Lack of quality 1st party games? TEN YEAR LIFECYCLE
Loss of important exclusives? TEN YEAR LIFECYCLE
Lackluster sales? TEN YEAR LIFECYCLE

Fryfat

@Replica23:
Was that really called for?

wahlumsurfer

genius pure genius...the man never stops blowing my mind

bobdisgea

@ThursdayNext: "I expect to be playing on my PS3 into 2015, I doubt the 360 has those kind of legs"

Ha! You'd be lucky if the 360 didn't RROD while playing Pac-Man!

Replica23

I believe that the PS2 is holding Sony back to what the PS3 can REALLY do. If they stop supporting the PS2 and focus all on the PS3 just imagine how amazing the PS3 will be.

StealthMaster86

You know, I don't want to be taken as a anti-sony guy. I still play PS2 and PS3, but that comment he made just brought me back to kindergarden days of "Well....I beat you LAST time!!" Honestly, I don't beleive that even Sony that the PS3 would be competing against the PS2 still.

wahlumsurfer

@Talleh: PS2s are still selling because PS3 isn't selling enough...

No... PS2s are still selling because PS2s are still selling.

everybest

He has a point. A lot of people were burned after the Xbox was killed off so prematurely.

Then again, people are probably still programming for the PS2 because it's cheap and has a significant install base. I mean, what was supposed to be the PS2's swan song? God of War 2? Okami? Let's hope it's Persona 4.

Thorax

If he wants to know where they are, it's simple: put aside to let the new boy shine. Seeing as both 360 and Wii (IIRC; the Wii might not have just yet) have outsold their elder siblings, and the PS3 hasn't, he wants to think about that...

sanctusmortis

*gasp* Kaz.. talking.. sense? I think the internets is broken =P
But seriously, he does have a point. I was kind of annoyed when Microsoft killed the Xbox stone dead. With Ninty it kinda makes more sense for them to kill the GC like they did because there isn't that much difference in graphical power between Wii and GC, so keeping the GC in the market would have made Wii look a bit silly.

manicfoot

The fact that you're relying on previous generation hardware to make your games division profitable does not give you the right to brag, Sony! You should know that!

henri1kk

@Sniper_Zegai:
The PS2 got similar reactions when it was released.

Garo

Ugh... when Kaz gets like this. If Sony had a sub-20% market share they would have dropped the PS2 like a rock, too. It's like, gee, they support a console that's selling 100+ million strong. What a service. Thank you. Oh, wait. That's what any business with half-a-fucking-mind would do.

The PS3 is their first chance to prove they'd stand by a product that hasn't already hyped the competition into the ground.

Xiedo

As long as the PS3 sells at nearly the same pace as the PS2 did his comments will be valid.

Garo

That's eight years, not nine.. And that platform is definitely declining in both sales and releases.. You might be seeing a total of ten years of PS2 lifetime but the last part will be thin, whispering ghasps of air.

UnklDee

Wow, does he not realise that's its because the PS2 was so good that the PS3 is such a huge fuck-up disappointment.

Sniper_Zegai

Everybody else has moved on to newer and better things instead of keeping two generations of consoles alive. PS2s are still selling because PS3 isn't selling enough. And the PS2 will continue to sell when the new 80gb PS3 hits, with no backwards compatibility.

They sold the PS2 as a PS1 player, and dvd player. At first the PS3 was a blu-ray player and the option to have 100% PS2 compatibility, and they've just been knocking it away little bit by bit.

They keep touting how they have a HUGE PS2 install base now, and so...they remove the ability to play those games on their new hardware? It's like they're going back to all the good decisions they've made in the past, and making the opposite choice.

Talleh

My Gamecube is called my Wii.

periodical

So true though. I expect to be playing on my PS3 into 2015, I doubt the 360 has those kind of legs, and as for the Wii, half of their core users will have grown up and bought a next gen console by then and the other half will have died of old age (if Nintendo's adverts are a true representation of their demographic). :)

ThursdayNext

Isn't that the point of backwards compatibility? The PS3 doesn't have much of it since the PS2 still sells so well, and any executive would be killed for denying money.

Oh course, that's the hardware side of it. The software side is the side with the problems of losing support...

For unsupported software, I guess that's where the Virtual Console, Xbox Live Arcade, and other equivalents go in. And don't forget Mega Man 9, that might just be the beginning of a new trend.

Zero1328

lmao reminds me of that interview with jack trenton when whatever he was asked he would respond with a 10 year product life cycle cliche

shinko

@AngelMayLaugh: that's because we all know where the DC is.
its in our hearts.

TheIrishNinja

He's right, of course, but resting on the PS2's laurels isn't going to get him anywhere fast.

The PS3 has got significantly stiffer competition this time around and unless Sony raise their game by a couple of notches, the PS3 is going to wind up as more of a Saturn than a PS2.

SunScramble

Me thinks if your PS3 was cheaper and didn't have the innards of a programmers worst nightmare, there wouldn't be an issue of a PS2.

Also, people are cheap + recession... hmm, what could that mean?

Ken

Damn that's cold. Dreamcast doesn't even get a mention.

AngelMayLaugh

hey, if home's supposed to be your advertising, money-making machine that keeps it free for all of us, by all means, take your time. Just get more trophies out the gate sometime.

but as much love as id like to show the PS2, the more i think about the statement he's making - coupled with nixing all BC, presumably for the next model too - the point falls flat. Yeah, youve still got badass games coming out for that system (cant wait for Persona 4!) but its hard to look lovingly on that legacy when you cut it off, production costs or not.

TheIrishNinja

Whats the point of releasing PS2 games when most of your PS3 consoles don't even support them?

King of Fun UK

and BC just slips further and further away....

kitsuneconundrum

@AngelMayLaugh: Ya seriously, wheres the dreamcast love.

kagebutsu

The Gamecube is currently outselling you 5:1

Hi-oooh.

Chriky

Ten year lifecycle seems to be the mantra of PS3 nowadays. They move the goal post 10 years forward seeing they can't achieve dominance as they've used too. Just give us the god damn GAMES, and we give you 10 YEARS! & cheaper price...

ahmeng

@Fryfat: give them time they say!!! about 10 years should start the ball rolling

shaunomacx

@Garo: Right on! Many people had love for the Dreamcast when the PS2 came out, and the crowd cheering on the Dreamcast was far louder than the crowd cheering on the PS2. The Dreamcast fans used to tout the online capabilities and the larger video memory. The PS2 crowd used to shout about the DVD technology and the slightly faster clock speed. Ha ha Microsoft provided the OS for the Dreamcast also!

Sounds alot like the current gen ay?

There is a bit of a difference though this time.

EA got burnt from it's support for the Saturn, and refused to support the Dreamcast. This put alot of gamers off getting one.

But I think Kaz is correct.

Alot of people are pissed off because the Xbox and Gamecube are no longer supported.

It's sad, and i know that the xbox 360 has, at most, 6 years in it.

GOD

@Fryfat: What? I don't get your comment. =/

AngelMayLaugh

@TheIrishNinja: Lol. Damn straight!

As to Kaz's questions:

Gamecube lives on in the backwards-compatible Wii, which uses mostly the same hardware. And it's kicking your ass, by the way.

Xbox still lives - albeit a tormented, nightmarish existence where only half its games still work - within the 360, and the only reason it got killed off so quickly was because MS screwed up their hardware agreements. I wouldn't bet on them making that mistake again.

Anyways, I see his point, but just because the PS2 was an unparalleled success does not mean that the PS3 will be too.

freakout

As much as PS3 stinks... He's right. Looking back, PSone and Ps2 have given the best value for your money. Especially Xbox was killed way too soon.

Ehetyz

@Replica23: Original!

Murderdolls

@StealthMaster86: well i wouldn't say that GOW2 was kick ass but ps2 has a bunch of ass kicking games coming out. i"m looking at you yakuza 2 now i really need to get some sleep

Gypse-scum

@TheIrishNinja:
aaaaawww that's sweet ^__^

(I aawed out loud, or AOL)

on topic: I've always disliked companies having supported multiple systems, that might sound weird, but for me it's easier to choose a game when there is actually just one choice to make.

And while doing so (releasing games on the PS2 as well) you're not enlarging your future user base, people won't jump from PS2 to PS3 when you give them the option to stay behind. And saying it's for the people that can't afford a PS3, that's bullshit, since the PS2 and PS3 games are equally expensive (over here).
So if those PS2ers save their money on about 4 games they can buy a nice new PS3. Further more, by keeping the support alive developers keep pouring money into obsolete PS2 versions of games of new PS3 games (and X360, but I'm keeping it on the Sony level for now) thus wasting money they could have used to better the epic superior uber PS3 version of said game.
And all those PS2 left behindees are forced to watch the PS3 ad campaign for a game that's nowhere near as purdy as their version (I feel their pan ;__;)

That's like giving someone a peanutbutter sandwich accompanied with a glass of water and saying: "here take this and watch me eat this Crème brûlée of foie gras with Tonga beans dinner accompanied with a bottle of 1990 Louis Roederer Cristal"

That's just mean..

And by keeping the PS2 alive we're still forced to call the current generation of consoles NEXT GEN (which is starting to annoy everybody)

Shoot that old dog already Sony, it's starting to get senile.

And nobody wants an old senile dog! cute shiny puppies only!

Kamizzle

"The only way Kaz Hirai tracks time is with decades."

History should mean nothing?
We talk about the next Xbox already.
We talk about lack of 3rd party and hardcore games from Nintendo. Sounds like it's all happening again if you ask me. Yet we like to penny pinch rather than give people the truth.

Go Go Go.

Thetallywacker

To me the PS2 "died" When God Of War II came out. No game for the PS2 will ever be that good agian.

StealthMaster86

I don't think MS and Nintendo need to rely on their last generation to turn a profit.

Laughtrey

@King of Fun UK: *facepalm*

noliferuin (PSN+XBL)

@jaymac: it's not really the same. the consoles are dead because nobody is making games for them, BC is not the same as a console being supported

Gypse-scum

@King of Fun UK: your not the smartest kid are you?

Gypse-scum

Sorry, typo. "So", not "some."

jaymac

Where's the GC and Xbox? They're not really around because the Wii and 360 are doing some good right now. Oh yeah, and they're backwards compatible.

jaymac

I wonder when will Sony drop the PS2 and focus more on the PS3 as the main Gaming Console of Sony...2010 ?

xCruciaLx

@Kamizzle:

Yeah Sony shoot your Cash-cow, shoot it! /sigh

Garo

What bothers me most is that according to his philosophy we should buy PS3 because of the potential 10 year lifespan, not because of games or anything like that, Sony's only real selling point for PS3 has been "future potential" from the beginning, one should buy PS3 because PS2 was so amazing console, hey we lost some exclusives again but we have 10 year lifespan plan so it doesn't matter!

Bottom line: No way Sony will continue to support PS3 that long if it ends up in third place in this race, they have to forget PS3 and roll out PS4, or they can say goodbye to video-game business.

Hansel

I'm pretty sure if the PS2 didn't get the success it did in sales Sony would have dropped it too.

No sense in taking a still-lactating cash cow to the slaughter house right?

AngryTankManMax

@bigdude209: removing BC was definitely a bad decision, as the PS2 has many many great games. that said, how often did people here play PS1 games in their PS2? a few times certainly, but 99.9% of the time, they'll have played PS2 games in their PS2. same can be said for playing xbox games in the 360, or gamecube games in the wii. BC only matters for a relatively small amount of people.
i do love the BC in my 60gig PS3 though. playing through dragon quest 8 :D

noliferuin (PSN+XBL)

I think that Sony has made a mistake in getting rid of BC. To me the PS2 has a range of titles that are considerably cheap. The console hasn't even really gotten decent range of lower priced quality titles to purchase. I mean we are just now getting a greatest hits, and the qualtiy titles that have been out for months(if not a year) are still priced at $60.

To me Sony could have used BC in the PS3 as a transition point to get people to play franchises that have been established on the PS2 that consumers never had chance to play. The multiplatform titles coming out are just starting to become on par with the 360, but not everybody is going to buy every $60 game they see, so its up to Sony to get some of their quality titles(like Uncharted,R&C) at budget prices to sale some games. Until something like that takes place, I don't see Sony considerably gaining anything without PS2's library of titles. Anybody who simply wants an evolved traditional gaming experience(not a Wii) for less money is more likely to look at the 360 for that. Incentives as far games/hardware are what made PS2 a strong seller, but the PS3(as much as I love it) does not have clear incentives to a average customer who would look at the price upfront.

bigdude209

If the PS3 sells 100 million units before the PS4/Xbox-720/WiiHD are ready, then it will undoubtedly be around for 10 years too.

If it sells anything like the PS2 did, then its sales will be guaranteed for years just by people replacing their worn-out consoles.

But I can't see that happening at this stage.

Marlor

He does know that the wii plays gamecube games FULLY right and that a gamecube is not needed to play gamecube games anymore.

majortom1029

@Aglet: they were referring to not wanting to push home out early. yes, the PS3 was pushed out a bit early, but the competitors forced their hand.

noliferuin (PSN+XBL)

@Hansel: They may have a 10 year plan for the PS3 but they'll roll out the PS4 at year 6 (2012) and will keep supporting the PS3 with below-average games until it hits the 10 year mark!
If Sony believes the PS3 will stand up to the next consoles from MS and Nintendo (probably coming out in 2012 as well) they must be mad!

henri1kk

@Kaz: "...we don't want to prematurely launch it and then be dinged for having a bad service... this is a platform initiative which means that we need to be extra careful that we've crossed all the 't's and dotted all the 'i's."

So... Adding trophy system and fixing the XMB post launch isn't any clue to that the system was "prematurely launched"?

And I can only agree with everyone that says the BC should still be there. I for one just bought a PS2 to be able to play the first Killzone, Ico, Shadow of the Colossus and a bunch of other games because I haven't had the time before. I'll just have to search for an old PS3 when it is time to get one of those.

Aglet

@iLov3:
Well,considering that they are outselling MS in the US for this year and will most likely continue for the rest of the year.No need to mention Japan and Europe and the PS3 is ahead of where the PS2 was in it's lifetime.That's not too bad.

enewtabie

But the Wii does complete BC of the gamecube, unlike the bloody gimped BC (now completely gone in european models) for PS3!
and damn that bastard for that dig at the N64....sniff.....

excel_excel

I wonder if the PS2 is still selling because of the three CURRENT-GEN systems, PS3 is the only one without some measure of backwards compatibility.

Or wait, does it now? I can't keep it straight anymore.

TRT-X

@TheIrishNinja: Best. Comment. Ever.

markusdragon

Where's the Xbox? Where's the GameCube?! Where's the PS3 man! It's like it's so nearly been there for the last year, but they don't seem to be catching up on their competitors. We all know you can do it, just get a move on. Home was announced and demoed over a year ago wasn't it? I don't see why we're still getting speeches about how it's not quite ready.

In summary, you're living in the past Grandpa! Dreamcast beat all your asses anyway! :P

iLov3

Hell, I still see new gamecubes in most department stores games sections. I know they're probably not making them anymore, but they are still shipping them to stores until they are gone.

And besides, the Wii and 360 are both backward compatible. The Wii in particular has near perfect backward compatibility with every cube game ever made. They are the only ones who got BC right this gen. You really have zero need to keep making the gamecube when the Wii is both cheap and fully BC.

And yeah, what one guy above said, of course you'll support a massively successful platform from last gen, when your current gen console is struggling. What real choice do you have Kaz?

subnet6

I never really understood all of this. Whenever I get into an argument with a friend between the 360 and the PS3, my friend (the PS3 owner) always brings up what's coming up for the console in the future.

This was a fine argument, until I realized that the same excuse was being used for the PS3 month after month.

I do not recall anything like that during the time I owned a PS2. I probably purchased the console around midway in its lifespam (around the time MGS2 came out), but it just seems like such a different time and justifying the PS3 using the PS2's track record just seems invalid.

Ophanin

It's actually pretty god damn easy Kaz!
Once Nintendo sells 120 million Wii's and you sell about 30 million PS3's I can guarantee you that the 10 year life expectancy plan of the PS3 goes down the toilet.

KEELr

@FP_slomo788: At Least Sony does it when necessary. Microsoft sticks to their spring/fall updates so you'll have to live with all wrongs (and rights) for about six months before they get around and fixes it.

Aglet

He's dead on with his statements. I was just getting back into gaming and bought an xbox a couple of years after it was released. In about a year the thing was dead, with no new releases. Kind of felt burned about that.

kratosfan

@Aglet: "So... Adding trophy system and fixing the XMB post launch isn't any clue to that the system was 'prematurely launched'?"

No, that's not a clue. In fact it just means that everything will come in time. Thanks to firmware updates, PS3 can continue to evolve. I don't recall any console being perfect at launch, but at least this generation they can be perfected as they go along.

FP_slomo788

Wait, Kaz Hirai is talking about waiting to release things until they're ready?! Wow, I think the irony may well consume the universe...

Rebochan

@jaymac: The 360 is BC? It supports 300 Xbox titles and it's BC? If we want to be that blindly technical then the 40 GB PS3 is BC because you can play PS1 titles. See what I did there?

@Fryfat: I'm sorry, but they have both amazing first parties (more than Nintendo and MS put together) and important exclusives (MGS4, L.A. Noire and Valkyria Chronicles all sound pretty important to me). And lackluster sales? They are catching up, and the PS3 woke up much earlier than anyone expected.

FP_slomo788

Ok, it's cool if Sony wants to support last gen for a while, but they need to stop acting like it's necessary or something to brag about. Especially when they remove backwards compatibility from PS3s.

PS2 sells like a beast and dominated last gen, so it will continue to sell. Xbox and GC not so much. Yeah, they don't support them any long in the way Sony does, but they're completely focused on this gen. And that's why they're at spots 1 and 2. They don't need advice from third place on how to run their show. I wouldn't make fun of someone who runs faster than me for doing it different than I did, because I'm obviously doing things that are unnecesary for the race if I'm losing.

It's like that. I don't really want a console to last me 10 years, especially when it lacks the HD goodness and other things my next gen consoles have.

karasu is my homeboy

@KEELr: I agree to a point but PS3 should sell significantly more than 30 mil; it's already at 20.

quen

Whatever happened to BetaMax and other Sony initiatives that weren't the dominant technology?

The real answer is that the PS and PS2 make money so they won't kill them off. It has nothing to do with charity. Just like they were still making the original VW Beetle in Mexico recently, if MS and Nintendo were making money from their old platforms we would still see them somewhere.

peacefuloutrage

I don't know where my Gamecube is, but I sure as hell know where my Gamecube games are.

I don't have a PS3, yet, but I imagine I'll be buying used for the Emotion Engine if I ever get one.

PerswAsian

@Ophanin: True. But why have we had to wait for all the updates (at least the good ones) to come out every six months?
And why do we get a re-design now all of a sudden? I welcome a redesign of what I believe is a clumsy interface. But the iTunes look I can live without, I have iTunes on my computer, that's well enough.
It's nice to see change in all ways, but I just like the approach Sony is taking: Release updates when an update is finished and just add a tiny number (2.4.0.31.555 maybe?) and at least people will get that update.

What I really do want to stress though is that Kaz has made some weird statements. They released a broken console sure. But saying one thing (rumble is last gen) and then doing another (without saying they were wrong) is weird in my book.
Trophies is a great example of this. They didn't have it when they started, the community (I guess) demanded it and now they're adding it.
Home can take all it's time, I look forward to it. But the greatest sum-up of this E3 was done by Mike and Terry in one panel. [www.penny-arcade.com]

Sony needs to deliver, not talk.

Aglet

@Aglet: When has one of the updates to the 360's firmware make something "wrong" for six months? I never recall having any issues.

Ophanin

Alot of people on here don't seem to realise the PS3 is doing better then the PS2 did in this time frame. But oh well,

ryivanV2

To be honest, Kaz is setting him up for a historical comparison that he just isn't going to like. Where's the N64? Nowhere. But the NES and the SNES had long lifespans too. Does that make the PS3 like the N64? Maybe.

Doomstalk

maybe someone should've told kaz that backwards compatibility would've sold ps3s while eliminating the past console, kinda like what the wii has done; my gamecube is still with me (it's inside my wii) :)

genbeef

@FP_slomo788: The 360 supports disc in tray BC. I'm thinking the PS1 BC you're referring to on the PS3 is the games you have to rebuy...right?

Kinda like how nobody counts the VC as BC because you have to rebuy the game vs. putting your old catridge in the slot.

TRT-X

I aggree with his comments. How long into the lifespan of both systems did top notch games actually start being release regularly? I don't think they've begun to tap the full power of the pS3. I'm not worried about the system. And honestly when you compare the systems pound for pound PS3s games are just as good if not better than xbox.

Metropolis

@boots555: And done what with it? Play the weak library of PS3 games out at that time?

Purchase Blu-Ray media without knowing who was going to win in the format war?

Sure, we could play PS2 games, but we could also get a PS2 for much cheaper.

Ophanin

@FP_slomo788: Better first party developers than Nintendo?

There's something seriously, horribly wrong with you.

blacksamurai87

@Ptolemy: God of War 2 came out last year.

FP_slomo788

All you guys crying about BC should had just went and bought the 60GB model at launch and not need to sweat it.

boots555

@everybest:
yogi berra would be proud

j.m.ratkos

@Aglet:
I'm probably lying to make myself feel better, but I always figured that keeping to a long cycle like that would ensure that the updates coming out are of a high quality. Again, I'm probably just comforting myself. Also, if it's not broke, don't fix it.

I'm a bit on the fence about the UI change; I don't think the dashboard is broken, but I feel it does become a bit clumsy when browsing through the large amount of content on the marketplace.

Home. I really do not know about it. I feel like Sony has been hyping it for so long (I only recently purchased a PS3, but have heard about Home for a long time) that it, to me, is becoming the Duke Nukem Forever of console software.

I also do not quite follow Sony's implementation of Trophies. I find one of the draws of the 360 Achievement system (which I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Sony emulated) is that every game has it. Having the software come out this late in a game seems exactly like what it is: a fix to placate the masses. Sure, I'm happy to have it, but I feel pretty strongly that either all games should have it or not. I know that's more or less impossible to achieve at this point, but it's what I would want.

Summing up my rambling comment, I think Sony is really not doing things right. The PS3 is a great piece of hardware, and the interface (for the most part) is elegant to use (although not, to me, the most functional). However, Sony needs to try and keep games exclusive, and deliever content that was promised eons ago (Home).

Exclustive games will sell the console and increase its lifespan; look at MGS4. Having games, like FFXII, go multiplatform does not hurt the gamers. All it does is hurt the console.

Ophanin

I don't get it, is Sony still actively producing software for the PS2, or is it all 3rd party stuff, which is what I thought it was?

I mean yeah, to the PS2's credit, they sold gobs of 'em, of course there's still gonna be support for them, they made that thing synonymous with video games. Yeah, I guess they can call price drops and repackaging the PS2 "support". I would also call full backwards compatibility support as well. Funny how that disappeared.

Ptolemy

@Aglet: Must fill me in on those issue broham, hehe. For quite some time they have been doing it very well between updates.

R3load

@GhostWhoWalks: lol

That's even besides the point. on. Microsoft and Nintendo have sold more. Microsoft and Nintendo, for the most part, have been very punctual with what they want to do and have done this gen. Sony's the one stumbling behind, but instead of focusing harder and discussing their hardships with PS3, "Well...we still sell PS2s and they don't! So...apply that to this console war somehow please?"

@blacksamurai87: lmao yeah ridiculous huh. Better than Nintendo and Microsoft combined. Behold the logic that is slomo. As I was told, and the person that told the one that told me, it's better not to waste your time.

karasu is my homeboy

@FP_slomo788: there not first party games. First party would be if they were developed by Sony

excel_excel

@excel_excel: Not to mention the sequels from other established IPs (something Nintendo is known for) like Uncharted and such. GoW3 and GT5 don't hurt also. But that's diving well into 09 so I won't go further.

FP_slomo788

The Gamecube is right where it's always been. In my den. Sitting next to the Wii. Both of which see a ton of gameplay each day.

The PS2 and PS3 are right where they've always been. On the shelf at various stores around town.

To be fair, I had a PSone before the Gamecube...but I eventually traded it and my PS1 library in to pay for a DS Lite. Which, when not in use, sits on the shelf next to my GBASPs.

Your own situation is YMMV, of course.

eugaet

@excel_excel: Resistance 2, LBP, KZ2, Socom, MS2, Fat Princess, the next R&C. And that's just on top of my head.

FP_slomo788

@FP_slomo788: you said first party titles from Sony, please enliten me to what those FIRST PARTY games are?

excel_excel

The way Sony is forcing non-BC SKUs almost exclusively into retail, it's like their forcing the PS2 to live on. The last two games I can think of that are really worth it for PS2, exclusively, are Persona 3 FES and Persona 4. Let's hope P4 works on a software hardware PS3. :(

formina

@genbeef: I... see what you did there?

FP_slomo788

@TRT-X: No I mean PS1 discs. That you can also play via Remote Play while they're in the PS3.

@blacksamurai87: Well I'm sorry if you're offended but I want to believe that Sony's lineup is far better than Wii Sports 2 and Wii Music. And I'm positive most gamers will agree. But whatever floats your boat.

FP_slomo788

@Aglet: When Microsoft introduces an issue with their patches, they will roll out a fix before the next update (though the only issue I can really think of was a local exploit to run unsigned code). They've had an excellent track record of stable, reliable updates, and you can tell that they use their long cycle for extensive testing. And the features they've added to the Dashboard have only made the system better, so their "rights" enormously outweigh any perceived wrongs on that front.

Doomstalk

*shakes his head* Kaz, Kaz, Kaz...you still don't get it, do you?

The REASON the PS2 is still around is because your PS3 has so-far flopped. Where are the Gamecube and XBox? They're in the Wii and 360.

GhostWhoWalks

@FP_slomo788: if the ps3 is to reach perfection, then yes it would take a ten year cycle!

genbeef

I'm surprised nobody's said this before, but I think it every time they push this '10 year life cycle' stuff out.

Why do I need to buy one now, then? I can wait until 7 years in and buy one for a fraction of the cost...and then buy all the games at a fraction of the cost, too, right?

But in the meantime I will play a system that had a 1 year head start on you and therefore has a larger number of games that are available cheaper than yours and has already dropped in price.

For the moment I'm not going to be making Sony's console sales look good, but I may contribute to the longevity of the PS3 eventually...unless PS4 blows my socks off (before the PS3 dies) and is fully backwards compatible, that is.

BeerLover

Like Kratos, in the end Sony will triumph.

Al87

Why all the hate? Sony was the only one who actually did it right. Pretty much all non-EA X-box games dried up 6 months before the 360 even came out. The second that the Wii came out there was Paper Mario for the GC...and that's it.

JayrodT

Where is the XBox, Kaz? In the living rooms of millions of enthusiasts who find that an modded XBox with XBMC runs rings around both the PS3 and XBOX 360 media servers.

It gives a whit about regional encoding.

IT gives a whit whether the format is PAL or NTSC.

It gives a whit whether or not the media is DRM-laden.

It gives a whit about the video format (it supports nearly every video format out there).

It was designed by ENTHUSIASTS for ENTHUSIASTS. Thus it is very powerful, easy to use, with so much flexibility that one can create just about anything they want to with it due to its support of scripting.

I will ALWAYS have a modded XBox in my living room. XBMC plays just about anything that I throw at it.

bornonce

Maybe we don't see the Xbox and Gamecube around anymore because those two companies actually managed to release a next generation system people were interested in and that had, I dunno, GAMES. I guarantee that as soon as the PS3 has an actual game library and not just Metal Gear Solid 4, Sony will be completely over the PS2.

Of course, they might be releasing the PS4 by then at the rate they are going.

Baboon

@Ken: but see.. when PS2 came out. it was "hard to program for" jusat like they're saying with the PS3. Why not just get over it instead of just pussying out and not making stuff for PS3?

stargateheaven

@FP_slomo788: scared me there!

excel_excel

@excel_excel: Yeah I kinda get it now. I thought the concept was simpler, but again thanks for pointing it out. And I know you weren't criticizing it was a good point to bring up.

FP_slomo788

@FP_slomo788: I wouldn't consider gears first party no. you said that the games were all developed internally which just isn't true. I'm not critising the line up but there not first party, heck I would consider barely any 360 games first party. Just because a game is exclusive doesn't make it first party.

excel_excel

@excel_excel: My last post was also directed at you.

FP_slomo788

@FP_slomo788: @henri1kk: Fair enough. For me if an IP is owned and/or published by a platform holder it is first-party. I might be wrong, and I thank you for the clarification. In any case, I stand by what I said, at least for Nintendo.

FP_slomo788

@FP_slomo788: You don't understand anything you're trying to talk about. Microsoft bought Rare. Microsoft funds Mistwalker. Microsoft used to own Bungie

See how that works?

Exclusives DO NOT equal first party.

Some 360 1st Party games
PDZ
Kameo
Banjo
Lost Odyssey
Halo 3 (before Bungie left Microsoft)

There are other games Microsoft Game Studios publishes, but they aren't first party games. Microsoft just pays for distribution because they want the game on their platform and the games need a publisher.

Sony has NOTHING to do with Insomniac as a developer, or most of the games you listed. Nothing. Resistance is absolutely not a first party game, as oppossed to something like Banjo Kazooie or Halo 3 which are first party.

Learn how things work before spouting your opinions as facts.

karasu is my homeboy

ouch, didn't realize there were carriage returns in that post. my bad. copied the list off Wikipedia.

mrantimatter

@excel_excel: Do second party devs count as internal?

because that would include:
Sony Computer Entertainment Inc.
Clap Hanz - Hot Shots Golf series
Polyphony Digital - Gran Turismo series, Motor Toon Grand Prix series, Omega Boost
SCE Japan Studio (Project Siren Team, etc.) - Ape Escape series, LocoRoco
Team ICO - ICO, Shadow of the Colossus

Sony Computer Entertainment America Inc.
Incognito Entertainment - Twisted Metal series, Warhawk
Naughty Dog - Jak series, Uncharted
SCE Bend Studio (formerly Eidetic) - Syphon Filter series
SCE Foster City Studio - Jet Li: Rise to Honor
SCE San Diego Studio - The Mark of Kri, NBA '07, MLB The Show 08
SCE Santa Monica Studio - God of War, Kinetica
Sony Online Entertainment LLC. - EverQuest
Zipper Interactive - SOCOM: U.S. Navy SEALs series

Sony Computer Entertainment Europe Ltd.
Bigbig Studios - Pursuit Force
Evolution Studios - MotorStorm
Guerrilla Games - Killzone series
SCE London Studio (includes Team SOHO & Camden) - The Getaway series, SingStar series
SCE Studio Cambridge (formerly Millennium Interactive) - MediEvil series, Primal
SCE Studio Liverpool (formerly Psygnosis) - Wipeout series, F1 series

Sony Computer Entertainment Korea Inc.
SCE Korea - EyeToy: EduKids, GloRace: Phantastic Carnival

mrantimatter

@excel_excel: Not only are they not developed by Sony as first party games, the studios aren't owned by Sony. For example, Microsoft owns rare and has huge financial stakes in Mistwalker.

Insomniac is an independant developer who just happens to be focusing on PS3. Exclusives =/= first party.

karasu is my homeboy

@Ken: Ho snaps, someone has the same thoughts as me! Not only is the PS2 cheap, but if people want the PS3 and they got it cheap, the 40GB doesn't read PS2 games. PS2 has a larger library, anyway.

Lainface

@FP_slomo788: Gears is not first party but I think Fable is because MS owns Lionhead! I may be wrong!

henri1kk

Well, the only last gen console I still have is a PS2, although admittedly it doesn't get much playtime anymore except from my sister.

Still buying lots of PS2 game though!

ƒox

@hanspecans:

You say that, but that's not been the case with the ps1 and ps2. Both were well supported after their successor arrived on the scene. Heck, people still buy old ps1 games when availible, and ps2 is still a strong seller.

mrantimatter

@excel_excel: Would you consider Gears and Fable 3rd party games or first party? If it's published by a platform holder, I'm positive it's a first-party game. If not, Microsoft would have zero first part title.

And my logic might be hard to follow (especially for 360 fanboys), but at least I control my biases and I'm not a hypocrite. Some here have "already chosen their side" in their little war yet dare calling others fanboys (I own a PS3 and a 360). And they find "no games" justifying friend codes but when it comes to bashing Sony they will start hyping Nintendo. Sad, sad really.

FP_slomo788

What's up with the Sony execs exaggerating the age of the PS2 all of a sudden. I noticed Jack Tretton make the same nine year reference during the E3 conference. I mean, sure it was in development nine years ago.

Are they confusing the PS2 with the Dreamcast? Cause it was out nine years ago...

superbagman

@ThursdayNext: So true though. I expect to be playing on my PS3 into 2015...

I take it you're not anticipating Sony to offer Backward Compatibility in the PS4 for PS3 games either?

adinnieken

@FP_slomo788: err....there not. Insomniac do Resistance and Rachet and Clank. LBP is made by media molucle. Slant Six Games make Socom. I don't think any of the games you mentioned are done internally by Sony

excel_excel

"The only way Kaz Hirai tracks time is with decades."

His watch is really slow.

Eltigro

you know in 10 years i really want to be playing games on a 10 year old machine.
such stupid "logic".

out with the old in with the new.

hanspecans

@excel_excel: I'm sorry but these are games developed internally and published by Sony.

FP_slomo788

@bornonce: I'm pretty sure it was made by a CORPORATION for CONSUMERS. I'm also pretty sure that there aren't millions of modded X Boxes out there. I mean, they sold 24 million units, most going to regular Joe Schmoes who bought the damn thing for his kids. Those who bought the X Box were screwed over by Microsoft.

And I don't know about all you people who claim the Gamecube sits in every household EVAR. It sold nearly 22 million consoles WORLD WIDE over SEVEN years. The Gamecube, in terms of number of consoles sold over its lifespan, was a bust (compared to the 13 million PS3 units sold over the last two years, the 19 million 360 units sold over the last three years, the obscene amount of Wiis sold, and the PS2 and X Box).

Who plays Gamecube games on their Wii? You might. But I can guarantee that the majority of Wii owners out there play only one game: Wii Sports. Backwards compatibility be damned.

This isn't some ranting of a Sony fanboy. This is a rebuttal to those Sony Haters who hate Sony for being Sony. If you're going to hate on a console, I think you should have a justifiable reason.

notquitecenter

That last sentence made my day Brian. LOL.

gencid

People are complaining about longevity now? Seriously?

Wolfers

@mrantimatter:
yeah but it's a different world now as compared to then with the ps1 and ps2. the times they are a changing. back then sony's consoles had good games. now they just sell a dust gathering blu-ray player that might be able to run a second life port in a year or two. and you know, maybe a good game will come out once a year or so.

hanspecans

Where are the 1st party PS2 games? :(

KaliKOtt

Ok guys... Fact check me here... because, hey, I've definitely been wrong before... But I think the 10 year comparison is not as an excuse... it's as a comparison. (this is long so clear out now if you want)

Don't get me wrong... Microsoft has a nice chunk of games... the only exclusives that tempt me so far are Mass Effect & Fable 2... but that's just me, there are lots for others and I get that. Nintendo is crushing in hardware, but the software available is pretty sad. I would not want to be 3rd party developing for the big N.

Here's the fact check part... the reason I think it's appropriate to compare historically, is because you can compare it currently.

PS3 in the same number of months since launch(Nov 11 2006, or roughly 20 months) has;

1)Matched (or beat, need clarification) PS2 sales in it's same time frame since launch. (PS2's first 20 months)

2)Outsold Xbox 360 in the same time frame. (360's first 20 months)

Now previous sales in former systems or current trends are no guarantee... we all know that games are going to sell the systems(unless you're nintendo)... but it's a pretty good indication that things are on track.

Writing off the PS3 would be akin to saying the original xbox would be crushed as it never matched the PS2 in sales. Well it came out a year later and never managed to catch up.

PS3 came out a year later and is already gaing ground. I don't blame MS in doing everthing they can to keep Sony back there... they don't want them to get ahead again.

Who'll win this war?

I don't know if anyone can catch the Wii... it may never enter my house, but It'll probably be at my mother's who wants to show it to her grandkids & quilting club... but why would Nintendo care, their raking in cash and it doesn't matter if it's coming from Parents of pre-teens and seniors as opposed to 35+ guys like myself who've been throwing joysticks since asteroids.

MS has a strong core gamer start but I think they need to do more definitively MS games and hang on to exclusives. Bioshock would have been another reason for me to go with them, now it's something I just need to wait for. I think they see going toe to toe with Sony ONLY is a losing proposition for them and that's why they are going so vehemently after that slice of the casual pie. Whatever makes them a winner is good for the industry though... I think competition breeds innovation and we all benefit from that.

I've been a Sony boy since Battle Arena Toshinden but my dollars have been pulled out of my wallet by the N64, GameCube and original xbox but experience has shown me that I get more of what I want from Sony. I bought 4 games for the N64. 2 for the cube (RE4 & Zelda... how many of you in that boat?) and 4 for the xbox. Meanwhile I traded in 32 games and my Ps1 to get my PS2 w/ 2 games.... It was still kicking when I sold it last Christmas to a guy I work with for $100, (threw in 4 games) and I had another 23 left to trade to put toward my purchase of my PS3 last novemember. So far I have 5 disc games purchased, another 7 PSN full games purchased (dozens of free demos, love it!) and 4 more MUST BUYS this year alone.
I have an external hard drive hooked up with literally hundreds of tv programs (all 5 seasons of the muppet show thankyou!) movies and documentaries (planet earth w00t). Not to mention 21 titles purchased so far on Blu-ray on my 52" Sony Bravia... and I get mor compliments on my set up and wives turning to husbands and saying "but I thought we had HDTV? It doesn't look that good!

Bottom line, Sony gave me a reason to have them now and a reason to want more.

Microsoft can get my money if they can show me a few more MS exclusives I can't get on PS3... right now I'm not doing it for 2 titles, Mass Effect & Fable 2(Gears & Halos 3 are tempting, but while I like shooters, I don't love them, not since Golden eye anyway, I just don't have the reflexes to keep up to the ADD twitch kids). What my friends 360 is good for now is showing me games I need to go buy for my PS3... Guitar Hero 3 & GTAIV for example. I find , for me, their online games more compelling (wish Geometry Wars & Zuma would hit the PSN). Make me want to give you my money. I'm sure to some degree, this is how 360 owners who have time and money invested in their systems feel about the prospect of getting a PS3 as well.

Nintendo... not that you want or need it... but you couldn't get my money even if you had my atm card, personal access code and a crowbar. But I wll go watch the Wii Fit girl again right now... so "Thanks!

JimmyNice

Hard to believe he's bringing this up just after the announcement of the complete removal of backwards compatibility. After all, any of my Gamecube titles I can just load into my Wii there, Kaz....

zymase

@JimmyNice: Well, of course it always boil down to the console having the games you want to play and giving you the experience you enjoy.

I got burnt really bad with the XBox and the GC last gen, I held out on the XBox for a while to see if MS was serious, they sorta were, but there was no excuse for Nintendo with the Gamecube...

zoesch

Screw you Kaz! You know what happened to the Saturn! And now you don't even mention the Dreamcast? Shame on you and your poorly selling system.

SuperSplashBro

Where's the XBox? Where's the GameCube? Why, on my shelf, along with my PS2, Dreamcast and Sega Saturn, of course! (other systems are on other shelves, if you must know ^_^)

relic1980

I just yesterday bought Beyond Good and Evil for my original Xbox. I still love to play that thing when COD 4 gets boring. Not like after 5 years it turned to dust.

cmonty06

@excel_excel: *points* Nintendo fanboy! :D

I guess most gamers were at some point in their lives. Unless they were diehard SEGA fans. How sad for them.

Crawl to China

Ha using the PS2, that is ridiculous what about Backwards compatibility on the PS3, its clear there hanging it out to dry, I wish a good journalist would really rail some questions to these guys - THAT is the problem with gaming at the moment.

Ryuujin1024

I read his statement including the word [support]. Where has the support for the GC, Xbox, etc.. etc.. gone? The Xbox 360 and Wii came out and almost instantly all support for the GC and Xbox died out. There are no new games for either system, not even of the Madden kind... (fact check)

While I do agree, it'll be interesting to see how Sony treats the PS3 going forward if they do not manage to reach the top, or at least a good enough buy in amount.

Aex

*looks at picture*

"Yeah ladies my console life cycle is that long."

GreyFoxV1

Where's the GameCube, you ask?

Well, Kaz, it was slightly upgraded, with a new controller. You might have heard about it, it's called Wii, and I heard it wasn't doing bad on sales...

Rockman-X

So what Kaz is saying is that he doesn't look for the PS3 to be successful until it is the outdated workhorse console like its older brother is now?

Gouki4u's avatar has a severe case of Jekyll and Hyde

@JimmyNice:

Right on both counts there, but there are a few more things you really have to look at.

Fisrt of all, I am going to leave the Wii completely out of this. I love mine to death, and I think we both agree that it is so far at least the undisputed leader of this generation, so there is really no need to discuss it. I am going to instead focus on the PS3 and Xbox 360.

I am including a graph here so you can se what I am talking about. It sets the PS2, Xbox 360, and PS3 against each other starting at their launches.

[vgchartz.com]

Up until the last few months, the PS3 wasn't surpassing the Xbox 360. They were almost evenly matched. It wasn't until a very recent upturn in sales by the PS3 that they started surpasing the 360. But, as you can see easily if you aling the big three by date instead:

[vgchartz.com]

That upswing is shared by the Xbox 360. It is just hard to see because it is further down the line.

The PS3 has indeed been selling the same as the PS2 in the same time frame, but lest we forget, for the first few months there everyone was sure the PS2 was going to bomb. It wasn't until the mainstream public started lathing onto it as a cheep DvD player once the public accepted the technology that it began its climb into the heavens. I (and many others out there) just don't see that happening with Blu-ray. The technology just requires too much of an investment right now with not enough appreciable difference to the average consumer. Personally I think by the time HD is adopted in enough homes to make Blu-ray an actual viable format... we will all be getting our movies digitally distributed, making the technology unnecessary.

Your idea about Bioshock works the other way around as well. The only PS3 exclusive worth a damn right now is Metal Gear Solid 4, and after the recent Final Fantasy announcement and the rumblings I have been hearing, I will give you very good odds we see that going to the land of Microsoft before a year has passed.

The simple fact is, the time of the third party exclusive is over. Who of these two will "Win" is really a moot point. Neither will. They are going to coexhist, glaring angrily at each other and trying to impress upon the public how different they are when reall, when it comes down to it, you can get pretty much the same experience on both.

Baboon

Nintendo and Microsoft are too busy thinking about this generation of consoles to care about their old systems. Sony should do the same, maybe we'd see more than just MGS4 as an example as a good exclusive PS3 game.

Takuthehedgehog

Like it or not, he's got a point. The PS series has always been an excellent investment since Sony has made it a point to keep it supported through a long lifecycle.

Providence

hey kaz, there's a xbox sitting in my living room still, collecting dust, but still there.

wizll

People whining about BC are such trolls. Sony DID offer consoles with BC, but the thing is no one bought them. So to lower the price they axed it, and sales rose. There are 100 million+ PS2 consoles out there, people can still play games on those consoles as well as ones still being sold in stores.

BC is important in the Wii and Xbox360 because they NO LONGER sell the previous consoles. If Sony stops making PS2's and there's no software emulation to play PS2 games, then you have a reason to bitch about BC. If you want to play PS2 games get a PS2. Stop trolling about it.

Firemane

@Ken: Some stuff like the programming can't really be helped, sony can provide some nice libraries and some other stuff to make stuff easier, but the fact of the matter is that most consoles, computers, etc. are going multi core. Programming efficiently on multi processor systems, and especially doing games, is going to be hard. Just how it is. Developers can cry all they want, but if you don't tough up, and learn how to do it right, you're going to be out of a job.

I think Sony knows this. They wanted to get a head start, they knew the cell is going to take a while for people to get 70-85% of it's processing power. This is probably why they invested inwards, so train their guys to program for the cell. This turns around to us gamers (hopefully) getting some really quality games that the competition can't match. Sony also knows thirdparties are in it for the money and not loyal. Microsoft might get into trouble if they don't step up their internal game department. gears(which doesn't really count since it's on PC as well) and halo won't sell their system for ever.

It's funny though, sony hasn't lost their brand power yet, when I ask people who don't know much about the state of the systems right now, about which console they would buy right now, most of them say ps3. Reason? 'I had a ps2, I'm used to Sony, and I like it' Pretty blind reasoning. When the ps3 drops down closer to <300$ I think that will be the time when we can really determine if the ps3 can last that 10year mark. The ps2 didn't really start to take off until
it hit that sweet spot.

sereal

For the sake of argument let's say that BC does not come back to PS3 in any form, ever. Business wise they are just following the trend that Nintendo and MS have already set.

Why support the old software that you already sold when you can spruce it up and sell it again? Xbox Originals, Virtual Console, Wii Ware anyone? Bring the old titles back and sell them again to new players that missed out, or just make it easier for older players to have a copy. We've all bought probably bought one or two by now.

This deal becomes bigger as PS2 is still selling in the millions, so Sony wants that trend to continue as they move PS2 to the "entry level" of consoles. There's a third hardware version of PS2 coming soon, just in time for the holidays (in the ninth year no less). PS2 is gonna be around a while so Sony is counting it as a separate business. When folks stop buying PS2/Sony stops making them then we'll get more BC support.

crashlanding

@Eltigro:

Mine has blast processing.

neverkilled

I'm still waiting for the dolphin to come out.

neverkilled

Where is my Xbox? It suffered the same fate as my PS2. It was sold to Gamestop to buy 360 games.

GorbyGipper

@FP_slomo788:
Sony has more amazing first party titles than NINTENDO!?!

That statement reeked of utter FAIL!

And when did L.A. Noir become an important exclusive?

maniacmayhem

@ThursdayNext: Your comment seriously made me LOL.

lassiterb

Where's my Gamecube? I sold it.
Why? Because I own a Wii now, duh.

Where's my Xbox? Never owned one.
Why? Because the 360 came out so soon.

Where's my PS2? Sitting collecting dust.
Why? Because a PS3 is too ridiculously expensive.

PeteeWJ

Stop falling back on PS2 sales, Sony. Is this why you took out BC from the PS3's? So you can toot your horn on how PS2s are still selling well until now?

How about bringing back 100%BC so that we 100million+ users can have the option of upgrading so they can still have their PS2 library working on it in case our PS2s conk out when the time comes. Because we like to get a good deal on our purchases you know? And play the classics while waiting for the franchise sequels to come out.

Packing in the dualshock 3 is a step in the right direction for the new SKU, but failing to add BC again is still a no-sell for me and many others.

Putting in PS2 BC back can only help PS3 sales. You talk about moving forward with removing BC, but you have to look back to your roots before you can go anywhere.

conquerorsaint

@PeteeWJ: wait, your ps2 collects dust because the ps3 is too ridiculously expensive? hows that even work?

TheIrishNinja

I think that's some perfectly legitimate "oh snap!" from Kaz.

As for the Wii being the GameCube, the distinction is who's still releasing GameCube games? Hmm?

Chef

@AngelMayLaugh:

Dreamcast was disbaned becuase Sega dropped making consoles altogether.

Mega-CD, 32X and Saturn was dropped because Sega tried to shift focus to Dreamcast, but customers and developers can only accept that a number of times before growing wary, hence why Dreamcast didn't get any support, and it fizzled.

I myself think that Sony's continued support for the PS2 is something good, at least better than dropping support altogether.

Wahrheit

Augh who cares where the Xbox or gamecube is. I want to play Halo 3 on my 360, not my Xbox 1.

Lukems

Back when the Xbox was released, Microsoft had a habit of always selling the customer on what was to come next. With their operating systems, or Office or whatever else they were doing - it was always 'look to the future', never 'look how cool our current things are!'.

I don't think they ever planned on the xbox being around after the 360 came out - to the degree that they were already hyping up what was to come next as soon as the first one was out.

Now they've spent a decade in the console business they seem to be developing a good grasp that the money is made by focusing all attention on what you've got out now. Gamers don't really care to wait 2 or 3 years for what's going to be fun. It seems they're really trying to entrench the 360 now (hardware flaws killing lots of them not withstanding) with things like streaming netflix and xbox classic games as DLC on the 360. So while Sony like to remind us that they still sell lots of PS2's, I'd be more inclined to believe that 10 years after launch it will be the 360 going strong, not the PS3. After all, we are being a much more 'connected' world - who cares for bluray when you can download movies at the touch of a button?

(As for Nintendo - they've always had good long shelf lifes from their consoles, but that seems to be more the result of the dedication of their fans and the fact that they build hardware that lasts. I'd still be playing GoldenEye if I hadn't lost my N64 controllers :/)

fidgit_nz

@JimmyNice: ""but I thought we had HDTV? It doesn't look that good!"

Amen to that. Managed to make my parents buy an HDTV. Just have the PS3/bluray player left =)

Aglet

@FP_slomo788:

Okay, the 360 is at least on par with the ps3 in terms of backwards compatability. For one, at least you can play SOME games from the original xbox, which, for the most part, are the better games that came out for that system, don't get me wrong, every game not working is a pain in the ass, but, all the same, at least something works, plus on the xbox, you can DL previous generation games onto your box for $15 a game, which is great, because they offer some really great original xbox games that were hard to find because they were eclipsed by the release of the 360(indigo prophecy, psychonauts, and jade empire.)

Microsoft, at least when compared with the PS3, is winning in backwards compatibility with the last generation (xbox, ps2, GC), because, last I checked, playing something from your old system on your new system is better than playing nothing from your old system on your new system.

You can't flaunt remote play as a PS3 ability on par with the xbox, because in order to use remote play you need, IN ADDITION to a hefty-ass ps3, a psp, AND the original games, which aren't as good as the used to be (MOST of them, not all.) At best you could say PS3 is beating microsoft in the relatively small wealthy demographic who owns PS3s, PSPs, and has PSX games accessible.

The reason the xbox and gamecube aren't still around is because you can buy their successor at a reasonable price, sell your old system, and still play your old games, in addition to the new games, for your new console.

Avarise

What good will be a 10 year life cycle when your 2 competitors beat you 6 years earlier?

while ps3 might be growing at the same rate as ps2, Ps2 wasnt being outsold by MS and Nintendo last gen.

All sony has to counter anything their competit