@BTFzor_Freestyle: Miya said at E3 that this game would also include Wii Orchestra that we saw like 2 years ago.

Timooo

I commend Nintendo for their brave efforts in creating a new market in gaming for more general audiences.. Seriously, I do. I think it was a rather ballsy move for a company that had suffered so much from their previous home console incarnations and such.

On the other hand, some of their approach to gaming has kind of given me a bitter taste. I mean, don't get me wrong.. Wii Fit was good, and their sequel-i-dous is fine too.. But Wii Music?

Something tells me they pulled this crap from that tech demo they demoed pre-launch for the Wii.

This game is horrid. Sad thing is, people will be clamping onto this like mad only to discover it's nothing more than a highly masked version of a simple Windows 3.1 novelty application with remote input.

mr_dimsum

Wii Music, the music simulator for the ages.

Remember the Pots and Pans Band from our Childhood.

It'll sound just like Banging on a Trashcan!

Or maybe you'd rather replicate the sensation of The Screeching Toddler Quartet?

Wii Music, experience the torture of what your parents heard.

Black-Dog-Howls

I can't wait to hear all the stories about the morons that actually buy this game tripping and falling (while flailing around playing their trumpets and other brass/wind instruments) and choking to death on the wiimote.

Then I laugh at the new warning screen telling people not to ingest the damn thing. And also, the subsequent release of the wiicondom 2.0 that has an extra large base so people can't swallow the thing.

tony_important

This is going to rock... swing, jazz and funk.

Rock Band, Guitar Hero and other music games that have you follow rhythm instructions are so lame compared to this.

Charbax

50 songs and no DLC? Fail.

AlbenoEpiX

The "casual" eat it up...

ahmeng

@Shiryu:

Maybe it's just "Wii Eiit" promo accidently put in there

BTFzor_Freestyle

October 16th and June 12th

Two of the most important dates in gameing history.

Serdur

You know I was hoping this would just be conducting like they showed it in the previous E3. As it stands I'm not as interested.

BTFzor_Freestyle

Also, penis/wiimote joke for lady in foreground to begin in 3...2...1...

Shiryu

It's on my 30th birthday! Has 1978 really been that long ago...

Shiryu

Man...$47...

Ryumeka

Awesome news! I can't wait to not buy it!

Anaralia

@Shiryu: Good thing the game will include such classic hits like "Happy Birthday"! Public domain never felt so good.

waterhand

It is ludicrous to even think to price it at $47. I feel bad for the unsuspecting super-casuals...

sweetie55

I hope they get this announcement on Good Morning America or Oprah, because no one in the gaming community cares in the least about this game (and this is coming from a Nintendo loyalist).

crescentfresh

So soon? The reports I heard from E3 were that the game looked like it needed nore development time to refine the controls and concepts. Guess not!

aka Bitter

@aka Bitter: Yeah, I was wondering about that too. Makes you wonder how long this was in development. It releases just a few months after its debuted? Makes me think they just scraped this together to put something out there. Good job Nintendo! Keep on instilling that customer loyalty and trust! -.-

FalconMbuster

So many snide, jealous backbiting comments and in the end, all made by folks who matter dick all to the grand plan of things. You stay classy there, folks and keep proving why the market needs to grow and make you guys even more irrelevant.

@aka Bitter:E3 games can be anywhere from 30% to 100% done. It's also been in development for at least two years.

Foxstar Sixtail

@sweetie55: Why is that ludicrous? This is a standard full-price game; same price as Wii Sports, I believe.

@mr_dimsum: How long have you played this game for in order to determine that it's 'horrid'? An hour? Half an hour? Not at all?

quen

I try not to hate the Wii...but it's so hard.

broomperson

Also another point on the
"You stay classy there, folks and keep proving why the market needs to grow and make you guys even more irrelevant."
comment:
Nintendo obviously seems to think that they don´t need to be attractive to the niche hardcore gamer market anymore (despite them saying the opposite, their actions proove what i and others say to that).
They´re pretty off though, unlike let´s say an ipod video games and consoles are still initially always bought by a niche market. Once its made popular enough by them more casual types can adopt those things. So if Nintendo looses their hardcore audience completely that will also have quite an impact on their casual gamer penetration.
Putting up a soccermom scioentology promoter type female PR person at an E3 won´t make casual gamers rush out and buy the stuff automatically.
The typical casual gamer isn´t well informed about all consoles ad all the latest games, there´s someone required who informs em to the degree of wanting the stuff.

tomsamson

@Foxstar Sixtail: While it may be right that the gaming market has to grow to make guys like us less relevant depending on your stance, this "game" was disliked by any type of media and attendees at E3, not just hardcore gamers and their outlets.
That the game is theoretically in development for 2 years doesn´t mean its any better or more refined than something that is in dev for 8 months. It could have aswell been the case that they had 5 projects to work on in parallel in that timespan or that they didn´t know what to do with the concept and started new from scratch several times during the dev time or just had no propper progress for months in between.
With Wii Fit i could see the mass market appeal but this thing here really looks too cheaply made and stupid to attract a similar big crowd.
I think they´re really missing key points of what makes music making fun, that is creating something yourself and doing something to the beat with the feedback of an instrument or at least something in the shape of it which gives one some sort of tactile feedback or at least some propper visual application representation which gives some visual feedback. Obviously many, many others think the same.
I´d wonder if it becomes a total flop in sales but i´d equally much wonder if sales figures come anywhere close to those of Wii Fit (unless Nntendo hid some wicked awesome features in the game noone saw yet).
Well, we´ll see soon, to me this thing as it was shown is really the game that will define what all can be sold to casual gamers and what can´t be hyped and sold even to those less caring about in depth "hardcore" stuff.
Well, we´ll see soon :)
I just get angry when this is hyped as the next big thing, especially when its hyped as even having educational value.

tomsamson

@FalconMbuster:Instead of thinking, why not go do your leg work and read up before posting angry comments on the internet?

Foxstar Sixtail

You are retarded if you buy this for yourself.

TheGuilty1

"like over 50 songs" ? come on kotaku you can do better than that!

Ragarnok

@tomsamson:Two points.

E3 is for the press. She's speaking to the press and the press is then reporting what she says to us. She's not up there for us, she's up there for the press.

Nintendo's mindset is that focusing the bulk of their attentions on core gamers is a waste of effort, proven in part when they jumped ship with the N64 and nailed in stone with the GameCube. Nintendo knew better then anyone that as a causal focused developer, from the time the Famicom first left it's developement plants in the early 80's, that the best thing to do is make the first strike. These same causal folks that everyone seems to hate have a pretty good chance of growing up (in gaming terms) and moving on to other systems and Nintendo has planned for that.

I want the market to grow more then anything, I'd love to see more fresh faces in the water who enjoy video games for being video games and if a game's not for them, they ignore it and play something else, not hammer out 20 page rants on how 'betrayed' they feel and lewd comments about Shiggy's mother and the dog she must have made him with.

That said, six causal focused games in 3 years is not proof or even a sign that Nintendo has tossed the core overboard.

Foxstar Sixtail

@waterhand:
Actually "Happy Birthday" is not in the public domain, it's a copyrighted song. Check it out: Wiki

elementary

@Foxstar Sixtail:
On your comment about her presser:
Sure it was made for the press and not targetted directly at gamers. Still why is it directed at the press?
Right, with the aim that they inform the gamers/buyers. So if the majority of the press mostly had negative things to say about the Nintendo presser, again not just hardcore outlets like kotaku but also ones like the Times, then yes, Nintendo´s presser was quite a failure.

On this point:
"That said, six causal focused games in 3 years is not proof or even a sign that Nintendo has tossed the core overboard."

You´re surely informed well enough to know that its not about some casual focussed games shown or released but instead about all the other things that were expected but not done/delivered.
People expected a starfox, fzero, kirby, kid icarus, pikmin and punch out etc, or hey, imagine how crazy, a totally exciting totally new IP focussed at hardcore gamers, seems insane to expect now,no?
People expected a hard drive or other propper storage solution. People expect different kinds of online functionality and many other things.
And while many even hardcore gamers liked Wii Sports and Wii Fit obviously many see the few games shown as way too cheaply made and shallow seeming.

Now to the rest of your comment:
I totally appreciate it when the gamer audience is widened, too. When more than the typical hardcore gamer is there, when gaming becomes so mainstream that one doesn´t have to be asshamed to talk about gaming in public or doesn´t feel totally off when talking about liking this or that game while in chat with a girl. Even better if one can play games together with all sorts of people.
I´m also an indy game developer so i also like it that there are some game types which are attractive to all sorts of people and that people from my family enjoy games rather than seeing games as sorta weird geek stuff where the only good side is that i earn money with them.
All that said there is a difference between making something that has appeal to hardcore gamers, then instead making something that has appeal to both hardcore gamers and casual people, then instead making something which has only appeal to casual people and then instead something which doesn´t even have appeal to the casual market anymore.
Wii Music in the form it was shown to me looks like it won´t even have big appeal to total casual gamers.
We´ll see how that turns out.
As i said even if they only think busineswise its not good to totally ignore or annoy the hardcore niche, its required for attracting and informing the total casual guys.
How many Wiis/DS would have been sold to total casual people if none in their surrounding was a hardcore gamer?
As i said i was fine with Nintendo attempting to broaden the market and also with them doing stuff like Wii Sports or Wii Fit, its just that with their most recent shown games and general direction drift it seems like they are going so far that its not good for anyone anymore.
You know, not just the hardcore hardcore is a niche, the super casual casual segment is a niche, too ;)
Also some things which may initially seem like only important to hardcore gamers and can therefore be ignored by Nintendo will hurt em way more once it affetcs the casual market, too.
Case example: Wii has too few storage space, a solution like a hdd, or accessing games from cards is heavily required.
Nintendo doesn´t give enough focus to that cause they think or thought its only a hardcore gamer problem (enough focus would have been an announcment with quick release following at E3).
What will happen once more casual gamer types run out of storage space? Do such people wait ages till the thing they see as fun toy gets improved? Do they constantly inform themselves about a solution coming up soon or being now available after they had the problem months ago?
No, the majority of those will then just stop downloading stuff. In many cases forever.

tomsamson

@aka Bitter:Or a combo of B and D, meaning the devs take the feedback and delay the game.

Honestly, I'm just looking for Wii Music to be a fun little game that given time, people end up posting rather great You Tubes of. Do I wish it had more songs? Yeah. Do I wish it had DLC? Maybe..I'm still of a mind that DLC is being used more and more as a crutch and a money vending machine by devs who could present a more complete product at launch. Do I think it will faze causal and core gamers who own GH or RB? No.

Do I think it will be fun AND maybe turn some of those folks who balked at the idea of GH and RB into new fans? Yes. Do I think I will enjoy it? Yes. Do I think it will be a 2 million seller, maybe even 5 over it's life? Heck yes. Do I hope a Mario Paint Music feature is within? Heck yes.

Foxstar Sixtail

@Foxstar Sixtail: That's my point. If the game, as shown at E3, needs work and the release date is a scant 3 months away, how much improving are they going to be able to do?

That leaves a few possiblities:
a. an old build was being shown
b. based on feedback from the show, the devs will make changes and be ready for release in less than 2 months
c. the build shown at E3 is a near complete version of Wii Music and you get what was shown

We will find out in October...

aka Bitter

@TheGuilty1:Nice to know that we've had a new King crowned who's word is unfailing law and clearly knows better for people then people know for themselves. I bow to you sire..while painting a bullseye on your forehead so your 'beloved' subjects will have a easier time bestowing their 'affection' onto you.

Here is a second showing of my love, this lovely bling-ed up robe with the word "TOOL" done in 50 point bold script on the back. You will be buried in it.

Foxstar Sixtail

@quen: @mr_dimsum: How long have you played this game for in order to determine that it's 'horrid'? An hour? Half an hour? Not at all?

You dont have to eat poo to realize it tastes like poo.

ortegar

Wii was specifically priced at an accessible price so that people would not be intimidated to buy it. This is because Nintendo understands their audience and what this audience will and will not pay for what in the audience's mind is still a "toy". Outside of core gamers, the average person balks at paying $399-$499 for a console system (PS3 and 360 when they came out). The average non core gamer looked at the price of the Wii and bought it.......in huge numbers. They left out the HDD to keep the price down. Consumer psychology works like this...sell me something at a reasonable price and then allow me to add an extra component when I need one rather than make something expensive for me to buy that has a lot of things included, some of which I don't know that I need or want.

Indiedog

@waterhand:

Actually, "Happy Birthday" isn't public domain....

R0ark

@kingmanic:Hate more. Your tears are like candy.

Foxstar Sixtail

@tomsamson:Good points. But we already know of a few things.

Kirby-Super Star Remake is on it's way. A console Kirby is a whole other pot of fish. Remember Kirby's daddy just got done with Brawl and largely does his own thing and Iwata's busy running Nintendo of Japan. Kirby also sells -way- better on portables, so I don't see a focus on Kirby shifting back to consoles at all anytime soon.

Punch Out-In development, past that, we don't know much about it other then it using the Balance Board which already has a slew of 'core' gamers with a huge case of ass hurt and swearing not to buy it. That means Nintendo needs to aim it down the middle for it not to flop. Hard thing, more so if you intend to do it like Wii Boxing.

Starfox-In development, but who's doing it is unknown. Keep in mind that Nintendo hasn't developed the last three Star fox games at all, they are done by second or third party developers, with the last three being Q-Games, Namco and Rare. We have no clue who's doing this one, if it's EAD, good luck, they've got a load of stuff on their plate.

F-Zero-In development, but also in limbo. Remember, AM4 developed the last one and the last game they were working on was..Yakuza 3. AM4 is also really small, so if Nintendo's waiting for them to finish Yakuza 3, we may not see anything of F-Zero till 2010.

Pikmin-We already know it's in development and Shiggy's working on it. Don't look for it anytime soon, games he's really got his hands into tend to have a 2-3 year development cycle.

Kid Icarus-Good luck, most of has have been waiting for a new game with him from the mid 90's on.

New IP-Electroplankton was their last one, sold for crap. Elite Beat Agents is a old IP made new, also sold for crap. Chibi Robo-Sold for crap. It falls back into the old trap, core gamers demand new IP, yet rarely if ever buy it. It's not just Nintendo too, Clover went down in flames because the 'core' who masturbate like rabid monkies over their games didn't buy them and what did Clover put out? New IP's. New IP's take -years- to come up with and when they fail to impress, it might take years before..or even if they ever show up again.

I think the biggest issues is Nintendo is a causal focused developer and has been for years, but people have never seen it this way and it's resulting in a lot of hurt feelings across the board. It also could be that people haven't stepped out of the 16 bit days and still look to one system for all of their gaming needs and when it doesn't deliver, they get upset. Me? I own everything so I'm never without something to play. I bought my Wii for Nintendo games formost and utmost, if third parties put out a good game, i'll buy it, but I bought my Wii, just like I bought my Game Cube and my N64, for Nintendo games first. So far Nintendo has not failed to deliver.

As for storage, everyone knows Nintendo's working on it, but it's only a matter of when they deliver it..it's clearly not as easy as everyone thinks, or we would already have a announcement on it.

I'll say right now that Nintendo's presser was not good for E3. But it was not a bad presser.

Foxstar Sixtail

Ahh Rockband for the severely mentally challenged. Hope it loses a lot of money for Nintendo.

kingmanic

I still need to see some reviews and more about this game before I can think of buying it. Plus, yay public domain songs! I hope they have Bingo!

Zingaro

@EmeraldDragon: what about reading the comments before replying?
You missed that most of the discussion here is about that the feel of the press and audience is that this game doesn´t just not attract the hardcore but it also doesn´t attract the casual anywhere close to as Wii Fit did.
I personally hope Nintendo will refine the game and add a lot to it before it gets released (or that they already did so and haven´t show all) so its more interesting to extreme casuals, maybe also the biggest group, all the guys between extreme ends of casual and hardcore.

tomsamson

@EmeraldDragon:But how -dare- Nintendo fucking release a game that might not be for the 'core'? How dare they pay the bills and fund future game development with a game that does not get on it's knees and hand each and every core gamer who throws $50 dollars down for it a blow job and a foot rub.

For years, various developers have made causal focused games that would do nothing at all for the 'core' but would keep a causal gamer happy. It's only now in this day that Nintendo doing so would elict cries from all across the Internet that they've left the core and should be nailed to a cross, that Shiggy's lost his mind and this dreadful shame on the gaming docket can only be made up for with blood and massive fanboy taint sucking.

All over six games, but if you believe some of the Yahoo's on the internet, every single game released by Nintendo in the last three years is for the causal gamer and to play them and enjoy them means your no longer a man, much less a gamer, turn in your balls at the door and take your DS and Wii on the way out, for those six games completely make the rest of your 100 year history irrelevant.

Shame on you Nintendo. Don't you know that the sun rises and sets on what 20% of the market wants?

Foxstar Sixtail

@Foxstar Sixtail:
In general regarding all the games beeing in development
that is nice but why weren´t they shown during the presser?
Even just a 1 minute video with seconds of each of those flashing by would have made the hardcore happy.
My best guess is that many of those are in too early stages of development so that
nintendo doesn´t want to show them fearing they could change too much till completion and then maybe lead to a debacle like back when all those N64 games were shown and half was never released, the other half in totally different flavor which made many unhappy.
And yup, you also nicely pointed out that most of those games will probably not come out anytime soon, so yeah, hence people being disappointed when expecting several of those be announced at E3 and be released in fall/winter this year. Still it would have been better to show something than to show nothing (interesting to this audience).
My second best guess why they weren´t shown would be that
they wanted to keep the presser all casual content focussed, in that case they misunderstood whos the main audience for e3 coverage and target audience for that.
In both cases no good.

Now talking bit more about the games you listed specifically:
I won´t argue whether Punch Out with Balance board controls will be any good before trying it but having tried the Wii Fit Boxing thingy i couldn´t get into that at all.Controls felt off and unsatisfying.
In my eyes Wii Motion Plus controls where the swings/punches would be translated 1:1 would have been much nicer and also if they would have announced Punch Out and also that it would come bundled with the wii motion plus (or two if its used for both hands) just like Wii Sports2 ;that would have made some nice press and could have made way more people excited.

About a Starfox being in development i personally don´t care a lot, as you said the last few weren´t made by the old crew that made the first two great so to me that looks bad.
Regarding kid icarus and some other such old IPs i think there´s lots of fanboy ramble about some of these but i don´t think each of these would be really
bought a lot. While a 2D metroid or Punch Out or Pikmiin could do quite well i think people even getting halfway hyped for kid icarus type B Class IPs
is more just showing how desperately the hardcore Nintendo fans bag for a bone thrown to them by Nintendo. You know, any bone.

While talking about 2D Metroid: Had Nintendo shown a 2D Metroid for Wiiware lots of people would have gone nuts for it ;)

When talking about creating or establishing new IPs then sure that takes way more effort than refurbishing known quantities.
And yup, in several cases it also doesn´t work out.
On the other side in cases where it fails one should question did this fail because it has no market appeal at all? Or did it fail because its crappy?
Or did it fail because no advertising effort was put into it at all?
While i saw TV,mag and website ads and even big posters plastering the streets for Wii Fit everywhere i never saw a single ad for shadow of the collossus or other such titles which were appreciated by the press and a small hardcore bunch but then never took off commercially.
I think in many cases with some believe and marketing push by the company it could have looked different for some of these.

I see Nintendo as casual centric company, too and yup, i also have a Xbox 360 and soon a PS3 next to the Wii and i would never expect certain types of games on the Wii.
Some also just don´t make sense due to technical differences and meanwhile target audience differences.
Yes, meanwhile the Wii caters to such a small hardcore gamer fraction of fps players that even if those left in there beg for an fps game it has no big chances to sell tremendously well.
But those who count themselves semi hardcore or hardcore and still enjoy their Wii, those, yes those should be satisifed, if Nintendo looses those thanks to making less and less things for them or putting such things so much down the priority lane that it takes 6-12 months till the next such game type comes out then that´s not good for Nintendo as whole in the long run.

You know, we hardcore gmers stick way longer with a system and waiting for stuff despite all our moanings and ramblings ahead but once guys like us are annoyed enough to not stick with it anymore and not wait anymore then
no one brings the family to try that new wii thing or that new wii game on thanksgiving (and that way make half the family buy the stuff) anymore.
The Soccer Mom hyping the Wi stuff among her soccer mom friends first has to get hyped for it by her hardcore gamer boy/girl.

So, yup, Nintendo´s presser was no good for E3, it would have been more appropriate for the toy fare. On E3 they should have had a show and content fitting to E3 and its target audience.
Presser this or that, curious to see what Nintendo does in the coming months till end of the year, it will set way more things for Wii´s future than just making some fanboys ramble.

tomsamson

So much hate for a game none of you have tried yet.

Here's an strange thought: this game isn't meant for you. No one is forcing you to buy it or play it. If some one choses to buy and play this game it is no skin off your teeth. So can the whinning already.

EmeraldDragon

You´ve got some good points, too.
There are several problems with third parties on the Wii.
Like them getting informed together with the press about the Wii Motion Plus instead of months earlier so they could have adopted current in dev games to it. Or Nintendo still not making it easy for small indies like me to get into Wiiware dev.
Or the Wii beeing marketed to the casual market to such extreme that such a big part of hardcore gamers (even those not expecting fps after fps but instead Nintendo IP type stuff) doesn´t buy Wiis or wii games anymore. Then in return hardcore targetted games sell less on the Wii.
Its again the topic whether The Nintendo presser it had should have been there but at the toy fare or at casual connect and then instead they should have another different presser at E3, so that way catering both groups and the majority which is in between both.
Anyway, yup, you´re right, we could talk and discuss till the sun implodes so we better stop and i get back to working on my game, enough of weekend start lazyness ;)

tomsamson

@tomsamson:You have a lot of good points. I'm going to close with this, because we can talk till the sun implodes.

Nintendo knows the bulk of people with Wii's are causals and as such, this E3 was them revealing the contact that's going to keep those folks happy with their investment. Nintendo's been going pretty full bore for the last three years and I knew a slow period from them was coming as they just sat down and tried to rest and work on stuff. That time just happened to be now, at a period where the core feels they've had nothing to eat in over a year and what's coming out from Nintendo is not targeted towards them.

This is Nintendo's biggest weakness and why third parties are needed, but at the same time, they can not rely on them and need to build up their first party and second party studios even more, so that the bulk of the content does not have to come from them all the time. I think people need to take heart, because third parties are finally starting to get on board and over the next 12 months, we are going to a much better slew of offerings from them that make good use of the Wii's controls, in some places, better then Nintendo's own efforts.

But at the same time, people need to learn to deal and ignore games that aren't aimed at them. Nintendo is not Sony or Microsoft, they have to keep a careful balance going if they are to live. Yes a all causal focus would be very damaging, but regardless of what the internet may think, Nintendo knows what to do in order to keep going. It may not always please people when they do what they need to do, sometimes it will, but they will do it.

Foxstar Sixtail

@Reiji:To think it cost nothing to produce is silly and trollish. Please don't make posts like that.

Foxstar Sixtail

@kingmanic: Don't worry, they won't lose any money on this! Like most Wii "games", it probably cost next-to-nothing to make anyway. So even if no one buys it, it's not like Nintendo's going out of business.

Reiji

@Foxstar Sixtail said: "I think the biggest issues is Nintendo is a causal focused developer and has been for years, but people have never seen it this way and it's resulting in a lot of hurt feelings across the board. It also could be that people haven't stepped out of the 16 bit days and still look to one system for all of their gaming needs and when it doesn't deliver, they get upset."

I have to disagree with you there. Nintendo has only recently become a casual-focused developer. Their focus was always, as you said, on Nintendo Games. Games such as Mario, Link, Metroid, and the like. Occasionally they would come out with a "Donkey Konga" or Mario Party, but their focus had always been on family friendly games, which isn't the same as the casual market.

I personally believe Miyamoto didn't like what videogames were doing to people in the first place. Causing obesity or gaming-related-death. So it would seem he wanted to create a system that forced people to become more active with their games, and also focus on attracting more people to it.

These are just my observations of course, but it just seems that this is what has driven the company for the last couple years.

Chromeo

@Foxstar Sixtail: Oh yes, forshame on Nintendo, making money is such a terrible thing to do.

@tomsamson: I wasn't replying to anyone, simply commenting on the general air of whinning these article always draw. You do have some good points, but the fact remains that most of the posts are pointless whinning.

EmeraldDragon

@Chromeo:Good points. I must remember that family friendly and causal aren't the same markets at time, though they do cross over.

Foxstar Sixtail

This game is pretty stupid. That means it'll sell millions!

kojirodensetsu