late to the party, and extremely resentful about it. Or just antagonistic)

As far as the game goes, they started working on this forever ago, probably before the PS3 was released, and definitely before anyone saw how PSN was going to work.If they could release on every platform, I'm sure they would... if they could get it on the Wii, I'm sure they would.

baxterpunch

@Captain Impulse: Yes I hope people will read my comment before they begin with conspiracy theories.

@steliosco: Capcom is also a massive company so they can do things like that. PA and Hot Head games have a massive amount of work they are doing for a tiny independent company. They are already releasing the game on 4 platforms and are building an online distribution system for 3 different platforms to release the game. So I think that they have there hands full right now.

liquid_kore

They use Torque? That piece of... nevermind :/

Garo

Well, this shouldn't be an issue for anybody here.
If you can post on this site, you have specs high enough to run the game on your PC.
And since it'll be available on Digital Download, there's little reason not to get it (Unless you don't like the game itself...but that's not the issue at hand.)

Palladium

I imagine Crecente and the Beaker-like Tycho laughing maniacally while Sony fans get made at the jab.

Too bad my brain doesn't produce TV shows.

dunetiger : the mekuri master

I won't be buying it then.

DigitalHero

There is no supported professional Torque engine for PS3. Somehow, I think if there was, the folks who make Torque would advertise it on their site. Which they don't.

There is nothing inherent in the game or the Torque engine that would make the PS3 incapabale of running it, but it would have to exist.

wheezo

@liquid_kore:

yes i know i use torque but not for consoles...

garage games don't offer a torqueps3,but capcom port the game made in torque360....

being a simple game(technically) i don't find that
impossible

steliosco

@kingclip: Yep. I'd pay full retail for a physical copy.

Captain Impulse

hmm, wait... Rocketmen Axis of Evil or whatever is a Torque game isn't it? thats on PS3 right now...

pandafresh

@liquid_kore: So basically, "it's not ready, check back later". But of course, someone without all the info calls foul. Go figure.

Captain Impulse

People are gonna pay $20 for this thing?

kingclip

If it was on PS3, there is a high chance I'd get it, since it's not, there's zero chance. Oh well.

Ecks

@steliosco: If you read the comments on the page you linked you will see that a developer wrote this:

"Hey guys, so the work on Torque for PS3 is this...we have several platform layers that were don't for specific Torque games that could and are helping us develop an engine for the PS3. I don't have any delivery date to talk about, but it's something we want very badly. PSN looks like another awesome channel for indies and we want to be there with the technology to help them get there."

liquid_kore

@celery:

And I pretty much guarantee that the PS3 can "support" the torque engine if they worked on it. There's work on getting Torque on the Wii. Your PS2 comparison is hardly the same thing...

LittleBigPlaneteer

@BlackDove: Pepsi tried that with 7-11 once. 7-11 threatened to go Coke-exclusive. Pepsi backed down.

Torgen got his apology faceplate but not his fixed GH3 disc

@WarlockSoL: agreed

jp182

@BlackDove: I don't think that's the case as I'm pretty sure (and they are pretty sure) that this would sell regardless. Most of their sales on this will come on the PC as they can put a direct sales link to it on their website (ease usually wins out when price isn't a factor).

What ALSO supports that is the fact that Gamestop tried to strong arm them like that when it came to digital downloads and they said No Thanks! Then Gamestop said that they'd be cool with digital downloads if they got a cut of the sales and once again they said, No Thanks! I'm sure they could have seen higher sales in Gamestop, just like X Live, but they passed it up when it wasn't on their terms.

My guess is that it is/was a hardware issue like they said. Not really a big deal as this game looks like it'll run on any computer built/made in the last 4 years.

jp182

I do get an anti Sony vibe from them. Not that I care. I actually kind of like it.

jambe

@BlackDove:

Yeah I'm going to go with no on that one. Even if the game studio were going to back down Jerry and Mike would have raised a stink.

Eville1

@LittleBigPlaneteer: Sony's hardware can't run PS2 games nowadays either. It's not a question of power, it's a question of support.

celery

I'll also add, whether or not Torque can run on PS3 *now*, the version of the engine they were using probably could not (for the reason I mentioned above)

WarlockSoL

Considering the game was announced in August 2006, and PS3 wasn't even released until November 2006, this really surprises you?

WarlockSoL

@BlackDove:

sure valid point,but if sony overtakes m$(lets say) what are they gonna do?

and small time beginners don't go with penny arcade...

steliosco

@LittleBigPlaneteer: *looks at today's date* I see what you did there.

Rabidsquirrel

As if Sony's "hardware" couldn't run it. That has to be the biggest load of bullshit written this month (hehe).

LittleBigPlaneteer

@demonknightinuyasha:

The PS3 doesn't allow Linux direct access to the GPU, so you can't really play 3d games on PS3 Linux.

Koztah

pc for me then...

Vileyaser

@steliosco:

I think it's more along the lines of Microsoft telling them that if they want it to be on Live, it can't be on PSN.

And of course, because they're small time, and beginners, they had to obey.

BlackDove

Seems weird that it can run on linux but not ps3 since ps3 runs linux itself. But whatevers, I have all those platforms besides 360 so I'll be picking it up anyways.

demonknightinuyasha

Ah well, sucks for them I guess? Who cares, whatever. Yes?

Eville1

It's just another excuse by dev's to be lazy.

VixDiesel

so it will get to the PSN eventually?
good
but even if thats the reason...
i feel a flamewar coming

Grey Gecko

I'm sad im not going to get a game i wouldn't buy anyway :( amusing comic but thats where the line gets drawn.. some stuff is just way ovrehyped.

Zaos

Wouldn't this mean PSN users can fix this by running Linux on their PS3?

超外人

Are they using the old Torque engine or TGEA? Cause TGEA can run on PS3 IIRC. Indeed, you can port most code and art from Torque to TGEA as well, and have access to sweet shaders for your trouble.

Koztah

bs...
penny arcade and their lets support m$ stance...

and lying also

[www.garagegames.com]

f.a.i.l.

steliosco

not bad for $20. shame it won't be showing up on the PSN as my 360 is runnin low on hdd space.

kw4k

Ah. Disappointing, but at least they justified it. Its not like the PC specs are gonna be Crysis levels though, so I think I'm covered.

PaddyStardust

So PS3 cant run Torque? Oh well.

Lanhoj

I hate all things Sony too!

sobjw

The platform and mechanism for releasing your game doesn't have to be a political statement either. It would be nice if it were on all platforms, but if it cuts time off the dev schedule because of PS3 eccentricities and it gets them a better deal with XBLA are they really terrible people?

And Tycho shouldn't be answering technical questions anyway. He's the writer. He should say "The PS3 can't handle as many gerunds as I'm throwing at it."

spezz

Ahhh... I finally got to the bottom of this comment section and I must say, it's entertaining as always :) I guess the only thing I'll add is that their's a reason why many of us are gamers and not developers. Sure those things aren't mutually exclusive but my goodness people... yell about wanting the game on the PS3 and stop wasting your breaths to tell the developers about how to make it work. Many of these ideas are ass or covered in the shit of the ass they were pulled out of <3

okenny :)

OMG What about the Wii?!?! It NEEDS to be on the Wii, for sure!

/endsarcasm

Master Saji

@Captain Impulse:

Not long enough for me, I'm still iffy about what they did to my Saturn...

Pezdispenser

@steliosco: Way to shoot down your own argument... you shouldn't just look at pretty pictures. Reading is (usually) fundamental :|

okenny :)

@超外人: @Most Wanted: I would wait till someone else tries that first. Linux on PS3 cant access the PS3's RSX graphics card so it might run poorly.

liquid_kore

@Most Wanted: seriously, where did this come from?? yesh the ps3 can run linux if you really want it to, but its not a linux box. install linux, then yes, it is, but you dont get to use the gpu or make a commercial game, and hardly anyone owning the ps3 has linux on it.... the ps3 runs its own embed os, much like the 360 runs an embedded nt kernel, but not windows.

cubed2D

That's one hell of a tag.

okenny :)

@Pezdispenser: I think 8 years is a long enough time to change their ways. ;)

Captain Impulse

@Tull:

It's being released on Linux.....

LittleBigPlaneteer

After all of the things they said back in the Dreamcast days, I would have whole heartedly believed that they just didn't like Sony.

Pezdispenser

People calling foul are PS3 fans who think that machine is more powerful that God. The game looks to have been made on an architecture that's pc-friendly which the 360 is. I'm sure PS3 fans will get it but probably for not for some time.

Tull

@超外人: My first thought too...PS3 is a Linux machine...no problems running this.

Most Wanted

@cubed2D:

Yep. Software not hardware

LittleBigPlaneteer

Excuse my ignorance, but WTF is Torque???

vamponymouse

Just pointing out, this is a sofware issue, not hardware. torque can run on ps3, and does. one company did internaly port it to -s3, but there is no official port. wich is probably more the real reson

cubed2D

@nolifedopestar (PSN: noliferuin): Have you played it?

Zeouterlimits

@BlackDove: No Torque does not support the PS3 yet.

Please read my comment I made before

liquid_kore

The lack of a TorquePS3 engine is simply business. It's a matter of priorities. Is it impossible based on the PS3's "hardware"? No. All it needs is specific coding.

The PS3 engine will not make them as much money as the 360 or Wii engine which is why there is already a well establish Torque360 engine, and a recently completeed TorqueWii engine: [www.garagegames.com]

Perhaps sometime in the next year or so they'll finally put out TorquePS3, but perhaps they're waiting for Sony to go to them rather than the other way around.

Just business folks

LittleBigPlaneteer

@nolifedopestar (PSN: noliferuin): Fact? Go read a dictionary and stop trolling.

Captain Impulse

@nolifedopestar (PSN: noliferuin): nothing to do with the fact it's not out yet? um yeah, what @Captain Impulse and @Zeouterlimits said

kw4k

I just love all the comments in this thread by people who clearly don't understand the whole "the software does not support this platform" argument. It isn't even a question of power, its a question of supporting the specific set of APIs that are unique to every platform. It's simply programming work that hasn't been done yet on the publicly available SDK.

Cloral

People still use Torque? For commercial titles none the less?

What a shit-tastic engine.

AdeptVoice

@kw4k: come on man, you must have played the demo. tell me with a straight face it's anything but garbage.

nolifedopestar (PSN: noliferuin)

Two years ago I went to GDC where I was given the answer as to why the Torque engine isn't on the PS3 yet. When they were orginally planning their store and downloadable content, they had obviously already made their discision on indie type games at that point. I was talking to one of the founders of Garage Games because it caught my eye while I was walking the floor looking for software solutions to help me make my first game.

But back on the topic, when Garage Games approched Sony to port their indie friendly engine to the PS3 they got the corprate equilvent of "screw you" from Sony. Because at that time Sony was still spouting how their machine whould steam roll all the other console and that they didn't need any outside help to do so. (ie Sounding like Nintendo of old.) They also approched Nintendo but they still didn't know what they where going to do with their download service yet (offically), that is why Torque for the Wii (Twii) didn't get released until Q4 of last year.

So the result is there is no Torque engine for the PS3 because Sony didn't want to open up their system to smaller developers/publishers that help give the PSX it start in the first place.

blkpaladin

@VixDiesel: Unless you're going to try your hand at porting it, hush up.

Americo

@everyone

Where is all this "XBLA/MS demanded exclusivity" nonsense coming from?

Hothead is a small studio, that's always used Torque. Why would you assume anything other than they don't have the resources for a PS3 port - especially when many/most of the target audience have multiple platforms?

Is there a PA reader out there who *only* games on the PS3?

They're not out on the Wii, or the DS either (and the DS has the largest userbase of any console)...

thebigsmoke

@vamponymouse:

Torque is a game Engine (and suite of tools) made by GarageGames that lets Developers create one version of a game that can then be ported to multiple platforms.

So instead of having to program several separate versions of a game, you create it once and then can port out versions to Windows, OSX, Linux, Xbox360, or (recently) Wii.

As pointed out elsewhere in the thread, they don't have an "out of the box" option for PS3 yet.

thebigsmoke

Well if it came on the PSN, I would have bought it. Since it isnt right now, I will just pirate it on the pc.

Wait a min, what was this game again?

devilhunterx

I was talking to Mike Krahulik (Gabe) a while back, and he said that they ARE planning PS3 version, but it will just take some time. I'm not too worried about it. I'll just use my extra $20 to get Bionic Commando ReArmed and PixelJunk Monsters.

TheCleaningGuy

It has nothing to do with the PS3 being able to run the TGE or TGEA but rather that it hasn't officially been ported to and there is no licensing solution for the PS3.

TGE doesn't run on 360 either.. but GarageGames does have a version of their engine ported to the 360 and it is easy to port from one Torque to another.. but it still requires different licensing.

While I would certainly like to see PS3 support in future Torque products this is hardly a hardware issue.. just a legal one. I don't know who's court the ball is in in terms of moving forward to get GarageGames licensed to develop tools for the PS3 but both companies clearly need to get on it!

Bastard11

There are some Torque PSN games actually. Not that I follow that engine much, but I have personally seen a PSN title and played it on a retail console.

Mongoosekun

Urgh.. Torque is horrible.

Altima NEO

@Ecks: Me too! Actually no i can't afford it what with no job and all.

Barf#1

For the Mac? Excellent, I WILL be able to play it then! Love PA. Can't believe I've been reading it for 6 years now. Good times.

2NinjasTapedTogether

@超外人: Yep. Though that's beside the point. These devs need to put in a little extra time/effort and hammer out a PSN version.

Replica23

i don't know what everyone is complaining about. you're using a computer right now...so buy it for PC or MAC!

not every game has to be played on a console

teh_joe

@AdeptVoice: Simply not true. It doesn't have the feature pool as say, Source or UE3, but it puts your art on the screen just fine. Plus, they constantly update the thing. Hell, just last month saw a fairly major update for their "next-gen" version. Everything else, like making a fun game, is up to the individual developer.

Buddy_DoQ

For those who were wondering if you could play the Linux version of the game the PS3 the answer is no for a couple of reasons. One is because the PS3's hypervisor does not allow direct hardware access to the GPU. The other reason is because the Linux version of the game only supports the x86 (and possibly x64) version of Linux. The version that runs on the PS3 is the PPC version. Without an emulation layer, you can't run one architecture's applications on another.

hakdragon

@thebigsmoke: Thank you for that explanation, now this all makes sense. ;)

vamponymouse

@blkpaladin: Once again, sorry for the DP, but I find this kind of weird, it has always seemed to me (at least in this generation)that Sony is the more open platform. Allowing Linux, SATA drives, lax DRM, etc. :?

vamponymouse