massively multiplayer
Insider Describes the World of Sony's MAG
Posted by Owen Good at 7:00 AM on July 21, 2008

It's not hard to imagine that Sony knew Microsoft would choose E3 to make its curtain-call announcement of Final Fantasy XIII for the 360. It's likewise reasonable to believe they searched their catalogueof works under development for the best candidate to generate any buzz. What we got was a mixed bag -- the trailer of an incredibly expansive shooter, but it didn't even have a title. It was just MAG: Massive Action Game. It sounded tempting, but very incomplete.
In fact it was shown to a focus group less than a month before E3. One among that group, after seeing the MAG E3 debut, reached out to me, under a promise of anonymity, to describe what was shown and asked of the group. Put simply, MAG -- whatever title it comes out under -- will be a mercenary combat MMO. It will more than likely carry SOCOM branding, as Zipper Interactive is behind it. And if so, it could be called SOCOM: Shadow War or SOCOM: Zero.
For purposes of identity protection, my source, who has experience in other video game focus groups, will be called Orange. Being identified could cost Orange, and others, future work.
"They gave us six options for taglines at the end," said Orange, who could only remember four: MAG: Shadow War; MAG: Zero; MAG: Global Assault and MAG: Final Hour. Orange said the group liked Shadow War and Zero. Orange reasoned that Zipper Interactive's involvement means all signs would point to a repurposing of SOCOM IP for this one, rather than creating a new title outright. Indeed, when providing me visual examples of certain factions that he observed, Orange used images from SOCOM 3.
"We were all deliberating what sort of game it was similar to, and for the most part, SOCOM and Planetside (another Sony title) were the only names that came out, based on what we have heard and seen," Orange said. The group members saw, or was described, gameplay but could not perform it themselves, which indicated it was in a far less complete stage than other games for which Orange had been in a focus group. All the group saw was a "touched up" version of the trailer that ran at E3, Orange said. Then they were asked questions, mostly regarding the game's story and the scope of its battles.
SOCOM and Planetside were the closest cousins, Orange said, because the game involves "troop like gameplay with a 3rd person view. The game is set following catstrophic events in the near future -- "2015 to 2020, around there," said Orange -- in which mercenaries, aligned with certain factions, are engaged in relentless secret wars for control of resources.

Orange saw three factions -- Americans, based in Alaska ("I can assume a snow level," Orange joked) Europeans and a Middle East faction. Orange provided two .jpgs from SOCOM 3 that were close analogues to the MAG Europe and Middle East factions. If Sony chooses to go forward like this, the obvious Middle East motif could cause some PR problems (although, "It was a black American soldier they showed us, if that makes up for it.") To Anglo players, that kind of garb clearly says "terrorist," and not mercenaries, especially considering the regular fatigues and high-tech suits worn by Americans and Europeans, respectively.
Orange said the presenters focused on two topics: Whether the story justifying the state of current events in the game was believable enough for gamers, and whether the scale of combat was appealing. MAG is promising multiplayer battles of up to 256 participants, broken down into 8-member units aligned to one of two sides. There will be no third-party intercessions on any battles, Orange said.
"For MAG they were all about scale," Orange said. "That was the word they were going for. Massive (as in the scale of the level). With 256 players, they don't want it to be a clusterfuck of deathmatch. They want vast levels where troops can approach from all angles."
At that scale, you can be an independent operator assigned to one unit, knowing none of the others on your side, or you can gather up to seven of your friends and jump in as a squad, with other participants added in if your unit totals less than eight. Obviously, it's not obligating you to find 127 of your closest friends if you want to see the largest scale of combat MAG will offer.
That said, mission objectives for these battles will definitely be in the hands of a few human players. We've reported on the concept of ranks in MAG, where players accumulate experience and ascend a shot-calling ladder within the game, such that they are either grunts, lieutenants, or generals in charge of the whole operation. You'll ascend in rank according to a points accrual system that Orange was able to describe loosely.
"When they were describing it, it kept reminding me of Alterac Valley from World of Warcraft, if you are familiar," Orange said. "What happens is: You get points for contributing with your troop/overall team. If you happen to win or do better than the rest of your team, you get more points. So the more you play, or the more points you get, the higher your rank goes."

Some speculated/wished that at high command levels, the game moved back into some sort of top-down/RTS interface. That sort of happens. "Everyone is in the field," Orange said, "but the person in charge is capable of looking at the map and commanding the overall group or individual troops. He is also capable of things like airstrikes and parachute drops. He could either control and babysit from far back, or jump right into the action [with a weapon himself.]"
Orange didn't like the fact another human player could set all the mission parameters. "Why would I want someone telling me how to play the game?" Orange said. "Perhaps I know more about the certain terrain than they do, should they have the ability to penalise me if I don't listen? Granted, penalising and kicking were not mentioned but they're always a possiblity.
While Orange did not see individual character classes or their abilities demonstrated, Orange came away with the understanding that all units could be comprised of a single class if they desired. Also, once a character achieved a certain point ranking, certain options became customisable, such as appearance and equipment/weaponry upgrades.
In all, Orange described an appealing game, and it's a logical progression from MMOs set in fantasy contexts. After all, there are, at least for narrative purposes, kingdoms and heads of state in those worlds too, and adventurers set off on individual quests and find combat there. Given a good enough story to set it up, what should preclude that kind of experience in the modern world?

Comments (AU Comments · US Comments)
There are currently no AU comments for this post.
Huckleberry
Posted 7:44 AM 21/7/08
@JayD16: Yep, pretty much. The description for the commander is almost identical.
Huckleberry
MHatter73
Posted 7:40 AM 21/7/08
All praise the coming of the Zerg....
MHatter73
Candlejack
Posted 7:40 AM 21/7/08
@Saint Anima: Yea. It could be worse. But those are still veeeery overused and cliché titles.
Candlejack
Aex
Posted 7:40 AM 21/7/08
MAG sounds interesting... We'll see how it pans out as more information comes to light in the coming months.
Aex
sanctusmortis
Posted 7:39 AM 21/7/08
So basically, it's Frontlines made by the SOCOM guys. Imaginative!
sanctusmortis
The guiding blue
Posted 7:39 AM 21/7/08
@spargo_1:
@rimaa:
Beat me to it.
The guiding blue
Existentialist Jones
Posted 7:38 AM 21/7/08
Aw, MAG would have been a much better name. I love how they only got six options for taglines as well, given they must have taken about 20 minutes to come up with. Why Shadow Wars? Why not Fatal Destiny? Justice Impact? Assault Legends? Ruckus Squad?
Existentialist Jones
dashyt2dafulliz
Posted 7:37 AM 21/7/08
Orange deserves to be fired.
dashyt2dafulliz
Medicine Seller [ZTF]
Posted 7:36 AM 21/7/08
@Dorphat the Insomniac: I see what you did there. Is today Haiku day or something?
Medicine Seller [ZTF]
Medicine Seller [ZTF]
Posted 7:35 AM 21/7/08
I just hope that if it is like Planetside, they have the progression from one battlefield to another. In Planetside, if you captured certain planets for your faction first, your faction would gain some pretty awesome bonuses when they advanced to the next planet. Made it pretty awesome.
Medicine Seller [ZTF]
Dorphat the Insomniac
Posted 7:35 AM 21/7/08
Clusterfuck shooter.
I hope they can keep order
of that many dudes.
Dorphat the Insomniac
Pornosaur
Posted 7:32 AM 21/7/08
@Luckenbach: Yep, if they do really fucking awesome stuff like 256 player maps.
Pornosaur
TheNocturnalSun
Posted 7:31 AM 21/7/08
sounds pretty good
TheNocturnalSun
Saint Anima
Posted 7:30 AM 21/7/08
@Candlejack: Hey, at least it won't be named SOCOM: Call for Massive Action.
Saint Anima
Luckenbach
Posted 7:28 AM 21/7/08
256 players or not, does gamedom need another tactical shooter?
Luckenbach
Owen Good
Posted 7:26 AM 21/7/08
@MeanMF: plus MFin' one!
Owen Good
rimaa
Posted 7:26 AM 21/7/08
Orange? reminds me of Code Geass
rimaa
NoBullet
Posted 7:25 AM 21/7/08
awesome
NoBullet
proust
Posted 7:25 AM 21/7/08
Sounds enticing (too early to tell, could fail). Though right now, I'm more intrigued by the multi in Resistence 2.
proust
LittleBigPlaneteer
Posted 7:25 AM 21/7/08
@Colt45J:
I think 3rd person works better for a greater view of the action, but maybe that's just me. I was hoping for a little RTS type of view too.
If Sony really wanted to generate a lot of Buzz, they should have just called it a SOCOM game at E3. That would get everyone super excited.
LittleBigPlaneteer
SolidOni
Posted 7:24 AM 21/7/08
@spargo_1:
My thoughts exactly....but what can Sony do to him? He's a friggin ninja!
SolidOni
Maldron
Posted 7:24 AM 21/7/08
So, wait. They HAD footage of the game, but chose not to show it?
Maldron
Candlejack
Posted 7:23 AM 21/7/08
Okay this is a pretty good read and the fact that a European faction is included made me go ^_^ because many games of the type lack that. I'm definitely interested.
But....Shadow Wars? Zero? Jesus. Can't you get any lamer? Surprised me that they favoured those subtitles. I'd have chosen Global Assault, no doubt, if only for the indication of what the game is like.
@Jtn: In many online first person shooters tactics & score-obsessive gameplay go hand in hand. But those are your feelings on it so I can't argue.
Candlejack
MeanMF
Posted 7:22 AM 21/7/08
PRIIIVATE JENKINS!
MeanMF
Colt45J
Posted 7:19 AM 21/7/08
Sounds very cool, but third person? Comon... first person if you are going for a game that is like a real army (ie: squads, commanders, etc.) I hate 3rd person shooters... :/ Also I assume that the commanders only have the ability to set navpoints, not the ability to control everybody or set objectives. I personally would be the rogue squad that goes and just works independently of the others, flanking and such, screw any orders..
Colt45J
DranzerKire
Posted 7:19 AM 21/7/08
@JayD16: Yeah reminds me a lot of Battlefield 2/2142. The most major problem this game faces, is not the lag, but the players. If the player base aren't great and co-operative, this game won't go far. I hope they provide a great community place for players to gather so they can try and build a good player base.
DranzerKire
Krondonian
Posted 7:18 AM 21/7/08
I think it's certainly got the potential to be great. The possibilities of combat with so many people seem endless.
I thought the Creative Assembly might do a good job of a massive combat MMO, where players take the role of a single unit, but on a massive scale. Alas their console efforts weren't so good.
I'm optimistic for this.
Krondonian
spargo_1
Posted 7:18 AM 21/7/08
I worked out who Orange is!!!
Jeremiah Gottwald
Britannian Rat!
spargo_1
magus00
Posted 7:17 AM 21/7/08
/Drool
magus00
computermachina
Posted 7:17 AM 21/7/08
im sorry but no way in hell people are going to be rolling that deep and organized haha. Real world will be humvee's with one passenger going every which direction, kamikaze jets and tanks shelling there own men. comming from a pc background I just speak from experience haha.
computermachina
Jtn
Posted 7:16 AM 21/7/08
@scndmg: Fine, MOST do, like the Tom Clancy ones.
Jtn
Kanik
Posted 7:16 AM 21/7/08
So...what are the chances that Sony sees this and then instead of figuring out who Orange is instead fires the whole group?
Even though it's not like a lot of information was really revealed, if anything tidbits like these keep people interested.
Kanik
scndmg
Posted 7:15 AM 21/7/08
@Jtn: Did you not play Gears?
scndmg
Jtn
Posted 7:14 AM 21/7/08
3rd person? Sweet. For some reason, a 1st person game always ends up being a game for the score-obsessive players, while the 3rd person ones always seem like the more tactical game to me.
Jtn
JellyDoodle
Posted 7:14 AM 21/7/08
Sounds Great!
JellyDoodle
JayD16
Posted 7:13 AM 21/7/08
@JayD16: Not that that would be a bad thing...
JayD16
____
Posted 7:12 AM 21/7/08
How many asshats claiming MAG was a 'generic' name and it sucks...and after me telling them it was a PLACEHOLDER name....and I was later deemed a frothing member of Sony's Defense Force (?) will admit that they were wrong?
It wasn't on this site of course, but still.
I was right =p
I think it was even 'announced' as a placeholder name from the beginning...
____
JayD16
Posted 7:12 AM 21/7/08
Sounds like a 256 player game of battlefield 2.
JayD16
wanion
Posted 7:12 AM 21/7/08
Actually, I do like the idea of having people reaching a certain rank and being able to get a battlefield view. It could be done pretty well, as long as players could still act how they want.
For instance the general could point out certain objectives to take for nearby squads, send reinforcements and airstrikes, and warn troops of nearby threats. And if some players aren't helping the team (ie. hiding in a corner and sniping instead of trying to disarm the bomb on the gold crate), the general could simply not send them support.
wanion
paulofjustice
Posted 7:11 AM 21/7/08
looks fun. Definitely paying close attention.
paulofjustice
SolidOni
Posted 7:11 AM 21/7/08
Cannot wait. If this thing has little to no lag it is bound to be incredible
SolidOni
Amazon_Chris
Posted 7:09 AM 21/7/08
Damn. That's gonna be awesome.
Amazon_Chris
mast3r_blast3r
Posted 7:06 AM 21/7/08
:O
mast3r_blast3r
Kamizzle
Posted 8:14 AM 21/7/08
256 knives only: hilarity ensues.
Kamizzle
FP_slomo788
Posted 8:14 AM 21/7/08
@Murderdolls: So they should limit themselves to 10 people because of you? And how many tactical shooter quests are there in WoW?
FP_slomo788
quen
Posted 8:13 AM 21/7/08
@Murderdolls: um, 256 isn't a random number. It's a completely natural number for anyone who's ever programmed a computer (two to the power eight) - and it will also be obvious that they had to pick that number, rather than say 257 or 255, if you read the rest of the description: it's based on squads of eight, so the number was going to be divisible by eight. (Of course, it could've been 128 or 64 or 192 or whatever else. Probably still might be if they run into performance problems with 256!)
quen
mfwahwah
Posted 8:12 AM 21/7/08
@Murderdolls: Random? Do you know anything about numbers when it comes to computers?
mfwahwah
Evil Tortie's Mom
Posted 8:12 AM 21/7/08
@Medicine Seller [ZTF]: Dorphat ALWAYS posts haiku. I love that he can make reasonable comments in the 5-7-5 form.
This game will be o_O if they do it right.
Evil Tortie's Mom
Crimson_Ryan
Posted 8:11 AM 21/7/08
Sounds fun. Top/down camera views for the general, well, that should be an option. Because if your forced to command without the option to actively fight, then there's no fun at all.
But a RTS looking view would be quite a nice addition, being able to see every bit of person there, calling in an airstrike, telling troops to defend a bridge, destroy the bridge, rebuild the bridge, and defend it again.
I can see myself buying this game, even if it isn't called MAG.
Crimson_Ryan
Makidian
Posted 8:09 AM 21/7/08
I'd have went with Global Assault has a better ring to it with that many players, I like the concept, hopefully it gets executed well
Makidian
Coquiton
Posted 8:08 AM 21/7/08
@computermachina:
Hehe, too true.
That said, I think it's interesting how they're dealing with objectives and all.
It sound like they're modeling themselves after Battleground Europe (formerly called WWII Online). I've always been drawn to the game, the only reason I'm not playing it is because it's brutally realistic (a good thing, but it's not my type of gameplay).
That said, I think pitting 256 players against each other is a little overzealous...it'll be interesting to see how they handle it without fully becoming an MMO.
Coquiton
Dragnipur
Posted 8:06 AM 21/7/08
Funny how Xbox Live revolutionised online gaming, but Sony are determined to push forward the progression... think MS are really missing a trick here!!!
Dragnipur
Dragnipur
Posted 8:05 AM 21/7/08
Very nice finding "orange"... hopefully someone can come and enlighten us about the "secret" PS3 game, which isn't MAG by the way!
Dragnipur
Murderdolls
Posted 8:04 AM 21/7/08
@FP_slomo788: New standard? I hope not If I wanted to play with 256 (nice random number by the way) people online then I would go play World of Warcraft.
Murderdolls
Raynre
Posted 8:03 AM 21/7/08
So... BF2 with 5 servers combined?
Raynre
FP_slomo788
Posted 7:58 AM 21/7/08
Good game or not, I wonder if this is a sign of things to come to PS3. Warhawk had 32 "massive" battles and now most multiplayer games have 32 players max on PS3 (see Fat Princess). Is MAG setting a new standard?
FP_slomo788
Dorphat the Insomniac
Posted 7:57 AM 21/7/08
@Medicine Seller:
There's no bad day for haiku
Comments can be art.
Dorphat the Insomniac
Quicksilver4648
Posted 7:56 AM 21/7/08
Sounds very ambitions. I expect nothing earlier then a 2011 release.
Quicksilver4648
DaveKap
Posted 7:49 AM 21/7/08
@dashyt2dafulliz: Orange deserves a medal.
DaveKap
sereal
Posted 8:40 AM 21/7/08
I'm curious about the lag issue. Lag will really make or break the game. I'm hopeful it won't be a problem, I'm sure that was the first question asked when someone suggested the 256 player count - they probably have a team working on that problem since this is one of the major selling points of the game. I'm sure they will have a system of voting if a commander is being stupid or going AFK. I guess it's going to probably be a while before this game surfaces considering it doesn't even have a proper name yet.
sereal
Shabat0ge
Posted 8:38 AM 21/7/08
Let's just see how it plays. 256 sounds F'ing great, but will it PLAY ok, will it be fun or a glorified Battlefield game? Not trying to bash it, but I have yet to see footage or anything on it, so I'm a bit skeptic.
Shabat0ge
Ett
Posted 8:37 AM 21/7/08
MAG reminds me of NovaLogic's Joint Operations . I enjoy that game a lot.
Ett
balaamsafe
Posted 8:35 AM 21/7/08
If they rename this, i hope people still refer to it as mag
it's such a cool name.
the info on this is looking tasty
balaamsafe
NeVeRMoRe666
Posted 8:34 AM 21/7/08
@____: You're right. People should read the entire post before commenting. Anyone that did would know that MAG is nothing more than a generic place holder. Yet on the other hand, "It was just MAG: Massive Action Game. It sounded tempting, but very incomplete".
If a game is not far enough in its development to have an actual confirmed name or a real direction (Is it SOCOM?, focus group...do you want this to be SOCOM?), it shouldn't have any place at E3. Let's stick to near future releases shall we game companies? No more of this Duke Nuken crap. I don't need a game to be hyped over three consecutive E3s for me thanks.
In other news, this game does look really fun, I'm looking forward to it, whenever it should come out.
NeVeRMoRe666
Dirk Dorkelson
Posted 8:32 AM 21/7/08
Damn, all you losers drooling over this game need to put down the controller, join the military and fight a real war. Nerds.
Dirk Dorkelson
salthegeek
Posted 8:32 AM 21/7/08
@Astrofox:
yeah same hear
i really want do something like that
i would love to be a merc or something like that
salthegeek
Cerbo
Posted 8:24 AM 21/7/08
@Dorphat the Insomniac: I love you.
Cerbo
mustang
Posted 8:23 AM 21/7/08
Lelouch: R2 to K1!
Orange: Yes, your highness!
Go Orange-kun! \/
mustang
FP_slomo788
Posted 8:22 AM 21/7/08
@Astrofox: Heh. I think PS4 is your best bet for that kind of experience. Unless the planets are really tiny. ;)
FP_slomo788
Solid Snake
Posted 8:22 AM 21/7/08
Imagine an fy_iceworld map with 256 people. Shit would be coming from everywhere.
Solid Snake
Astrofox
Posted 8:19 AM 21/7/08
@FP_slomo788: Yeah, this is the kind of boundary pushing that I have been waiting for... games like this and little big planet give us experiences we haven't had before, not for example, devil may cry with sharper textures.
I'm still waiting for the game that lets me seamlessly traverse planets in a spaceship, from dock to dock with no loading. I wanna be Han Solo dammit!
Maybe PS4?
Astrofox
FP ph15h
Posted 8:17 AM 21/7/08
:o Nice Feature. Probably one of the few I've read to its completion. :D It seems like an awesome game.
...Orange... Hmm..
FP ph15h
quen
Posted 8:16 AM 21/7/08
oh - and I was so busy gaping open-jawed at somebody who didn't understand the significance of 256 (next you'll be telling me you don't know that 2^16 is 65536 either!) that I forgot to comment on the game. It sounds pretty awesome - and if they can pull it off, definitely the kind of experience the PS3 was sold on.
(Not that I am suggesting you couldn't do it on a 360 - but at least you'd probably be hard-pushed to achieve it on Wii.)
quen
Azures
Posted 8:15 AM 21/7/08
The Geass jokes have been made, damn.
In other news, this week's episode is out!!!
Azures
venkat55
Posted 9:08 AM 21/7/08
I hope this game will revolutionize online gameplay on consoles.
What excites me the possibility of having a new kind of social relationship with people all over the net.
venkat55
DrunkenTrom
Posted 9:00 AM 21/7/08
@Dirk Dorkelson: Sorry, I missed the reference. My bad.
DrunkenTrom
z0phi3l
Posted 8:59 AM 21/7/08
@Colt45J:
With players like you in it, it will be a massive failure, unless there's a way of having repercussions for your actions
z0phi3l
6010
Posted 8:58 AM 21/7/08
As a long time fan of the Battlefield series, this sounds like a very interesting upscaling of that concept. I've not particularly enjoyed the socom games I've played, but if I got some mates together to play this [and considering the size, they are already keen] it sounds pretty good.
I reckon however, it'll just tide me over to battlefield 3 - surely that's due soon.
6010
nonbreakingspace
Posted 8:58 AM 21/7/08
Sounds gay. 256 people is not massive. Try playing planetside. (Granted during it's peak, not so much now I don't think) Those battles before the BFR bullshit, were epic.
nonbreakingspace
Dirk Dorkelson
Posted 8:57 AM 21/7/08
@DrunkenTrom: Is mocking the legions of Rock Band/Guitar Hero trolls a ban-worthy offense? I had no idea.
Dirk Dorkelson
DrunkenTrom
Posted 8:56 AM 21/7/08
I'm not sure if Zipper can reinvent the wheel here with this one. As a long time SOCOM fan I have to say that I had more fun playing the 8v8 SOCOM 2 better than 3 or Combined Assault. Even though the last two SOCOM games let you scale back to 8v8 it just seemed better when all of the maps where designed for 8v8 with a specific objective in mind. Don't get me wrong as I for one like the idea of this game, if they can pull it off. I'll buy it regardless just to see it in action for myself.
DrunkenTrom
snakepliskin
Posted 8:55 AM 21/7/08
I really want to know how theyre going to deal with lag too. But considering the fact that scale was their biggest priority it would make sense that lag was at the top of their logistical list.
I think seeing as how this is mmo oriented will kind of force players into cooperation. The alterac valley analogy kind of points to that cause you cant get many wins in alterac without some sort of cooperation.
snakepliskin
FP_slomo788
Posted 8:54 AM 21/7/08
@PoorPensive: Have you ever played Halo or CoD4 with that many people? Then why are you so quick to dismiss it? And it's 256 people MAX. Smaller games can also be made if you're too scared of the bigger scale.
FP_slomo788
maraxusofk
Posted 8:54 AM 21/7/08
this game looks really good, esp if its being developed by zippo of the awesome socom fame. however, this game needs more hyping by sony. not the failed hyping of killzone 1 which brought more negative than good, but hype nonetheless. i do hope this gets released on ps4 instead for a) better processing to handle this many players well b) i really think its too late for the ps3 this generation (not gonan stop me from playing it but i doubt this game will recieve the attention it deserves if it comes out towards the end of the ps3 lifespan).
maraxusofk
Brickd
Posted 8:52 AM 21/7/08
Sounds good, especially for a PS3 game. But aiming in 3rd person is always harder to do, even the latest Socom game looks messy whilst Warhawk had to result to using auto-aim. Their command structure sounds very similar to Battlefield 2s'.
Brickd
DrunkenTrom
Posted 8:50 AM 21/7/08
@Dirk Dorkelson: Monday is tomorrow, unless you're trying to get a head start...
DrunkenTrom
PoorPensive
Posted 8:48 AM 21/7/08
@FP_slomo788:
Standard? No way. Most games would fall apart with that many people. MAG is design for it (hopefully), but can you imagine playing Halo or COD4 with that many people? Not so fun. I think having a smaller amount is okay, since it allows you to create little one-game rivalries with players around your skill level. I think with 256 people, it could be possible to get killed by someone you won't encounter again for the whole match
PoorPensive
ollie_ho
Posted 8:47 AM 21/7/08
@Dirk Dorkelson: no respawns in the military, whats the fun in that lol
ollie_ho
EnigmaNemesis
Posted 9:38 AM 21/7/08
Sounds sick ... hope they can deliver!
EnigmaNemesis
mister_shhh
Posted 9:36 AM 21/7/08
alright... so you noobs can go ahead and gather firewood over here....
mister_shhh
MushyPeas
Posted 9:22 AM 21/7/08
Its funny, because in the article "Orange" based on inside information (granted limited, but more then anyone else) mentions that its not going to be a clusterfuck death match of UP TO (keywords) 256 players. Its obviously a massive map (picture GTA4) with factions scattered throughout the map encountering one another all with some type of goal.
Yet so many people keep coming on here thinking its a 256 player deathmatch and worrying about lag. As if the people creating the game gave that idea an afterthought. Are some of you guys dense, or purposely putting down games because they dont happen to be releasing on the console you chose to "marry".
MushyPeas
serversurfer
Posted 9:17 AM 21/7/08
@Colt45J:
And if I were your CO, I'd call in an air strike on your position. :p
serversurfer
Gunloc
Posted 9:16 AM 21/7/08
I want it to be called The Outfit 2.
Gunloc
Servant_of_Jashin
Posted 10:01 AM 21/7/08
Not big fan of shooting games but i might just give this game a try.
Servant_of_Jashin
ZetaCrossfire
Posted 9:58 AM 21/7/08
Iv been wanting a game like this. guess i got it, when does it come out?
ZetaCrossfire
ZetaCrossfire
Posted 9:58 AM 21/7/08
Epic Win
ZetaCrossfire
Spoony Bard
Posted 9:55 AM 21/7/08
As was discussed earlier, playing as a Middle Eastern in that garb in CoD4 is fine, because it's randomly assigned.
Here, you're going to pick a side as an MMO and stick with it. For those who don't know much about the Middle East this might be a problem because they might just play to stereotype in building their characters.
Something to ponder.
Spoony Bard
moeses213
Posted 9:46 AM 21/7/08
they'll just make a firmware update to activate the second cell processor to take care of the computing and lag j/k
moeses213
Altersparck
Posted 9:43 AM 21/7/08
This looks promising. Hopefully, there will be ways of discouraging the team killing, excessive camping, and general dickery that plagues CoD4. The general dickery is something endemic to the audience, though, so I have no hopes of minimizing that...
Altersparck
belo
Posted 10:32 AM 21/7/08
um... sounds like a 3rd person version of what BF3 will be.
belo
snakepliskin
Posted 10:27 AM 21/7/08
@zanzibarlegend: yeah i dont think its fair to write off a game no one has really seen yet. Unless its a sonic game.... why sega, why?
snakepliskin
zanzibarlegend
Posted 10:15 AM 21/7/08
@FP_slomo788: again, i dont inderstand the hate for this game. if Socom Confrontation is meant to hold us over until his game comes, thats fine by me. i guess this is the new Socom they were talking about. color me interested.
zanzibarlegend
Phreakz
Posted 11:01 AM 21/7/08
I kinda wish i had a ps3 now.
Phreakz
Tw3nty0ne
Posted 11:01 AM 21/7/08
Yeah, That definitely passed my expectations, although I really wouldn't put this under the SOCOM Name.
The taglines were good, but the SOCOM name isn't a plus for me.
Seems like a huge-ass version of BF2, which really isn't a bad thing.
I wish there were other ways to "rank up" though, The best players will rank up the most, but they probably won't care about teamwork, they'll be lone wolves. If the scoring system was based more on Teamwork and completing objectives rather than just killing everybody, I will definitely buy it.
But wherever there's a teamwork-oriented game, there's always those morons that screw everything up.
Also, It sounds as if it will be in Waves, probably every 5-10 mins there will be a new spawn wave, maybe a ground assault the first wave, then a paradrop the second, then a ground assault, etc.
Sounds fun.
Tw3nty0ne
Aflack: Likes slushies
Posted 11:01 AM 21/7/08
@Maldron: I wonder why?
"MAG looks like a PS2 game."
"Ugh, why did they show this so early?"
"Looks like we won't be seeing this until 2015"
"THE POWER OF CELL"
Thanks mysterious Orange person. I like the sound of this.
Aflack: Likes slushies
zanzibarlegend
Posted 10:49 AM 21/7/08
@snakepliskin: indeed. Sega is the only company that type of criticism should be given. its in the Gaming Commandments i think. :D
zanzibarlegend
Arttemis
Posted 10:49 AM 21/7/08
@Antiterra: But now Mr. Orange is incredibly... greenish gray...?
[i67.photobucket.com]
True story, he did all of his own stunts.
Arttemis
islandknight
Posted 10:44 AM 21/7/08
@Murderdolls: lol looks like they already explained to you about the "random" number.
forget the title guys, you know you don't really care. its the gameplay you want to know about. commanders capable of surveying the battlefield? that sounds awesome. won't work in public games because no one works together but with a clan i can see the leaders taking point. i'd get this just to experience a 256 online TPS battle even if it doesn't turn out to be as good as Socom.
islandknight
Antiterra
Posted 10:36 AM 21/7/08
Just out of curiosity, did you call him Orange because he's a mole...? "Orange" as in Mr. Orange? Because it does seem fitting - especially if the testers have a Mr. White epiphany and find out who he is. Or something.
Antiterra
robinandtami
Posted 11:22 AM 21/7/08
What happens when almost everyone has ranked up?
robinandtami
Libo
Posted 11:21 AM 21/7/08
@islandknight: You underestimate the public. I don't see this game attracting too many trigger happy gamers, just like Planetside. The fanbase was more mature and the amount of coordination seen in some battles was on an epic scale. Planetside did reward teamwork though, as stacking kills didn't net you much experience.
Here's hoping Zipper comes up with a compelling reason for players to stick together, the lone wolves would be few and far between.
Libo
Popcornicus
Posted 11:48 AM 21/7/08
@robinandtami: 256-man dungeon raids to take down Kim Jong Il.
Popcornicus
Pablos102030
Posted 11:32 AM 21/7/08
So, when is this coming to the wii? :p
Pablos102030
cyhborg
Posted 12:05 PM 21/7/08
@Popcornicus:
now that would be AWESOME
cyhborg
TheRedBayonet
Posted 12:00 PM 21/7/08
Sounds as if this has major potential. Overall, I'm thrilled with Sony and the team that chose to pursue this idea, because it's one of the largest gambles I've seen a company make in years. Like most MMO's, the game is made or broken by the players. The entire appeal of this game, to me, is the thought of working as a giant team, and on top of that, gaining rank to eventually command other players. That's incredible, but as Owen pointed out, if someone just doesn't want to follow your plan, the game is fucked. And I somehow see a large population of players being too intolerant and impatient to live and die with a human general that you know nothing about. Also, you'd think voice communication would be big for this, and since the PS3 doesn't ship with a mic, on-top of the games price, you're asking a large group of potential buyers to then buy a mic as well. Big gambles all across the board... but personally? I'd buy the game, I'd buy a mic, I'd invest hours into this game and tolerate shitty generals, but only after the game is proven and the player base is installed and locked in, and that may just never happen if enough people share my views.
I pray for the success of this game :)
TheRedBayonet
EvilHunter
Posted 12:42 PM 21/7/08
after eight days and The Getaway PS3 canceled i don't really sure that's gonna work unless they show it in real so the time is the only thing answer that
EvilHunter
GTA4er
Posted 12:29 PM 21/7/08
This game will be an epic win for Sony
GTA4er
Gunhaver
Posted 12:52 PM 21/7/08
Anybody remember Joint Ops: Typhoon Rising or Soldner: Secret Wars?
No?
Good. Because memories of those two games would likely hurt the sales of this game.
Gunhaver
inphi
Posted 1:37 PM 21/7/08
I guess the Middle Easterns are going to get shit weapons and loads of disadvantages, right? Hope they balance out the factions. I'm getting tired of this stereotype.
inphi
wanion
Posted 1:52 PM 21/7/08
@inphi: Just wait until you see what they have in store for the handicapped faction. It's pretty shameful. Also, rumor has it you can unlock the elite hobo faction.
I'm pretty sure they'll balance it out, unless their idea of balancing the Middle Eastern faction means giving them suicide bombers and attacks on civilians. That probably won't help matters.
Also, I thin they should stick with MAG. Or change it to Massive Explodey Pow! Pow! Kaboom!
wanion
Spartan1308™
Posted 1:50 PM 21/7/08
@inphi: What game gives a disadvantage to the Middle Eastern side? Most games don't even give weapons with different abilities to each side in multiplayer. Some have different coats of paint. Even in Halo where some of the weapons are truly different, both teams get access to Covenant and UNSC weapons.
Spartan1308™
Hand_O_Death
Posted 2:29 PM 21/7/08
Very BF2 like so far but we all know the massive changes that can occur, this thing may end up being a damn Crash Bandicoot puzzle game at this point. interesting ideas non the less. I am hoping for a well thought out game that can set a High Bar for futher games of its kind down the road
Hand_O_Death
Aflack: Likes slushies
Posted 2:14 PM 21/7/08
@TheRedBayonet: The did ship a version of Warhawk with mic uncluded.
Aflack: Likes slushies
chesterhybridz
Posted 3:05 PM 21/7/08
Technically impressive (only because the largest multiplayer I've experienced is 32 on Warhawk) What kind of game modes or even round times could justify 256 players? A never ending server where people are constantly jumping in and out to play? Maybe with multiple games happening all at once? CTF, TDM, Zones, and such all going on at the same time? I'd buy it. No more leaving servers to switch to different game types. Any other ideas out there?
chesterhybridz
serversurfer
Posted 2:43 PM 21/7/08
@robinandtami:
I would guess that the command positions will just default to the most experienced players.
Also, I imagine that clans will be able to set their command hierarchy arbitrarily.
serversurfer
Mr_Ed
Posted 3:41 PM 21/7/08
I must be getting old, or maybe im just a social gamer, but i really dont get the obsession with more players.
16/32 are about the perfect size for team games. Any more than that, you begin to lose the ability to communicate effectively as a team, then it just becomes a bigger version of a free-for-all.
In big games like WoW, or Second Life (if that even classes as a game), i can see the attraction of huge numbers of players, but in a 3rd/1st person shooter?
Mr_Ed
wanion
Posted 3:39 PM 21/7/08
@chesterhybridz: I'm thinking there will be various objectives for each side to meet, like destroy the ####, defend the ####, wash my ####, stay home and wait for the cable repair ####.
But that's a good question, what sort of limits the games will have, whether there's a score limit, time limit, or if it's just an endless cycle of advances and retreats. How's it going to affect the game when servers start losing people to bed time? Or when there aren't many people available? Will the terms be the same on a 256 person map if there's only 12 people in the lobby?
I also wonder how they're going to deal with some of the issues that might crop up like spawning, spawn-camping, map balancing, team balancing, game length, map size, etc.
wanion
Nintendohater
Posted 4:27 PM 21/7/08
Well correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that in the press conference, they said that it would be a part of an ever-changing world. That being said, it sounds like that it will become an mmo, but it would probably be like how endwar will be.
Nintendohater
mikes_stalker
Posted 5:16 PM 21/7/08
I'm keeping this game under my radar. Looks tempting to follow.
mikes_stalker
Mit
Posted 5:23 PM 21/7/08
I don't care if they want this to have vast levels with everyone spread out:
If you put everyone in the same arena, they will all flock to one location, and there are going to be 256 people within sight of your character.
So there's the big question, is this game going to be able to handle that? At all? Or is it going to discourage this by just lagging everyone out? I think this will have a large factor in how well this game turns out.
Mit
GreyFoxV1
Posted 6:48 PM 21/7/08
So it's not Battlefield it's World of Warcraft with guns? I guess that's good.
GreyFoxV1
vantesaur
Posted 7:39 PM 21/7/08
I hope DICE got some sort of patent back when they were developing BF1942 and especially BF2, as both Killzone 2 and now this game (and probably Resistance 2 as well, but that looks so shockingly terrible I haven't paid too much attention to it) seem to be a good 90% copy&paste of the BF series. Even worse than CoD was being just a WW2 version of CS. There isn't a single thing here even remotely innovative, unless you say "but omfg console not pc" which really is a stupid argument.
The one good thing about this though is it hopefully helps push EA/DICE into making BF3 as Battlefield 1943, instead of making a direct sequel to BF2 which would have turned out exactly how this game seems to be apart from being third person.
vantesaur
V.Volker
Posted 8:28 PM 21/7/08
Has Sony sold 256 consoles?
V.Volker
Tr0oper
Posted 10:42 PM 21/7/08
@V.Volker:
hahahah you funny :p
Tr0oper
Witzbold
Posted 1:07 AM 22/7/08
What in the name of GOD is that SAS member holding. D:
Ill bite now only, ONLY if they give me pretty guns.
Oh yes and proper damage.
BFBC came close to some cool ideas but it all fell to shit when gun physics / damage came into play.
Granted I still love the game tho.
One thing is Im curious to see what urban combat will look like. I will most totally bite if they allow for almost every building to be able to enter and such. Or at least something that would help simulate urban combat.
Witzbold
Office Ninja
Posted 12:54 AM 22/7/08
Great article.
My main concern about that many players is the cluster-fuck factor will be really high. The battle fields will have to be massive on the scale of the likes of which we haven't seen yet. Since the game is most likely years away, I am hopeful that they can get everything set. Lots of great concepts so far like rank, and mission based objectives. Guess we'll just have to wait until we learn more.
Office Ninja
Witzbold
Posted 1:44 AM 22/7/08
Oh yes and no blackhawk = no buy for me. ;D
Witzbold
OrientalHero
Posted 1:31 AM 22/7/08
In order of game complexity, I'd rank Dooms, CODs, Quakes, Crysis, GRAWs (Ghost Recon: Advanced Warfighter) all the same.
Brothers in Arms along with Rainbow Six and SWAT 4 is above those due to the fact you are no longer alone!
Battlefield series and ETQW are at the higher end due to extensive team interaction. Operation Flashpoint and ARMA: Armed Assault rank above those.
Planetside is at the top because the scale actually adds the most to the game.
Someone else already mentioned it with COD4 with 256 players. There is no player interaction at all in that game other than bullets. The same in GRAW. Those games don't scale.
It's a bit like in Starship Troopers at the battle of Klendathu. Where all the soldiers disembark and run at the enemy. Yeah excellent gung ho. Zero tactics.
Don't get me wrong, I enjoy COD4 and DOOM and other shooters. But after levelling up (if at all for most FPS), it gets tired unlocking yet another sniper rifle. Heh, I still get bomb jitters on CS when I'm the last left, defusing the bomb.
Battlefield does it good with artillery strikes, and vehicles/infrastructure necessitating commandos/spec-ops for behind front line actions *and* engineers to do the reparing. It also has squad communication with the ability to spot targets to the rest of the squad, as well as resupply points.
However, as someone else pointed out, why should you take orders from someone about taking out that house or setting up a defensive/ambush position.
Planetside did it good with Command Points. Only people with squad leadership experience got to set the global waypoints or spend clan points on things like Orbital strikes etc. Artillery wasn't just something called in either, but some squad had to go and lay it on. And ideally, you'd want anti air in that mix cos nothing deals with incoming artillery like air support. And I mean either the three man Liberator bombers or the 1 man Reaver gunships. Not the "pre programmed" air strikes from BF2 or ET:QW.
I really don't know why some of the games bother giving you any rank at all.... So you made Sergeant. Does that mean you have anyone to lead? So you made Lieutenant, so are you making mission centric tactical decisions?
And just because someone else was higher ranked doesn't mean you couldn't do your own thing. It's just that being part of a coordinated action is as Sun Tzu put it, like dashing a millstone against an egg.
So I'm glad Planetside has been mentioned in the article. At least they'll know where the bar is in terms of scale.
OrientalHero
mufasa
Posted 5:46 AM 22/7/08
I am definately looking forward to this, it looks promising.
mufasa
RaepGoblin
Posted 5:40 AM 22/7/08
I hope they remove the genericness from it. I really get bored of these average shooters. I don't care how many people can play, make the universe more compelling. And colorful. Sounds like it has potential though.
RaepGoblin
Delvar15
Posted 6:52 AM 22/7/08
It's just Battlefield 2 multiplied by 4. With that said, it'll be interesting to see how this development turns out.
Delvar15
yashichi8bit
Posted 6:47 AM 22/7/08
Sounds good to me.
Though I would assume at its current state this game is at least 2 years away.
yashichi8bit
xIvSlowDeath420
Posted 8:09 AM 22/7/08
@Delvar15: So you didn't read it eh?It's ok most people comment without reading aswell.
Only game i can think of to compare what they're talking about is Planetside lossely but mostly just WW2 online(all ten of my greatest gaming moments are all WW2 online moments interestingly)and this excites the shit outta me,now lets hope they don't fuck it up,the tech is simple despite what the noobs here would have you believe,can get 13000 people on one server in ww2 online 5 years ago but 256 is undoable,gimme a fuckin break.
This will be a paid for mmo i suspect.
xIvSlowDeath420
gomerkyle9
Posted 7:11 PM 23/7/08
So, this ranking system and it's leadership command level things... Does this mean when the game first comes out everyone will be privates and it will all be a huge chaotic mess? Because that would be awesome.
gomerkyle9
Rylock
Posted 4:57 AM 22/7/08
Anyone else think "Savage" when they were talking about the commander in an RTS position? (I know it wasn't the first game to do it, but they did it damn well)
Rylock
McLogo
Posted 12:12 AM 22/7/08
I'm really looking forward to hear more about this game. It somehow reminds me of operation flashpoint, where you could play coop or vs. with friends and it really felt like a battlefield - not the duck-jump shooters
I hope gameplay will be realistic
McLogo
Schprocket
Posted 12:05 PM 21/7/08
@mushypeas - "Its funny, because in the article "Orange" based on inside information (granted limited, but more then anyone else) mentions that its not going to be a clusterfuck death match of UP TO (keywords) 256 players. Its obviously a massive map (picture GTA4) with factions scattered throughout the map encountering one another all with some type of goal."
I think you hit the nail on the head with the 'scattered factions' idea.
It's not too much of a logical progression to see that is pretty much exactly how Resistance 2 intends to handle 60 players, albeit in first-person.
The only players who will experience lag regardless are those of us who live on the planets Australia and New Zealand. Give us 'local' national servers or forget it!
Schprocket
Gunnm55
Posted 8:43 AM 21/7/08
BF2 or BF2142... with potentially more players. Great. I'm waiting for that game to be released after the new DX 11 is outlined soon. Will MAG*Cough*BF2009 use the Frostbite Engine? J/K. MAG= easily a lag fest. Especially when the Aussies join the server.(sorry, take it up with the Korean gamer bandwidth hogs)
If R2's MP is not a lag fest, then I may hold out some hope for MAG.
Gunnm55
Al3xand3r
Posted 8:12 AM 21/7/08
@Murderdolls: What does WoW have to do with a FPS? This is just taking a look @ Battlefield and upping the ante... Battlefield had 64 players, which was double the usual of 32 until then, and this multiplies it by 4 (so it's not just a random number, it's multiple of 8 as usual). If it's actually done good, it can certainly set a standard in regards to how well you can develop a console multiplayer FPS, since they most always had lower player limits than on PC, though 32 is still very common for many games (mostly Valve's really, as far as popular ones are concerned, though they can also have more - over 64 - but they're best optimised for up to 32) so console developers have managed to equal that by now.
Al3xand3r
cookiesareafriend
Posted 7:22 AM 21/7/08
256 players sounds like the next big step for multiplayer shooters...
I'm a little surprised this isn't a pc title =(
cookiesareafriend
DragonNinja
Posted 7:19 AM 21/7/08
Ooooh, CS 1.6 player models. This game looks awesome.
In other news, deep in my heart I know this game will be fun.
DragonNinja
thumbwarrior
Posted 7:13 AM 21/7/08
I'm glad to see they're seriously thinking about this. If they pull it off, then it will be undoubtedly cool. Also, why didn't they just call it SOCOM from the beginning?
thumbwarrior
no1kevlin
Posted 9:54 AM 21/7/08
Looking forward to this game. I know it has been shown early because Sony felt the need to show a blockbuster at E3 but I hope it is going to be out within the next 12 months otherwise people will get bored of the wait
no1kevlin
jsc_tidus
Posted 11:40 AM 22/7/08
256 online players... hell yeah, bring it on!
jsc_tidus
Mitch Cumstein
Posted 6:17 PM 21/7/08
Considering the amount of resources that would be invested in a game like this you would have to reach COD4 type of mass popularity for this game to affect people's views of the PS3. In other words this game would have to deliver on something you just can't get on the 360 or another console. Unfortunately the level of popularity that would be needed to be reached with this game doesn't lend itself to the type of community that would be essential to making this game work when considering the level of human interaction required to make this game run well. You can't patch your community behavior.
Mitch Cumstein
TheParsons519
Posted 4:46 PM 21/7/08
If Zipper is smart, they WILL brand this with the SOCOM title. I believe it would only boost sales, although some fans may be upset because I imagine these huge battles would be quite a departure. Thing I loved about SOCOM 2 was the close quarters and all the intensity of carefully getting your job done or one stray bullet ending your round.
TheParsons519
tiekmir
Posted 7:30 AM 21/7/08
Don't you guys get it? If the players do not work and cooperate with in the hierarchy of rank and help out the group then they don't get points. If they don't get points then they can never level up in rank. Plus I imagine that trouble makers will get banned too. It will be like the real military. I have been waiting for a game like this for a while now. Battles will actually be strategic and not just a big mess.
tiekmir
w00dm4n
Posted 7:11 AM 21/7/08
a huge 256 player clusterfuck deathmatch could be cool of the map was huge.
i think ranked matches should enforce team work.
w00dm4n
pearce
Posted 9:06 AM 21/7/08
I actually think that this game will be a dissapointment
1. 256 players will just be this one big cluster f*** of bullets, and i dout that the PSN will be able to hold that many players without turning into a solid lagfest. If they do manage to pull this off i suspect that the ammount of players will be toned down greatly.
pearce
PSMOkizzle
Posted 7:38 AM 21/7/08
@MeanMF: LMAO
i would imagine someone would have already done that already, but evry shoting MMO needs one x]@
href="#c6788656">rimaa
:would u care to elaborate? haha
a gundam MMO would be a little more resembland of Code geass
hey... "leroy Jenkins" and "code geass..."
PSMOkizzle
SolidEyeSystem
Posted 7:26 AM 21/7/08
Nice read. I am really hoping that Zipper can pull this game off, I really like the sound of it all. Oh, and slapping the SOCOM name tag on it wouldn't hurt. I guess we'll get our first taste of this through Resistance 2.
SolidEyeSystem