You have to admit, though, soon enough the naming convention is going to get ridiculous.......as if it's not already. I have a feeling once they hit XV they might "renew" the series and add a subtitle, restarting the count. I know it's just a name, but can you imagine playing FFXVII? Pretty soon, making fun of the naming scheme will be commonplace in media, much more-so than it already might be. That might actually start to hurt the series when they start to get into the twenties.

Arlips

@h-town:

The status effect for death is called "KO". Do the math. It's the same reason sleeping at an inn recovers it.

DimensionWarped

This series needs to give its writers the final cut.

Nyright

@h-town:
"They need to diversify their game developments and let go of this almost 20 year old mentality of being weeks away from bankruptcy and the only thing that can save the day is another photocopy of final fantasy."

If you look at most endeavors, the best work people do are when they are weeks away from bankruptcy. Once their financially secure the push to do something amazing fades into the need to do something profitable or something that strokes your ego since you don't need money.

Examples: George Lucas, Metallica, EA, Ubisoft, Nintendo, Steven Spielberg, Jim Carrey, actually most musicians.

kingmanic

O, retcon.

Do Kesubei

Final Fantasy isn't finally fully functionally and fiscally finished? Where is Final Fantasy: Final to give a fresh finish to this fabulous franchise's fictional titling?

Enough with the f-words. FF games are good. I wish they would mix things up even more and figure out a way to create more memorable characters. These games have seemed a bit stagnant to me unfortunately (not that that's bad).

BigDragon

My main problem with final fantasy is this: in FF7 when sephiroth puts his sword through ariel why didn't cloud use a phoenix down on her to bring her back to life like every other damn time one of them dies in a random turn based battle?? Their sense of storytelling is beyond contrived, but they consistently get so many really talented people working on the games that no matter what the games push forward into something that is good, and sometimes great. They need to diversify their game developments and let go of this almost 20 year old mentality of being weeks away from bankruptcy and the only thing that can save the day is another photocopy of final fantasy.

h-town

@jasu78: If you really think about it, that is how MMORPG's and some RPGs progress. You start off drastically more powerful then the critters you destroy and as you progress you get weaker and weaker in comparison until it takes 40 or you to take down a boss.

kingmanic

I remember Sakaguchi saying something to the effect that the title "Final Fantasy" has more to do with the theme of the game. I think it was on the making of ffVII video casette. It seems like it came about from the death of his mother but I can't remember. It's been over 10 years since I've watched it.

kryzhal

I don't know exactly how this goes towards dispelling any misunderstandings since you can't have multiple "Ultimates" for the same reason having multiple "Finals" fail for a singular subject. But what ever... lost in translation, artistic license, or what ever floats your boat... keep naming.

okenny :) ...building bridges (to hide under)

@Mister_Jack: It's pretty self explanatory. You undiscover things infinitly, which leads me to believe that you begin the game as something higher than God and gradually undiscover things until you eventually become some kind of single atom or something. So it's kind of like E.V.O. or Spore, only backwards and full of androgeny.

jasu78

@Mister_Jack: Good question. I don't even think 'Undiscovery' is a word. Even if it WAS, it still wouldn't make sense.

tsathoggua

Because of the company's monetary woes, the game was actually going to be called Financial Fantasy. However, Engrish being what it is, we wound up with the vastly inferior name we have today.

cheez

@maraxusofk: Exactly. Brand names sell. It's the reason why Final Fantasy Legend was named that. It wasn't even a Final Fantasy game in the original japanese release.

jookie

the way i see it, the final fantasy name is just like a branding that in no way affects the story, sorta like when a company says "Steven Spielberg presents." besides it is a good idea cuz it builds hype. if ff13 was renamed something not ff, would ppl be as excited for it?

maraxusofk

@Mister_Jack:

That would Square Enix's sad attempt to come up with a new title for a possible multi sequel franchise like final fantasy =p

Fstrike

@James in Dupont:
Sakagauchi is my bro. (No, not really) He totally signed my copy of FFVII, though. :3

I always kind of wondered why they kept naming it Final Fantasy. I mean, besides name recognition there's nothing that really ties the games together. Well, there is Cid and Chocobos and Moogles - but not much else.

Channing

I already knew why it was called Final Fantasy. Now someone explain what the fuck Infinite Undiscovery means!!!

Mister_Jack

Actually, the name "Final Fantasy" was chosen because the original was to be the final game developed by Hironobu Sakaguchi, who had tired of the game industry and was planning to pursue a new career. But after arriving at Squaresoft and completing Rad Racer and Final Fantasy he felt renewed and decided to stay in video games, spawning the Final Fantasy sequels.

But I guess Squeenix doesn't want to talk about Sakaguchi seeing as how they pushed him out of the company after the Spirits Within fiasco.

James in Dupont

It's not really bad because many Final Fantasy games have new characters, new locations, and new stories. It's not like you'd have to look at the same heros again and again - aside from the newer ones having true sequels.

jookie

Seems obvious to me. I mean, why would you hate money?

Lightman

Since when did anyone ever question that?

Jtn

@jasu78: Then they should call it...I dunno...Jehovah Mindfuck. I think we can all agree that's a way cooler name.

Mister_Jack

Sweet! I don't want it to stop. Final Fantasy is my second favorite game series of all time, right behind Kingdom Hearts.

Xemnas

Is there anyone that didn't know this yet? Seriously?

@Xideo: ...Because it was in the fantasy genre?

Kia

Final Fantasy and Squaresoft? Now those were the days! Back then we had Final Fantasies that did things right. It wasn't all about the CG, graphics and how spikey people's hair could be. Nope it was about the gameplay and the music and occasionally the story. I long for those days. Make my fantasy come true Square Enix and just make a good one again.
So now we know why it's called "Final" but why Fantasy?

Xideo

@kingmanic:
Following this train of logic,... Wii?
If Nintendo didn't push something awesome out, they would've went the way of SEGA. (Damn it, Dreamcast was gold!)

Channing

I wonder if they know that using the term "Ultimate" multiple times is just as absurd as using the term "Final".

There can only be one "Ultimate", considering it's a synonym for "Final".

tzaketh

@Xideo: They did. It was called FFIX. And really, one would think the spiky hair joke would get a bit old by now considering Cloud is the only one along the main FF games that has such gravity defying hair.

Turambar

@ego531: No one's complaining about any of that...? If you're going to rant, make it contextual.

[ZTF]

@Xideo: The gameplay hasn't gotten worse.

Dalren

@h-town: Well, I thought we were playing Final FANTASY, not Rainbow Six. So, you know, it makes sense if you think about it.

Lightman

Good. There is no such thing as too much Final Fantasy.

Dalren

Such is the problem with titles with unending non-related sequels. 50 years down the road, whos up for a round of FFXXIX?

kitsuneconundrum

By the way, if there's anyone out there that still doesn't get FFX, here's a hint, look up Anima on google, do some reading.

ego531

But since the games all take place on parallel worlds (I mean what other explanation can there be for the same guy to be in every game), they can each be the final, ultimate fantasy, right? As in nothing more incredible (offer limited to this universe).

Would not the ultimate undiscovery be the non-discovery of something so obvious, nothing could possibly be more redundant? I can't think at that level, but it would have to be something like "Hey! Guess what! Everybody already knows they need to breath!" Or "We either exist or we don't! You already knew that."

The one thing that does bug me though (apart from, I don't know, international poverty and bad fashion sense) is criticizing Final Fantasy, one of the top titles in the world (in terms of cash, let's not debate the quality) over irrelevant details. Like, how effeminate the lead looks (I don't care. You can have a butch hero in every other game, it wouldn't be a valid complaint in any other medium), how little choice you have (it's not an American style RPG, don't bother comparing them. Lack of choice is no more a deficit to FF than it is to a movie--it's just a stylistic choice on their part), or that it's not final (the info about what the title means is widely available, probably near the top of the wikipedia article. Do 1 minute of research on any topic you write about, please).

You could complain about the broad characterization, especially of "goofy" or "ethnic" characters, or the combat, or even the specific problems in the story (though I do think people need to examine FF plots carefully for symbolism and depth--even a surface scan tends to pick up things the average gamer might miss), sexism, etc, but try at least to have complaints not borne entirely in ignorance or homophobia.

Ah well. Good old bank of Square Enix.

ego531

Where is square-enix forums section because i want to reply back to them.

zkotaku

Final Fantasy stereotypes i just don't understand. I mean how many American games feature a stereoroid induced musclebound meathead wielding guns of mass destruction with a necessary muti-colored cards strapped to his keychain?

Xtreme_Hindu_Cow

I wouldn't exactly consider X or X-2 to be 'ultimate' by any means...

Space_Cakes

@h-town: In battle you get knocked-out. If your entire party is knocked out, then the animals feast on your flesh or something. You can get revived from THAT, but the final KO puts you there and keeps you there.

phinehas

Final Fantasy MCMLXX confirmed!

Surfaced

Yup, that's fine and all. But as a fan I believe the series ended with VI.. maybe VII, afterward it was really hyped to be the greatest RPG title ever. They had to push every title to the limits graphically that gradually overtime I feel the story lines have turned toward the worst. Maybe there will never be a final final fantasy, my grandchildren will be playing FFXXXI-3

AkiBakiSan

This is typical of a corporation trying to keep ahold of a Cashcow.

It's been stated before, the real reason why it was called "Final" Fantasy was because Sakaguchi thought it'd be the swan-song for Square. Naturally it wasn't but isn't it worrying when suddenly they decide to change this and state it was supposed to mean "Ultimate?" A Cashcow is a cashcow, if your gonna milk it atleast be honest about it, it's like a Milkmaid passing herself off as a Lawyer.

Neonlare

@Dalren: Not if you don't play Crisis Core it doesn't.Too much "X" attack button mashing for me.12 seemed lame too where setting everyone to attack did the job far too well.
@Turambar: Hang on, I can see you excluding 12 and X-2 not being in the realm of greatness but X was really good.(Well at least I thought it was good!).Why does everyone hate X so much?
@Kia: Now that you put it like that, it's really obvious...

Xideo

@Channing: Nintendo wouldn't since it made money out of Gamecube. Differently from Sony that lost loads of money selling PS2. Anyhow, I gotcha your point.

alecpyron

So I guess the last Final Fantasy game will be called The First Fantasy?

Oh well, not that I care. I rather go play The World Ends With You, Grandia, Parasite Eve, Legend of Tragoon, Front Mission, Sword of Mana/Seiken, Egg Monster Hero/Soft-Boiled Hero, SaGa, ActRaiser, Code Age, and the many other titles the Square part of Square Enix actualy makes that get less and less likely to see do well each year.

Kenofthedead

@m0re: I couldn't handle the loading times in that game.

Shirleycakes

@Xtreme_Hindu_Cow: I'm glad someone else pointed this out. People are so harsh on Final Fantasy games when they at least TRY to not be cookie cutter clones of themselves.

Shirleycakes

@Kenofthedead: Legend of Dragoon (if that's indeed what you meant) isn't a square game.

m0re

@Channing: There are a certain things that are similar. The battle system,Cid with the mechanical genius persona and yeah the Moogles. =D

From what I know what Bash said about Final Fantasy actually being their last product as they were close to bankruptcy is correct. I read that somewhere (possibly EGM?!) ages ago...

@Xtreme_Hindu_Cow: I think it's more of the way JRPG's combat mechanics and story cliches are done. Most of the time I've seen that people are separated from people liking JRPGs or others who are more into Western Rpgs (Oblivion and its ilk).

I'm personally in-between. As I like both genres. Though I admit I like the old-school FF better. Yeah I liked FF9 better than 7 or 8. It was a good throwback to the earlier games...

excaliburps

Personally, I still feel ripped off by Never-Ending Story.

phicaluk

This is older news- I could've sworn there was a post of this a whiles back.

Kuroomu

@James in Dupont: This is what I've read and believe is the truth.

hagridore

@m0re: Thanks for catching that. I actualy meant Bahamut Lagoon, and somehow messed it up.

On the plus side now that I've thought about it and how I messed it up, I shall go force myself to play Bahamut Lagoon yet again. So much fun.

Kenofthedead

HAH! So they think Final means "ultimate" huh? Final Fantasy? Doesn't look so R rated or maximum risky to me!!

Ultrasinc

@m0re:

That one was a pretty good game, it was very long and the combat system was interesting. Too bad it has no replay value because it's linear, no choices in upgrades and the best team is obviously Dart, Hachel and Albert.

GodKiller0

Well, final fantasy 1 is a hell of a good game, seriously. Technically, it's much better then 2-3-4. The replay value is almost un-surpassed by every FF after. My favorites are 1-5-6-7-X ... the rest is ok, except the overrated, bad story, linear, easy FF 4 and the latest FF 12, which is a real let down considering how well X turned out. 2 and 3 original version we're not masterpieces too.

GodKiller0

Well no kidding they're not going to stop.

devpeck1

As long as FF VII exists, the series will never end.

Remake after prequel after sequel after remake.

Dr_Pie

they better get back the director and taste they had for FF6 and chrono, because we have some awful FF out there, in fact, we have -almost- 7 of them. "But they did a remake for chrono, gonna have it this september!"
Yeah wel Chrono will still be in his 32 bit form (Classy and very funny sometimes mind you), but shit you saw what they did with FF7 AC and crisis core. Imagine FF6 with those graphics, that would be totally insane, an FF7 killer for sure. :P

dissidia should've been characters of FF from mystic quest to FF6, now THAT would've been awesome.

Phibius

@Xemnas: I was under the impression that Kingdom Hearts was just a spinoff of Final Fantasy (a lot of the human characters had the same name with a cartoonish look) mixed in with some Disney.

Oh and a good story to boot.

Also, I dont know why people always talk bad about X and XII

X was good, and I loved the story (and I even liked the twist of X-2, but still prefer X with its Grid, etc)

I loved XII because it added a little more difficulty. Had to get a license and buy something before using it, annoying yes, but still worthwhile.

Not only that but I liked the story. It was something different, imo.

MadColombian

I live under the impression that if Final Fantasy ever stopped, the world would implode.

the_red_sage

And yet they don't seem to want to listen to "WE WANT FFVII (or VI for some of us other people) REMADE!!" :( jerks

and ya, people are stupid. The only ONLY thing bad in FFX was the lack of world map/use of Airship. The characters, story, sphere grid, etc was all awesome.

FFX-2 was horrible in all but gameplay. The gameplay was awesome. Well, the last boss was cool.. and the story was ok, but the characters, the music, the endless lame side quests... meh...

FFXII was bad though, just bad... it was like.. half complete it felt. The license grid was just lame, every character being the same? Meh... and the main character was boring as hell. Oh well...

Viciouschan

The hack joke will never die, will it? Yeah, we get it. "Why is it called Final Fantasy if-" How many Final Fantasy fans give a shit about what the title of the game is or what relevance it has or had? (Nice to know a tidbit on the first FF by the way, didn't know that.)

If FF was called donkey adventure, I'd still be down. I'm more interested in if they can tell an interesting story and gameplay. Didn't have much time pondering the name. At least it's not called these awful RPG names that are either too long or too hard to pronounce.

YotaruVegeta

Considering each new itteration of Final Fantasy is basically a completely new world, with completely new characters I think it's safe to say they could continue making them as long as they want.

Although It would be nice if they'd make a main character that WASN'T a blonde bishonen with emotional problems. I mean. for once make a final fantasy with a big burly manly man as the main character. Switch it up people!

mordennight

@Neonlare: Actually, fun fact, 究竟 (kyuukyou) really can be translated as either "final" or "ultimate".

Obviously, while it was originally named "Final Fantasy" because, if it had flopped, it would've been Square's last game, the Japanese word for final DOES also mean ultimate.

Suzaku

@mordennight: Go play Final Fantasy 6. And you're right I'm tired of the blonde bishonen with emotional problems, but a big burly man wouldn't sell to the fangirls as well. I tell you people look at a girl funny when she picks Auron as her favorite from Final Fantasy 10. (Now if you'll excuse me I'm going to go knock garland down again. Yay PSP remakes!)

Ajh

That's really funny they'd say that because Sakaguchi's been in interviews saying it was because that was the last effort for him to produce a game. After that he'd quit the industry and say the hell with it. (Then again has anyone PLAYED some of the other square games before final fantasy...ick)

I don't have a problem with Final Fantasy (number here) as a title though. So long as they try to make the best story they can.

Ajh

@Project Thanatos: That's why 6 was my favorite! Midway though the game..oops world destroyed. It wasn't as "emotional" as the Aerith death scene (where I cried out in horror as I realized I lost my main healer.) Yeah, all the final fantasy games feature save the WORLD. Which works for a title.

Ajh

I always figured since every Final Fantasy deals with an apocalyptic event, Final Fantasy meant that it was the world's final story in regards to a world changing conflict.

I think that's what made FF6 so attractive to me.. because the heroes fail to stop Kefka and the world falls into ruin. Then the other half of the game begins. :D

Project Thanatos

I do mean last.
End of would be 'Finale' and I hate that bastard.

Final

@maraxusofk: Especially as the series begins to more and more abandon the only threads that connected the games in the first place, FF13 may as well be named something completely different. But then, it seems like fans enjoy it 8 times more when it has the same name as their other favorite games.

Also, doesn't "Ultimate" technically mean "Last" too? Weird world of language change.

Pombar

@Xemnas: I hate you.

I'd rather have seen the whole franchise die at 9, or 8, or 7. It's like seeing a relative you really loved on life support fade away or something. Better for everyone involved not to drag it out.

skullpanda

@Viciouschan: You forgot to mention Blitzball or Blitzkreig, or whatever it's called: the Quiddich of FF. My problem with X was just that it was too... soft! It seemed to be taking a page more from the Kingdom Hearts playbook instead of the steampunk variety of some of the earlier titles. The level-up system was tedious at times and I just became so disinterested after a while (although that could be attributed to video-game ADD).

Space_Cakes

I don't know what dictionary they're using, but I've never seen "Final" to mean "Ultimate". I think they're just making crap up now.

Darkest Daze

@Darkest Daze: Obviously, direct english defintion will not carry those specific meanings the developers wanted to entail.

If you think with some common sense, you will see that they used "Final" in context of "Last" or the "Very End." As in "ultimate" which means something that is at its pinnacle, or last point. Thus "Final Fantasy" can mean the best or the magnus opus of RPG games.

Don't be such a hater and say how they are "making crap up now." How they used a non-native word to describe something is up to their imagination. This is basically the same as american weeaboos using japangalish.. DESU!

Gummyworm

I guess in the highly unlikely situation that they go bankrupt, they want the last Final Fantasy to be the best. Personally, they could've ended it after X.

-Bass4TheFace-

They better not stop making FF's. Just stop milking it so much.

Gam3r

"Ultimate" is a commonly misunderstood word, and, while slightly more versatile than "Final", is still no more appropriate in the title of a game series. That is to say, there is only one "ultimate", just as there is only one "final".
This guy has no idea what he is talking about.

Now, if you had originally gone and called your game "Penultimate Fantasy" in aticipation of the sequel, "Ultimate Fantasy", that would be acceptable. Self-deprecating and self-sabotaging, sure, but grammatically sound.

Comatose Turtle

I thought about that wheb they released FFII

HELLSRIDER

My parents always mocked me when we went to go buy the new final fantasy game. "If it's the final fantasy, why do I have to buy you a new one every year?"

Grahamunculus

@Gummyworm: Actually, Ultimate can mean that it's the greatest, that it's an underlying reality when stripped to it's bare essential, or it could mean the last.

None of them lend to having many Ultimate anythings. If it's the greatest, then you can't have 13 greatest fantasies. One would be the greatest, the rest would just be really good. You can only have one fundamental fantasy, the rest would of been stripped away to uncover the "Ultimate Fantasy", and it obviously can't be the last fantasy, because there are 300 of them and counting.

Regardless of your attempt to make me look wrong, you can't have 13 Final Fantasies and you can't have 13 Ultimate Fantasies. No definition allows there to be more then one, and allow them all to still bear the same name.

Darkest Daze

Final Fantasy MCMXVII confirmed!

gencid