@mva5580:

I disagree. Just think about last fall and how many great games came out. And then GTAIV comes out, followed by MGS, and then this fall looks packed to the gills again with great games. Really, 2007 was the best year for game releases since 2004, when Halo 2 and GTA San Andreas made it out in the same time period, and there were a half-dozen such great games, from Bioshock to the Orange Box to Call of Duty 4 to Mass Effect to Halo 3 to Unreal Tournament 3 and etc.

I think there are at least as many great games this generation, if not more than the previous.

Strangelove

Videogames are trying to be movies, difficulties are too low, Sandbox games instead on linear. Here are your problems for Japan and me.

loempiavreter

"It's not about the tech in Japan, it's about the games, it's about nostalgia."

Thank god for japan , i have a ps3, but i can wait ....
i don't mind playing a good game on ps2 , wii , ds or psp
i don't need HD graphics either

symphony_of_the_night

Take McKee's 'Story' where he talks about reinvention of genres. Apply + adjust that to gaming.
People generally like what they're used to, it's just perhaps the older games were a lot more challenging because it was more puzzle like and we found it harder to think/solve. Not that there aren't good enough bits in modern games that don't puzzle, it's that design takes more time I guess that people get wrapped over the design as opposed to the challenge. I think there's potential to apply the HD gaming, add visually creative designs and give them similarly challenging difficulties. I guess someone needs to spend time to think of something like that in 3d. We're a bit too 2d in our puzzle brains. In fact most tough puzzle questions in Mental Apt tests go with more 2d figures as opposed to 3d. There has to be some correlation.

Also isn't that Bashcraft with Payton?:P

Comments 'rnt Us (usually)

While this may be true on a vast level, it still amazes me how a lot of American games just don't look right to me. This is entirely my own opinion, but... a lot of the times, games made from American studios and such, for the most part, just take a huge dump on the intricate details that Japanese studios have spoiled me with. A huge example would be the Force Unleashed, at least the demo that I've played. Coming from a pretty big studio, LucasArts, the facial construction and animation is really piss poor when compared to that of a Soul Calibur IV, a Metal Gear Solid 4, and to a lesser extent, even a GTAIV. Hell, a lot of the facial animation I see in games today pales in comparison to even Tekken 5 for the PS2. I've seen a lot of devs use what I call muppet face. Their characters are so stiff and ridiculous looking to the point that when they open their mouths to talk they look like they've been constructed by Jim Henson's studio for an episode of the Muppet Show.

I have no idea where this tangent came from. Ha.

madpowerbomber

@mva5580: Unfortunately I agree that the current gen games are underwhelming. Or maybe I'm just getting older and have Nostalgitis.

Alphavillain

THere is a decline in japanese game development. Its cuz it costs a lot of money that's the smaller japanese developers are still making games for ps2 and to some extent the wii. There is a huge risk in making games for the 360 and ps3 since they cost more to develop.

But for the wii, the only games I play are the japanese ones such as sper smash bros and no more heroes. And the only game that interest me in that system now is Mad world.

PS3 wise, I don't know of any japanese exclusive games on the system. The ones that are out are multi console (DMC4 rocks!) and the RPGs have yet to come out.

360 has a host of japanese developed games that i enjoy though such as NG2 and Earth Defense Force. Plus lets not forget about the square enix and Namco Rpgs.

Its sad, my favorite games last gen were mainly japanese made. Luckily I enjoy my shooters and thats what 360 and ps3 seem to provide a lot of... I could use some diversity.

silentknome

I only buy Japanese games, I don't give a shit about anything else. Show me America's answer to Nihon Falcom and I may reconsider.

jeffx

Well Payton does make a good point about nostalgia and Japanese gamers. His point about the West's lukewarm reception about most Japanese games is also valid. In the past few years only a few games have broken the mold. MGS, Ninja Gaiden, and Smash Brothers are the big 3. Personally, I don't think that the Japanese emphasis on nostalgia is a bad thing, but given that devs in the West are attempting to make games that are more epic and lifelike it stands to reason that with an increase in graphics, storytelling, and work there must be an accompanying increase in technology. Which, sadly, is something that the Wii is behind on by about 5 years.

Which, again, isn't to say that the Wii is a bad system. I mean, it defined the term 'casual gamer' and found a multi-million dollar niche market. However, as long as games like Halo or MGS continue to be popular you will need systems that are capable of running them. Which is something that most gamers outside of Japan are definitely more interested in.

Burn1n9m4n

@mva5580: What you said made some valid points but I think "underwhelming" is too much. Though if you feel that way that's your sentiment.

I do agree that some games feel tacked on and are made with the intention of going through it quickly. They rely on the Multiplayer aspect a bit too much if you ask me.

Oh and please don't let this be a US vs Japan thread! God knows it's boring as hell...

excaliburps

If you go by the charts it's true....

I prefer to look at the situation from the "interesting" angle....they are going down a path that's different from ours and we get to see where it takes there gaming and they can see where it takes ours...it'll open up ideas on our end and hopefully will open up some eyes on there end.

I see no problems with this...so 3 companies can't control the WHOLE world with 3 machines......dang.

Canadiankid

US has the tech but Japan has the creativity.
Where else can milk-squirting, boy-touching,tentacle poking exist?

excaliburps

"I'm surprised at how many titles have been produced on the Unreal 3 Engine."
Me too, well not that surprised more like disapointed, for whats a very flawed engine (texture streaming issues and clipping problems happens too often in all games I've played on the U3 engine) less U3 engine...LESS!!

excel_excel

@mva5580: Haha, we both made more or less the same argument with that statement?!

ray89

"It's not about the tech in Japan, it's about the games, it's about nostalgia."

I think he hit the nail on the head with that, it's like movies (technology over story), well for me, it's not all about who has the best game engine, it's about having fun with the game, and like he says, nostalgia. I think the best example for me, are simple games from XBLA like Braid, or PSN games like Pixel Junk's Eden. And of course Nintendo Wii/DS.

So I think he's made some really good points there.

ray89

well, we are not as active or as on-the-go as the Japanese and do crave more reasons to be in front of a television to keep our lipid count in check.

ruba-dub-dub

Strider Hiryu needs his NES game remade now that Bionic Commando is done.

CaptLtrl

How about instead of just thinking about ideas, he come up with good ones instead?

PlayItBogart

"It's not about the tech in Japan, it's about the games, it's about nostalgia."

And that's such a terrible thing?

Sorry but this "generation" of systems has been rather underwhelming, in my opinion. Sure, games look better, but they sure as hell don't play better. There are very, very few games released now where you get that attachment to it and really feel sucked into the experience. Most games now are thrown together for the intention of getting through it quick, getting rid of it, and moving on to the next $60 purchase.

mva5580

I'm interested in how the decline in Japanese game development (quality, at least) is linked with the relative disappointment that has been the PS3 (obviously a Japanese-made console). I think there is a link...it's a shame, because I love the idea of being able to play Japanese import games on my PS3.

Alphavillain

@mva5580: I totally agree. This generation is poor in contrast to previous ones.

Refused

What exactly is this stigma of western technology in Japan? It sounds slightly xenophobic on Japan's part. I mean, do we not buy the Wii and PS3 because they're made in the East? Is that how we're supposed to be?

BurgerBat

The japanese like games that hold their hands and walk them through it. Games that use minimal critical thinking skills and puzzle solving. Don't ask me why but that is their mind set, where as we NA players (and devs) love to make/play games that are challenging and just plain hard.

Thats the only difference between us and who know why it exists but it does.

revolverx

My question is, when did this "nostalgia" set in? I don't believe it was there during the switch from SNES->PS1, and I don't remember it being there for the switch between PS1->PS2. Why this current generation?

As far as nothing appearing on the current gen that makes it worthwhile, well I submit Dead Rising. That game could not have been done with the previous generation. It's like seeing Tomb Raider on the PS1, MGS 2 on the PS2, Soul Calibur on the Dreamcast. Many games have also been made afterwards from many different companies which could not have been made on previous gen tech.

Tepoz

Tell that to Square-Enix, that continues to make a good number of exclusives for their country only.

Oh, and to Nintendo as well. That'd be nice. I want that fucking NES classic controller for the Wii.

Ashurahori

I don't know. Japanese gamers will go out and buy Dynasty Warriors *insert number* in droves and we wonder what's wrong with them. Yet, we'll go out and buy "Generic Shooter #213" and keep asking for more. It's just a difference in taste and culture as always. Ask Nintendo if they think Japan is in a decline. It's just another excuse for American failures across seas or Japanese developers who try to Americanize and also see the same failures.

Buttah

@excel_excel: Yeah, NG2 is exactly the game I was thinking of.

Alphavillain

God....all I can think of now is the ultimate nostalgia trip that Square Enix are working on somewhere....you know the one I mean, I don't even want it but you know they're making it

excel_excel

@Alphavillain: bad camera is my "favourite".
Too bleeding right, Ninja Gaiden, one of the worst cameras I've ever seen

excel_excel

I think the Japanese like to buy local, and that alone explains why Western games do poorly and why good Japanese games on the Western 360 won't sell.

But the real story is that with the increasinly global nature of console game development, Westerners now have a more content and technology choices and they don't just buy local. They buy what they want most to play. That means the era of Japan dominating sales becuse it's got all the systems and an ironclad lock on what gets developed has ended. This is a great era if you're a gamer.

ZumZ

Nostalgia? I don't think that's something limited to Japan. What games are people the most excited for? A new IP? Usually it's a game title with a number at the end, even for Western franchises. There's exceptions like LBP and Spore, but how many of us are getting pumped about Street Fighter 4, Tales of Vesperia, FF13, Fable 2, Killzone 2, Gears of War 2, and so many other titles?

I don't think any area is the center right now, though I think Europe has a slight edge.

Shin-san

@madpowerbomber: I agree that Japanese games are superb at detail. But Japanese games often have really critically annoying faults (bad camera is my "favourite") or seem to be aimede at a more fanatical fanbase than Western games, which offer an allround experience.

Alphavillain

@Strangelove:

*2004 also included Half Life 2

Strangelove

"The Japanese public seems to be disinterested in next-gen and high definition gaming," he said, pointing to the 360 and its apparent uphill battle in Japan as proof of that.

I'm sorry, you're pointing to a decidedly disliked console in Japan as proof that they don't appreciate next-gen and high-definition?

milkmonkey

Massive eh? Maybe he should go work on the M.A.G..

I hope the recent trend of 360s selling out in Japan continues though. Would make developers lives easier.

CaffeinatedGuy

Do gamers in Japan enjoy online gaming?
Do they like to play co-op games with friends?

The 360 seems to be the best console with a gaming community in mind, with the PS3 creeping up in 2nd and the Wii in a distant 3rd. The 360 does well in the US because gamers (the ones I know, at least) would pick playing with friends in new games over playing by themselves in older single player.

Your Show Sucks

Be not fooled, everything is how it should be.

The stage is simply being set for the coming console/species, "Sony Hypersystem" which will, and I promise (here me out) Single handedly reconfigre the entire human genome, to the point where man will be indistinguishable from Wearwolf.

Bone Structure

I never really understood the opposition to tech driven games that comes up in every thread of this type. It's like people dislike the concept of it, but seem to love the games that come out of it.

I mean, let's take a quick look at the tech driven games of this generation. LittleBigPlanet, Spore, Dead Rising, Mirror's Edge, Fallout 3, Gears of War, Call of Duty IV, people seem to love these games, but forsake them whenever the concept that they're tech driven comes up.

Nirolak

I don't even view the ps3 as having a problem, its been out for what 2 years and people are calling it a failure?
hardly, i just think japan takes longer to adopt new consoles, the ps2 has been out for 8 years now, in 2008 a 130 new games came out for it. i think the ps3 will be adopted over a longer time both in japan and america.

teeuwen

"It's not about the tech in Japan, it's about the games, it's about nostalgia."

Unfortunately, he's exactly right. Hence the endless amount of re-releases and remakes, particularly on the DS.

GrandfatherParadox

Hmmmmmm a stigma to western technology..... now I wonder what could have caused that!

emericanized

so we're actually travelling back in time

TheUnlovingSonOfCammieDunaway

I agree w/ the sentiments of the Japanese. It IS about the games. Well made games, not technology, are what will keep the industry afloat. This generation is a good example.

Sony dominates for 10 years w/ greater success than anyone has ever seen with an inferior console both times. Both the N64 and Xbox/Gamecube were capable of better things graphically. And you know what? It didn't mean a damn thing. Nintendo and Microsoft got beaten into the ground because on the Playstation 1 and 2 there was an insanely large library of great, innovative games. Now Sony invests millions into having "the most powerful system" and it is in last place. This generation is looking to be terrible in my view. Sony and Microsoft developers are obsessed with technology, not innovation, and Nintendo has lost its damn mind in the midst of commercial success.

TheRiver

@BurgerBat:
Yeah, that's actually a fairly accurate statement about the Japanese unfortunately.

Mommar

Hmmm... Payton seems to make a distinction between the "western" games made by Japanese developers, and the "Japanese" games made by Japanese developers. Such a distinction seems a bit flawed in the increasingly global age. There are marketing differences, but defining those differences is rather difficult. Obviously Japanese developers are not jumping on the next-gen market like western developers are. On the other hand, I can think of many Japanese developers that are working on next-gen stuff.
Part of it is the idea that products not developed for foreigners won't be appreciated by foreigners. They are a lot better about that now, but it's still seen in videogames, movies, literature, etc. To some extent that's true. A game about operating the bullet train has a lot more significance to a Japanese commuter than it does an American. However, America is a much larger market than Japan, just by population. So while you'll see large Japanese developers marketing games to Americans, the smaller Japanese developers are marketing games for the Japanese audience.
I would argue that some games (or movies or literature) can transcend the originating culture, and have universal enjoyability. It was the case in 1950 with Rashomon, it was the case in 1988 with Super Mario Bros. 3, and it was the case in 1997 with Final Fantasy VII. I think the goal should be to make good games that cultivate good taste within the gaming community. Giving good wine to a five year old is a waste; they have to develope a palette for wine. Likewise, games like Grim Fandango, Beyond Good and Evil, Okami, these were good games, they succeeded in making marvelous games. They failed in developing the palette of the community. I've rambled enough. :D

AllegraStreit

@Alphavillain:
I can't say that there is any disappointment with the PS3. Maybe its me, but its had great games since day one.

rexor0717

@dead_red_eyes: Well its certainly very popular and looks good but that texture streaming

excel_excel

@mva5580: I agree. Even though there are some standout current gen games that made me say "wow", overall, the only true claim to fame for the current tech are graphics and HD support. It's been said here in Kotaku land many times... Gameplay-wise many of the best games this generation could have been produced on last gen hardware. It just wouldn't look as good.

Striderhayasa - Phillyyakk on PSN and Live.

Think of it this way, the Japanese gamers are the ones that say "Well back in my day..."

Everybody else wants the latest and greatest.

Just different cultures.

VladMalice

@excel_excel:

Oh christ, if it was a "very flawed engine" no one would be using it.

dead_red_eyes

"There is a stigma still attached to western technology there."

I wonder how Windows XP (and other versions) does so well over there. It's a western developed OS is it not?

dead_red_eyes

@Your Show Sucks: You can't simply divide gamers into those 2 categories. Theres lots of us that enjoy both online/offline gaming. After the chaos that CoD4 can be, it's nice to unwind to a good rpg.

Eviscerate

@mva5580: I dunno, I think it's pretty terrible considering, first of all, the nostalgia japan has for popular games is not really a shared nostalgia. Different games were popular in japan versus internationally, so consequently when japan indulges in that, it sort of alienates consumers internationally.

A good example is the Dragon Quest series: not many people in the west really appreciate Dragon Quest, yet that is probably one of the major franchises that has stayed the same over the years in Japan. Now it is at a point where, if you've never experienced dragon quest when it was new and shiny, or know someone personally who is still enthusiastic about it, it is much easier to get into than if someone with NO experience with the series just jumped into it.

The point is, the importance and idiosyncrasies of older Japanese game design are pretty much incomprehensible to 90% of gamers internationally, and that is hurting the viability of Japanese games overseas. Whereas, previously, so many Japanese game developers were so willing to try out new and bold game ideas, that there was usually bound to be some games that would appeal internationally.

DeBurgo

@Your Show Sucks:

i agree with you "your show sucks"

a perfect example, how long has it taken for japanese developers to incorporate voice chat into there games.

teeuwen

@CaptLtrl:

I've always thought that the arcade version has always been the superior one. Sure, the NES vesion followed the manga more closely ... but the gameplay just wasn't as fun as the arcade version. That said, it would be nice to see the return of Strider again. Strider 3 perhaps?

dead_red_eyes

@Nirolak: It's probably due to the current idea that negativity = individuality that a huge amount of people have latched onto. It's amazing how people will actually make their mind up immediately without giving something thought. God I sound old.

Klopfer123

@Ken: Its not just Mass Effect, What about the games that are bound to the 360 and won't be brought out on PC? Like Lost Oddyessy?

excel_excel

What I think Mr. Payton should really be doing is seriously consider making his own studio where he could bring talent from the east and west together.

Hell if not at least get studios to try out such projects and he manages them as a the producer.

Since both sides have things that could be shared with eachother, its just that there is not many folks who have the ability to help bridge the gap so to speak. Realistically I dont think many stuidios would want to take the risk either.

Still yet though it would be quite interesting to see.

And Im talking about more than just like the US office of a Japanese company kinda deal.

Like an actual working / project done by the east and west sides as a combined effort to make a title. Now that would be something worth following.

Witzbold

Everything else he said though is pretty much spot on I think.

Though he should have mentioned that another problem is the higher ups in companies make shitty decisions which holds back a lot of things in the industry itself.

Witzbold

Are there any companies at all that combine the best of both worlds?

Deft_One

"What exactly is this stigma of western technology in Japan? It sounds slightly xenophobic on Japan's part."

Hmmmm, did you know the xbox360 is the non japanese hardware this gen? I think over in japan, they know that...

kakihara

It's because PC gaming never really took off in Japan like it did here. Now that the 360 is basically a PC, and these "next-gen" consoles are becoming more and more like a PC, all our developers have jumped ship to consoles. Western developers have far more experience programing on a variety of hardware, and don't have that stigma of refusing to use licensed engines or sharing technology.

How many blockbuster/triple A titles have we seen from Japan this console generation that isn't some Nintendo mascot? Few and far between. The small Japanese developers are finding they can't compete on a global market, with rising development costs and the different types of games that are reaching out into the American mainstream.

It's kidna why for the first time, I haven't bought any the consoles of this generation, nor do I feel any desire to do so. My PC suffices. The DS is the only "console" I even bother with anymore.

HioMrSan

@excel_excel: Or it could be limitations of the home consoles since the Mass Effect revamp on PC completely removes all the issues you have claimed.

Yah, the Eastern market is very Nostalgic... what with the rampant sales of R4 carts and most likely hacked PSPs playing all the old school games dwindling down actual game sales, perhaps.

I, for one, will keep my PSP and DS for new quirk and classic play styles, but my massive Rig will, naturally, be full of tech driven new titles. Tech isn't always about "Teh shiny graphics" when there is no limitation to other things like lighting, physics, sound quality and ammount, and more effects that lead to greater immersion and storytelling. I highly doubt MGS4 would have been as epic as it was without the current generations power level.

Give me tech!

Ken

What payton forgets though is how MS screwed over its original fanbase with the original Xbox. Then taking the axe to True Fantasy Live Online which pissed off Level5 and a lot of the folks who had bought an Xbox for that game alone. Then shortly after that fiasco they pretty much left the system and userbase to rot in Japan.

Its no wonder why folks are a bit hesitant with MS and the 360. That and this aint a country for shooters either and as unfortunate as it is thats one of the 360s main selling point. Also the character design for many of the games too doesnt grind well with the userbase here. Same reason why God of War never really sold well in Japan.

At least now thankfully MS is slowly picking up the pace along with a handful of J devs who are working on titles geared towards the market here which has driven interests in the system up a bit.

What he really seems to forget is Japan is a country where image and first impressions are everything. Once you tarnish your original image its hard to win the public back over.

He really should have made it clear why folks have a stigma against the western hardware since the cold hard truth is MS did it to themselves back with the first big black VCR.

Btw yes I own both one of those and a 360 and was around for the launch of both systems in Japan and have watched the history of the two all this time.

Witzbold

@Refused:

?!
are people forgetting about the phenomenal gaming year that was 2007?

Maudite

Meh, doesn't really matter to me. I can't stand JRPGs and almost any other game originated from Japan. Sure, Nintendo has some hit franchises, but when it comes to what western developers vs eastern developers are producing, I prefer the west.

Quicksilver4648

@Witzbold: It'd be goddamn nice to see the equivalent of, say, IGN Or something pop up in Japan. There's no such thing as a proper game review even though the market is still one of the larger markets in the world (obviously Famitsu doesnt count). Sites like mk2 are unknown to most people, and it's a bitch to search for as well. The problem here I think is more related to the need to use keigo on all strangers causing needless friction on 'community sites,' combined with the fact that a lot of people are afraid of their 'breach of privacy' when even their online persona is exposed.

2ch is an excellent community tool, but here the reverse is true as the relative anonymity will drive away a LOT of people afraid that their own actions will get bashed to hell (which does happen often), and that it'll stick with them -- even though IDs change daily and you're off on to a fresh start. It's not difficult to say that almost all major Japanese MMOs have their major online (non-in-game) communities within 2ch, but at the same time a lot of stigma attached with 2ch itself drives away a lot of people before they even bother to take a look.

muu

I'm with the Japanese in a lot of ways. I enjoy games like Resistance 2 and Killzone 2. And, I especially enjoy games like inFamous. Then, I LOVE games like LittleBigPlanet. But, all in all, no other games have ever given me the feelings that Kingdom Hearts, Final Fantasy X, and Shadow of the Colossus have. I will love both sides. But, I still feel a strong attachment to the Japanese market. Sometimes, I read about Japanese sales and forget to look at US sales. All in all, I see potential in each market, and they should each keep what makes them uniques. I don't want Final Fantasy to become a shooter, and I don't want inFamous to be a turn-based RPG. But, looking to other markets for some inspiration is great. For example, what would Fallout 3 be without its RPG elements, many of which were first developed and thought of in Japan?

Xemnas

Idk if Nostalgia only applies to japan..

I know I bought a psp for the sole reason of having SNES, GBC, and to a lesser extent, N64 games on the go.

Seems my nostalgia though is only limited to nintendo..

God I wished I could've owned a dreamcast =(

Anywho, to whomever stated that Europe has a slight edge in the developer market...

How so???

Terrorsaur.

@BobTheChainsaw: BobTheBanned

Witzbold

@BobTheChainsaw: wtf are you like 12 yrs old and completely forgetting the NES days? I feel sorry for you if you think games like Metroid, Contra and Megaman are shitty games.

Eviscerate

Well said.
@AllegraStreit:

Gatekeeper Zero

Jpns gms r vry shtty. Gnrc JRPG #235.

BobTheChainsaw

@Ken: My main complaint about the UE3 is that (almost) everything made with it tends to look the same. It all has this...plastic, vaseline-covered, overly-normal-mapped greasiness to it. It's odd, since a lot of that should have nothing to do with the engine, but it does seem to be a shared trait of games built on UE3.

EmpressInYellow

@Leanid: Sorry Id have to say you really dont know the Japanese market all that well and would prefer if you didnt go around spreading false information to folks.

Since you obviously do not know the rather LARGE communities of players in the various online games here.

Now online with consoles is a bit different, though there still have been communities made around certian games such as Phantasy Star, Monster Hunter, Final Fantasy XI.

Granted there are not as many online games as the US there still are a fair number of online gamers and that number has been slowly growing. The only issue is that not many J devs know how to do proper online gaming since its not really a category that they had to focus on. So only a select few companies have the capacity to make such games. Even with that they still have a lot of fuckups on the technical side of the netcode and what not which is just due to their lack of experience when put into compairson to the west.

Witzbold

to be honest I doubt his opinion. In my opinion it seems like either its not made for the right platform ot its not an inspired title.

The 360 in Japan is not the right platform to recieve HD games. Just cause the games fail on that platform does not mean that Hardcore HD gaming in Japan has failed.

luxusa

I don't remember there being a texture streaming issue in Bioshock, either, on 360 or PC, and that runs on Unreal 3. Plus, you should be watching GoW2, since they are using Unreal "3.5" supposedly.

Ken

@excel_excel: Don't shoot the engine because they system can't handle it. It's still a fantastic game engine and it will be seen in a lot more games. Will the streaming issue be fixed? I dunno, I won't have to worry about it because on the PC, there isn't an issue ;)

Plus, I don't remember it being as bad as Gears of War (Lost Odyssey, that is) when I did play it.

Don't hate all new tech just because on of one small complaint on one small engine.

Ken

@Your Show Sucks:

If you've read some of the articles posted here you would clearly know that in fact most Japanese do not like the idea of online gaming. Local multiplayer is preferred. Its easier to do, more fun to actually be in the same room, and doesn't have the stigma of being a total loser. Isn't that why consoles have had multiple controller ports?

And I do prefer to play singleplayer console games. Online multiplayer on consoles doesn't appeal to me since I already have a gaming PC, which has had FREE online multiplayer since I can remember. The reason I enjoy console gaming is BECAUSE of the singleplayer experiences found in JRPGs, otherwise most Western games can be found on PC.

Leanid

Id say Japan hasnt been the center of the gaming universe for quite some time now. Shits been going down hill since 2000.

Nintendo doesnt count, since all its really done is bring the casual more into the mix.

Well to be fair I suppose that could count, but not from the standpoint that Im taking anyways.

Witzbold

@Witzbold:

I can vouch for that. When I was playing PSO on the DC, there were quite a number of Japanese players, in fact, some of them would use one of our servers as the "Challenge Mode Server" for whatever reason. Sure, there was a language barrier, but luckily Sonic Team put in that hilarious Chat feature which would translate what you were saying into the native language.

jello44

@DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin: Actually Japan is pretty bad with the DLC. You obviously dont see what kind of bullshit bandai namco has been pulling on the 360.

I think they just dont understand how to do shit on a scale that works with the "international" market.

The main problem here is because they see shit work in Japan they ASSume (im putting the ASS in caps because thats a perfect word that describes those folks) that it will work in with the rest of the world.

The same problem is seen within the Anime Industry and DVD pricings as another example.

In a whole what a lot of the companies here need is people who understand both sides of the picture and get them to understand that different plans need to be made for shit to work out overseas. If not basically all it does is make a company look stupid.

Witzbold

@Witzbold: - "I think too many companies are getting lost by trying to penis wag with other ones on graphics or something else, therefore allowing other important factors to be lost in the mix."

So very true.

dead_red_eyes

To be honest and blatant which will cause A LOT of folks to fucking freak out and start a flame war over is one company that gets the proper balance between gameplay and graphics is Bungie with the Halo series.

Since they didnt break the formula and they didnt go overboard with the graphics. Basically they just made things better and improved the community interaction which is an excellent way to keep the games longevity secured.

I think too many companies are getting lost by trying to penis wag with other ones on graphics or something else, therefore allowing other important factors to be lost in the mix.

Witzbold

@Witzbold: - "And Im talking about more than just like the US office of a Japanese company kinda deal. Like an actual working / project done by the east and west sides as a combined effort to make a title. Now that would be something worth following."

I would really love to see something like that.

@BobTheChainsaw:

I hope the door hits your ass on the way out. Bye bye!

dead_red_eyes

@Terrorsaur.: Dreamcast was the best pure video game system in the last decade. You can still buy new ones on ebay for around 100 USD, I suggest picking one up.

I think another part of this thing with Japan not caring about Next Gen and Hi Def is the fact that 90% (guesstimate) of the western made games on the PS3 and 360 all look exactly the same. Big, Bulky, Brown and Grey. Western games lack that style, that certain nack that the Japanese have for making cool characters and game worlds.

Too many of those next-gen games are plagued with poor art direction and lack of actual color. Think about it, the most refreshing games to come out of the west as of late has been stuff like Portal and Team Fortress 2. Games like Gears of War and Halo look good, detail wise, but the reality is that they're dime a dozen games. The same thing could be said for the plastic instrument genre too but they have the safety net of all the world's music to fall back on.

In my eyes the purest gaming console on the market right now is the Nintendo DS. All the new home consoles are trying to do all these other things that have nothing to do with gaming and I think thats a big problem. Just wait till companies start releasing major AAA titles as DLC only with DRM or SecurRom attached to them. It's a shitstorm waiting to happen. I download Song Summoner, my computer crashes and Im forced to format. Now Im fucked and I need to pay $5 again in order to play the game I already purchased in Itunes. The Japanese are very against DLC from what I can tell and I don't blame them. And Nintendo is doing a terrible job handling Virtual Console DRM.

But what do I know? I just bought a Super Famicom because honestly I think this generation of gaming is missing the point completely.

Street Fighter IV looks so fucking hot though. Gonna have to buy a 360 for that one. CAPCOM "GETS IT".

DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin

@muu: Short and simple the industry is killing itself.

They expect people to constantly buy the mags instead of thinking creating proper online review websites.

As with anything Im sure Ashcraft can chime in on this also, well if he so chooses to do so is the fact that they control ANY media way too much for things to be like how it is in the West. Which is quite unfortunate and part of their own undoing.

Witzbold

@BobTheChainsaw: You disgust me. Go play Halo and leave the real gamers with our variety. Real gamers have a respect for each different market and genre, and what they offer to us all and the evolution of gaming. You'll just have to miss out on Final Fantasy, The Legend of Zelda, Kingdom Hearts, Team ICO's games, and much more. Go play generic shooter #3497. See, you don't like it when I do it, so why should you?

Xemnas

@jello44: I just started a new BlueBurst account on Schtacks Private Server. Name is Retticks.

@muu: I hope to god anime goes under. I know that sounds fucked up but it was WAYYYY cooler when it was called "Japanamation" and everything wasn't digitally painted and all shiny looking. Vampire Hunter D, Dirty Pair, Lodoss War, X, gUNSMITH cATS, Guyver,Ranma, hell, even some old DragonBall/Z was what anime was all about. This new fangled shit for the most part is garbage. And yeah I like Naruto a lot because I like the characters,world and how interesting the story is, but for gods sake the anime has turned into complete garbage and has only recently gotten better in the last 2 weeks. Then you got all these American companies trying to make their shitty fucking cartoons like Avatar look like anime, when they look like crap. Man.

DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin

@jello44:

Scratch that, according to BB.com, it's 33.74. That's the same price for ONE DVD. And you get all 4!

jello44

@Witzbold: Yeah they got the gameplay right. Theres no arguing that whatsoever.

I never got a chance to play Myth myself. Maybe Ill get around to it after I play some of the SuperFami games I got coming to me.

DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin

@DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin:

Hells yeah, I spent about 3 years playing that damn game across 3 platforms.

jello44

@DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin: You should see the numbers at how much IdolM@ster is selling.

Also something that comes even before this whole DLC fiasco is in Japan folks play those online net games where it goes by the Korean MMO pay scheme which is play for free but you buy more unique items online with real cash.

So there is a market with it. Just that for console users its something new and still folks are unsure about it on the console side of things.

For the MMO PC gamers its not really something new.

Witzbold

@DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin: it's ironic though, that aside from FF/DQ Remakes and Mario/Pokemon releases even the dominant DS is finding weak sales in its new games. I'm sure dev costs are low enough that they're more than making a handy profit from 20,000 - 50,000 units sold, but new content really are not making waves on neither the PSP nor the DS, both of which have far greater userbases than any current-gen non-portable.

@Witzbold: hey now, shit pricing structures and the morons that buy it are the only thing keeping the sinking anime ship afloat.

muu

@DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin:

Although if you wait a bit, you can get a whole series much cheaper when they release the box set. I saw TMoHS Box set for 50 bucks at BB. There were quite a number of others as well.

jello44

I dunno. Feels like an oversimplification if you ask me really. [re: Payton's comments]

There's still some keen stuff being developed in Japan. Call it a Western mindset or whichever but Square, Nintendo, Konami and Capcom are surging ahead combining the best of both worlds. Perhaps it's a bit of an identity crisis for them at the time being, but they're maintaining momentum. They're games are fantastic and evolving with the times.

So it would be wrong to say that Japan's losing its focus as the gaming centre. Perhaps its not a centre per se, but the importance can never be undermined.

I think the real reason is media exposure. With a more networked media structure and an increasing prevalence of yellow journalism, it seems that Western games occupy more of the limelight. When it comes to marketing, they hold more cards in their hands. As a result it gives them a sense of far more occupation of the gaming pie than it is in reality.

But still, it's true that Western games are making greater strides in areas such as A.I. and Physics. They always have.

Notably, even America can't take the supposed lion's share given the rising strength of European game development over the last few years.

Thus development has been spread and tempered across a variety of regions and influences in a general drift away from Japan, which while 'a' key player is becoming less of 'the' player.

However, beyond countries and boundaries and cultures and stereotypes, it's time for the indie developer to rise yet again.

Chupakun

@DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin: I think the hyping of Halo 3 was more a MS thing than Bungie really.

Since we all know that there was an already rabid fanbase for the game and Im sure the devs knew that.

Now MS just wanted to be sure that everyone on this godforsaken rock knew about it which is why we saw that friggin green helmeted freak on literally everything.

I do agree with you about it was overboard.

Though as generic as it may be it has got a lot of things down correctly which is why its so popular.

Kinda like with the CS days back on the PC. It was a generic as hell shooter but it was so popular since it had the formula down perfectly so that it tugged at the heartstrings of those who played it.

Though thank god CS never went to the level of stupidity with marketing Halo did.

I do miss Bungies more niche title like Myth.

Im also like yourself am curious to see what their next title will be now that they are free from the Halo franchise. Though I must say its going to be damned hard to find another company who cares about the community as much as Bungie though.

Witzbold

@jello44: PSO=Best Online RPG Ever.

DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin

@Witzbold: I havent been following the 360 in Japan but I do know that the Japanese just aren't interested in DLC, PERIOD.

And yeah, the anime thing sucks pretty bad man. I hate walking into Best Buy and seeing 3 episode DVDs that cost $30 dollars. Im all for fansubbing but it hurts the American Anime Industry soooo much. Just imagine the money Viz would be making on Naruto and Bleach if there was no Dattebayo?!

DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin

@Witzbold: I secnd that Bungie comment witz. Problem is that Halo is incredibly generic and not really deserving of the hype. Yes, it was probably the only game worth playing on the XBOX for the first 2 years of its lifespan but it doesn't mean the game is THAT good. It has great multiplayer but I haven't been intrigued by any of the single player portions of any of the 3 games. Of course a game is going to be huge when it's the only game worth owning the console for.

Marathon is a funny one too, because I remember there being way better FPS games back when it come out on the Mac. I think Bungie still needs to prove themselves honestly, which is why Im curious to see what they have coming next. Hopefully it wont be another FPS and we can all see if they are truly good game designers.

DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin

@DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin:

Nice Boat.

:)

jello44

Well as a counterpoint to myself, I guess I'll finally get around to playing Chronotrigger. I just wish all these ports were remakes along the lines of Star Ocean The First Departure coming up on PSP. Can't wait for that, yum!

Ken

@dead_red_eyes,@Xemnas I am saying that there are too few azn's characters in jpn games. I am not saying down with white people through. Just put some more.

lostinseganet

@lostinseganet:

What?

Xemnas

I'd be very interested to hear more on the Japanese stigma against Western technology.

Wasn't the cell processor developed in the West with Sony as just a financial backer?

Lixie

@lostinseganet:

?????

dead_red_eyes

Maybe jpn gamers finally became tired or seeing japan drawn as a sea of white girl. Some actually azn's would be nice they are in japan...>_>

lostinseganet

@DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin: There may be a huge deluge of forgettable crap now, but that's how it's always been -- plenty of shit like that existed in the past as well, just that they disappeared like all non-major releases do.

@Witzbold: What did you expect? Both those are Jump comics. They'll go out of their fucking way to even turn quirky ghost-meets-detective series into a battle manga (Hisoka Returns!).

muu

@Strangelove: as well as uncharted and a few others, and yeah, 2004 was amazing, but dont forget MGS3, my highlight of the era.
still, your point stands: if you dont think there's good games this gen, you're prolly not playing them, and its no one's fault but your own.

@excel_excel: its funny how its on the tip of everyone's tongue when square gets mentioned most times.
honestly, if nothing's said at this year's TGS, you gotta wonder when.

i think a handful of you are taking the "games and nostalgia" quote and running in the wrong direction with this. to say japan is anti-HD entirely is a ridiculous generality, and to be fair, only sounds like a wii apologist speaking.

TheIrishNinja

@DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin: To me personally both Naruto and Bleach have caught a bad case of Dragon Ball syndrome which is quite unfortunate since both started off good.

Oh yes One Piece Also.

Theres quite a lot of better shows than Naruto and such, its just a matter of finding them since there still is a lot of other IPs that have not made it to the states.

Witzbold

@jello44: Yeah man I just got the Cowboy Bebop Remix boxset for $30 on sale. Best $30 I've ever spent. Evangelion is next. Then School Days (just for the most fucked up ending ever in any anime, like ever. for realz)

DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin

@DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin: Witz is referring to the DVD series that cost ~$60 equivalents per disc, with TWO episodes per disc. While fansubs have put the unfortunate expectation to youngins that anime can be downloaded from the web for free, it's not all that different in Japan -- you have the original series first broadcast on tv airwaves, and then the DVD series released several months later. Most everyone is satisfied with the TV broadcast, and the select few idiots purchase overpriced DVDs which lead to commercial success. Prices have been insane because it's such a niche market that reducing it would only be kicking yourself. I mean, you already have the TV show recorded on your Japanese Tivo equivalent. In beautiful HD. If your only reason to purchase DVDs is to support the crew so to speak, what difference does it make if it's $40 or $60?

Apparently that's not enough, as in certain shows, violent scenes are filtered out for the TV release (to encourage DVD purchases), or it may be a bit steamier in those baths. I may have to get Strike Witchies DVDs so that I can see through the steam... er, to SUPPORT THE SHOW. Yes.

@Witzbold: You should know well enough that the Imas DLC is an exception. If it wasn't something targeted for a very specific audience, the DLC pricing wouldn't be as crazy as it is now. No problem on my side, of course -- I bought a handful of those 3500Gates cards last month.

muu

@DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin:

I haven't seen it, some pieces here and there. But that particular meme blew up, and kinda piqued my interest in it, though I never quite got around to downloading it. As with most anime today, I am so far behind. :P Higurashi is pretty messed up too, I had rented the first two from Netflix, but then Genenon went belly-up and the rest of the series hasn't been released.

jello44

@lostinseganet: All the recent final fantasy characters look extremely asian. The whole cast of X for instance. XII wasn't really a Final Fantasy game so lets not talk about that one. XII should of been online or a sequel like FF XI-2 or something like that. For a Final Fantasy game it didn't deliver the goods.

DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin

@Witzbold: Yeah Bleach Id say is def DragonBall Z part 2 these days. I don't really mind it though because they powered up the Ichigo so much in the Soul Society arc that they had to bring it to that level to keep going. Naruto gets compared to DBZ a lot but I really don't understand why. Naruto has too much plot to be compared to DBZ. Naruto isn't overpowered (yet) and when characters die, they stay dead. They do both wear orange though, and they are both idiots.

@jello44: LMAO. I guess you saw it?! Im not into the dating, romance animes but godamn did that series take a 180 degree turn into the most fucked up thing ive ever seen. Its funny cuz my buddy is a total womanizer and I keep calling him "makoto" and he's like wtf? I hear Higurashi is messed up like that too but I think Ill just see the Live Action Version like I did with Death Note.

DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin

It still is for me... I became a Japanophile little by little ever since 1995, and there's no going back for me... I wanna see Japan rise again, from the ashes they've burned to in this gen. And Nintendo doesn't count...

bobtheduck

@Lixie: I agree with you that hair color is not an issue. I think some more characters with characteristics they can better associate with would raise some interest in jpn gamming.

lostinseganet

@element7: Sad, really,... So the Big N is milking the customers and the developers for money and all while everyone is pooping on the "Core" demographic.

Nice.

DS, I love it, but only for Pokemon, EBA, discontinued Tetris (dumbest move ever!) and some of the RPGs from Square. All of the first party Marios, Zeldas, and Metroids can go DIAF for all I care.

@excel_excel: Yah, LO wasn't perfect, but I always attributed that on my old 360, whom of which does not live in my house anymore.

*hugs PC* At least you when you F up I can research that error and fix it! Plus all my major components come standard with anywhere from 1 year to lifetime warranties. Happiness :D

Ken

@excel_excel: My personal experience with the game, sigh

excel_excel

A lot of people think development costs are a lot cheaper on the Wii, when its absolutely not true. The licensing fees and creative going into that motion sensing technology pretty much offsets the dated tech used for the games. I heard them discussing this in a 1UP podcast; People think the devs are going for Wii because its cheaper to develop for, but some devs are speaking out saying that the licensing fees and development is much higher than it was for GameCube, although its not up there with PS3 and 360 dev costs; Its still much higher according to devs.

element7

@lostinseganet: Surely you jest. Japan is filled with blue-eyed blonds and green-eyed redheads. As can be attributed to their absurd abundance in JRPGs and anime.

Lixie

@Ken: its a great PC games engine, but what engine isn't vastly superior on PC! Lost Odd I think was just bad techinically, like weird freezing glitches and the music going out sometimes...but your right, it works fantastically for some games

excel_excel

@Witzbold: Whoa thats some bullshit. You can buy XP now? Man if they ever bring that shit to MMORPGs its gonna serious. What point would there be in paying a game where other people have an advantage over you just because they purchased EXP without doing the work? Man. Thats just ballsy right there.

DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin

I'm unsurprised. The two current-gen home consoles have been designed and maintained as devices much larger than a singular, gaming-centric purpose. It's the giant-ass, home theater... it's the stream your media to and from every electronic gadget in your residence... it's the rattle-your-neighbor's-asshole surround sound... it's the convergence. And I've never seen much that would make me think those interests are anything but decidedly American, and to a lesser extent, European. People with unprecedented technology infrastructure, mobile lifestyles, and small homes less than astounded by convergence in the guise of gaming? Stop the presses! Developers chasing the real market for those devices? Start the presses so we can stop them again!

wild homes abides!

@jello44: I think it's only ten episodes (School Days) so you could probably watch them all in a sitting if you have the free time. It starts off very very weak but they give you little hints here and there of whats to come in later episodes. My friend told me about it and told me how crazy the series gets and already prepared me for the ending. After watching the whole thing through though, it didn't even matter that I knew it was coming. I just couldn't believe what I was seeing and hearing from a series that started off so sweet youd get a toothache. Its the only anime of its kind Ive actually reccomended to people. It just seems that much more fucked up because of the fact that its coming from animated characters that are all cute and shit. I think that really says something about the way our brains interpret someone as being a bad person or likely to commit a crime. Good shit.

I love the music from Higurashi (Eiko Shimamura) the themes are so haunting but strangely erotic too. I still gotta get around to that one but its gonna be awhile.

DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin

@muu: You fail to see its the perfect example of why they are going to fuck up DLC even more seeing how people paid out for Imas and now they will assume everyone else will do the same for other garbage. Like the worthless skins in AC4, more levels in Katamari, and now we have the lowest of low selling a SP games exp / gold with Vesperia.

Id say Bandai Namco is getting shit pretty wrong.

Witzbold

for anyone thats interested

+ Watch video

DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin

the nostalgia thing plays a BIG part in why i play videogames...i own a lot of the new games for the PS3, but i buy the sega's, midway's, capcom's, namco's and Snk's colecctions and Antologies when they come out because those are the type of games i grew up playing and the one's i love the most (2d will never die for me!!!!)

Danilov.-

@mva5580: It is a bad thing when it turns into remaking the same stuff over and over. Don't get me wrong, a new Final Fantasy comes along every 3 or so years, that I can deal with. But a new Dynasty Warriors game every year? Square remaking all their old IPs for handhelds, tons and tons of Gundam games...and this doesn't just stop with games. I discussed it with my Japanese teacher and she explained to me that in Japan, they have a mentality of "what is," versus the Western thought of "why is," in that while we try to change things because we can, they are comfortable to stick with what they know. Why were there 508 episodes of the Dragon Ball series'? Why are there almost 25 different Gundam franchises between TV and movies? There is nothing inherently wrong with this...for their culture, that is. For us, however...we get sick of the same shit after a while (except for fucking sports games) and it makes Japan more of an isolated body, cut off from the rest of the world which wants innovation and change.

And before you tell me I'm wrong, I want you to count all the Final Fantasies. All the Mario games. All the Dynasty Warriors. And Mega Man too, think of all the big name Japanese series', head to Wikipedia and count up all the entries in the series, and how radically different any of them are from one another. It's the hard truth.

TheHeartless

@DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin: dude youre spot on with the dreamcast. i wish more ppl would have supported it when it was around, and sega could have made a sequel. now we have a neutered sega and no outlet for capcoms most hardcore games. those companies showed their @sses on the dc and the jp saturn.. i miss those days. and for the 50th time.. where the heck is a current gen version of the beat em up.. i miss thee so.

shouryuuken

considering i dont care much for first person shooters, sandbox games, and games that wish they were movies, there really wasnt that much for me to be excited for last year. halo, call of duty 4, mass effect, bioshock.. all were great.. but still dont hit me like the games i liked as a kid.. i like going to arcades still.. i like fighting games more than any other genre left. this year i think is pretty good looking.. hoping sonic is good, lbp looks great, mk vs dcu has me excited, if sfIV and kof XII were out this year.. it would be the best so far for me.

shouryuuken

@Shin-san: TOTALLY agreed.

shouryuuken

@DontTouchMyDaughterYouFilthyGaijin: Or most of those series were shit (I'm a big Lodoss War fan, but otherwise) and plenty of digitally-coloured anime is fantastic. Matter of opinion. There were lots of good hand-painted series, but I like the new bright/clean colours better - and with digital painting, a low budget goes a lot further. (Cel animation + low budget = really awful, except in a few cases where art design saved it.)

In the US try '5 Centimeters Per Second', recent film, beautiful, emotional, excellent. Whenever they get around to licensing it, 'Ghost Hound' is a really good general-interest recent series too. Then if you get more into the niche stuff, TRSI/Nozomi are doing US releases (cheap, too) of Emma, Maria-sama ga miteru and Aria... three excellent series, although admittedly none of them are exactly new, and of course they aren't to everyone's taste (except Maria-sama, because who doesn't love angst-filled stories from a convent school with strong lesbian undertones - argh I ordered that two weeks ago, WHERE ARE MY DVDS...).

I agree there's been a lot of crap recently but there's still good stuff if you look for it.

Actually I think anime and manga are one of the reasons why Japanese games are still good - simply because, as a result of that pervading culture, they have character designs that aren't horrifically ugly. I mean, if you look at say Oblivion after playing any JRPG ever, the environments are still great, but those characters are eye-bleedingly bad and the monsters are really uninspired too. It's like character design, as a profession, doesn't exist outside Japan. (I'm sure that isn't the case - but it's the impression...)

I still play mostly Japanese games, but then, I have a Wii, and the number of even slightly worthwhile Wii games that aren't Japanese fits on one hand.

Not really sure that it's obvious the Japanese are less 'innovative' - I'm sure there are some great Western games released recently but when/if I get a PS3 the one that'd currently be first on my list is GTA4, which is, um, obviously not all that innovative. Is the argument that, though neither continent's developers are particularly innovative, the West is making bigger steps (with exception of Nintendo's casual gaming stuff)? Is GTA4 compared to GTA3 a much bigger jump than the equivalent for MGS say? Or Oblivion compared to Morrowind, vs Final Fantasy N compared to N-1? Not having played any of those games, I don't really know, but from the outside, I don't really see even an obvious quantitative difference...

quen

@TheHeartless:

I thing that is too much a broad generalization.

Just how many years have the South Park, Star Wars, Terminator, Star Trek, and other franchises been going on?

I'm not saying that they're bad franchises per say, it's just they're starting to get old just like the Gundams, Final Fantasies.

I think that Gundam and Macross are the worst offenders in the anime industry. Gundam has been one 50 episode toy comerical. I enjoy Macross, but even I can't bothered to watch most of the franchise. I was unimpressed with SDF at 5. The only three Macross series I've enjoyed were Plus, Zero and Frontier.

The amount of ero-game adaptations that come out are disturbing.

I thought that School Days would buck the trend, but I was wrong.

Even Japan's top studios are animating themselves into oblivion:

Air (Great)
Air Movie (Great)
Kanon 2002 (Great)
Kanon 2006 (Great)
Clannad (Okay, this is a mismash of Air and Kanon cliches)
Clannad After Story (Who asked for more of this?)

I just can't wait for Haruhi Season 2 since they're basically done with the Love Triangle and can finally push the story forward.

mlubczyn

I just think people have so much to play, that they don't know what they want anymore.

How do you reinvent the RPG? Just how do you reinvent the FPS? The Racing Genre?

Everybody complains, but nothing seems to want to give an answer.

I personally, would say, reusing assets to make something new.

Why make a Call of Duty 5? Why not just build upon the Call of Duty 4 engine and expand the story, work on the AI, make new levels that are more open, have destructible environments, et cetera. No need to make a New corridor shooter just for the sake of it.

Same with the RPG, why reinvent the wheel each time. It's like a thousand RPG stories that all play out alike. Why not make the Final Fantasy series continuous instead of making a new yet very similar story each time?

Sure X-2 might not have been the best, but why not iron out the flaws in X-3?

Just food for thought.

mlubczyn

@silentknome: I've got you two japanese game that are exclusive for the PS3: White Knight Chronicles and Valkyria Chronicles, both RPGs.

Alex_Mexico

I think it's unfair to say that there are 534 generic shooters when there are 5340 generic JRPGs released in Japan every year that have barely evolved.

Western FPS developers have realized that Shooter games need to evolve in either getting better narration/pacing (Bioshock) or go sandbox (Far Cry 2/Red Faction Guerrilla).

Japanese and Western survival horror games are evolving, although they still need to make their camera angels not suck (Resident Evil 5, Dead Space, Siren: Blood Curse.)

Mario is an anomaly. I think people like the nostalgia factor more than the games themselves. The Mario games have barely evolved Mario 64, Bros. 64 and Mario Party.

mlubczyn

@TheHeartless: Yes, there are 508 Dragon Ball Whatever episodes. There are also 5530 episodes of 'Neighbours'. What's your point? (Yep, I'm equating DB to a soap opera...)

Most anime series (same probably applies to Japanese live-action TV) have a 12/13-week or at most 26-week run. The really popular ones get a second series. Very few go beyond that, and these are half-hour slots. I don't think this makes them noticeably longer than typical US TV series.

There's quite a lot of Mario games in total (even assuming you only count the core games) but after the last entry in that series, I think you're on a hiding to nothing if you're using that as an example of why long series are bad and never change. If every Japanese game was as polished, as different compared to its predecessors, and as generally awesome as Mario Galaxy, nobody would be having this argument and Square Enix would own Activision and EA by now.

Nothing wrong with Mario (main series) releases just as there's nothing wrong with GTA4 and will be nothing wrong with GTA5 several years later - if they turn out an excellent game each time, that's all good.

I'd look at the less-reliably-excellent series (not necessarily the ones that are bad, just that are ok) or the way new games (Square is releasing several new/newish RPGs) are kind of not all that different to old games, if you want a better argument. But, you can do that about a lot of Western games as well...

quen

@excaliburps: Agreed. The US may have the tech firepower, but Jesus H. Christ -- the games are so derivative. I love FPSs, but how many million more do we need?

Glad that games like Braid, LittleBigPlanet, and others are out there as an alternative.

jerimas

@mlubczyn: For call of duty even if you take the issues iron them out and improve on the good, it would still be call of duty 5 the only difference is only people like us that go on gaming sites would no that and would buy it, as for those that don't they wouldn't take a risk on it, and too often then not when you have to put by the makers of on a game or anything for that matter., it ain't that great. And as for ff its a tradition thing and plus some stories are fine as they are and don't need to continue. Otherwise it will stagnate more than it already does.

Neo-Senku: The World's Finest Pervert

@TheHeartless: Dragonball and Gundam are the exceptions, not the rule... The vast majority of Japanese TV, both anime and live action, ends after one season, or less... In dire contrast with the US. That's what I like about Japanese TV... Stories need to end. Though I think that applies to games, too, but Final Fantasy has (until recently) always had an ending. Every single game (until 5 when they made an anime sequal to the game, and again until 10 when they made 10-2) is a self contained story.

In the US, we have MASH that lasted longer than the war it was based on. No wonder Hawkeye kept lamenting the war, I mean it went on longer in his world than it did in ours! We have Simpsons that goes for 20+ years... Hell, nearly every TV show in the US is made to keep going until it's not popular anymore. And what ABOUT capcom? Are they pumping out a Megaman a year? No... They're doing a revival to cater to nostalgists, but that's about it. What about Mario? I'd venture to say the games are all different enough that no one should be complaining.

Dynasty Warriors, though... That's the DBZ / gundam of the video game world... Though the actual DBZ / gundam games are catching up to it. Don't look at DB, Gundam, Naruto, Sailormoon, and anything Rumiko Takahashi has made on TV (except Rumiko Theater) and declare that represents the majority of Japanese ent