It's ok, modders will just find hacks to make their own modding tools, and then we'll be back in business.

neko613

A Bethesda game with no mod tool? So... it'll never even be remotely playable, huh?

Grimhound

It's my party and I'll cry if I want to...

Morpork

I'm sure they will find a way to mod the game.

y2julio

@Quaro:

yeah but they could say they'll release it later on. and believe me ca$h pc gamers buy games. it's that the developers killed the market by only making fps games that's the problem and people migrated to consoles to get their gaming fix.

Quaro

Either way, I'm still getting it for the PC since I've gotta still get use out of spending all that money on my rig :3

Kaizuden

The modders will find a back-door. Happened before, will happen again, especially since a lot of them already know how to manipulate the Oblivion engine.

Dragonzigg

@InfernoT: Except that they released the mod tool for Oblivion themselves. I sincerely doubt this desicision is due to bruised developer egos.

TitillatedOcelot

That sucks, mods were my favorite part about Oblivion.

Berd

@Quaro: Or "Our schedule is to tight, if we don't meet our milestones, we won't get paid." Developers are on schedules...they can't do everything to make us happy.

Dreadfish

Hm...this sways my position on which version I'm going to get. I was going to get the PC version because of the mods, but if there aren't going to be any, I'll get it on a console and play it on my big comfy couch (instead of my less comfy computer chair).

TitillatedOcelot

@Quaro:
Maybe if PC gamers actually bought the game in reasonable quantities...

ca$h

They're just bitter that the modders are what made Oblivion good.

InfernoT

or in other words "we don't give a f@k about you pc gamers any more, we only care for the xbots".

Quaro

Eh, modders are a resourceful bunch. They'll make it work.

Or I'll cry. Whole reason I bought the PC version was for the moooooods...

Rebochan

I seem to recall something similar happening with Oblivion anyway. The tools didn't ship with that game, but were available at roughly the same time. If the dev team really doesn't have time for that, then I'll accept it, and truly hope to see one later, after development is finished. If we still don't see a mod tool after that, then I will be concerned.

KommissarK

@TitillatedOcelot: It's not that there won't be any, but that the mod tools won't be working at release date. Very likely the tools will be patched in later, though hopefully not much later.

Ginnsberg

I always figured that mod tools were just a reworking of the toolset used to create the original game content. I'm sure they have something. Perhaps he meant that they just don't have enough time to rework those tools into something non-employees would be able to figure out. Here's hoping they find the time to release them later.

cabjf

Modders will find a way. They always have, always will. I'm not too worried. If nothing else I'm sure they'll release mod tools down the road.

deadjesterx

I usually start dicking around with mods after I've played the game proper, so this isn't a big deal for me.

Strangelove

Its because all of the console crowd would baw if Fallout didn't come out on the 360 and PS3. Its their fault that Bethesda is developing for 3 things at once and not just the PC.

yodaman23

@outofreach: What would be the point of modding a game if it was perfect to start with? ;)

The Whaleman

The combat in oblivion was so god awful that i couldn't stand playing for more than the first hour before getting exhausted knowing the next 80 would be similar crap.

What is the point of modding a game when the core gameplay of said game is complete garbage?

outofreach

Beth doesn't want gamers to realize how crap their product is compared to the mods that will come out for it. Just look at Oblivion.

Harfold

I guess I will be waiting on Fallout 3 until the mod tools are released. Bethesda games are always crap unless heavily modded.

Eldragon

@yodaman23: and yet Epic managed to put UT3 on 3 systems and also included modding tools for two of those systems.

y2julio

@Quaro: Xbots? You do know the game is also coming out for the PS3 right?

y2julio

@yodaman23:

Of course, damn them for trying to stay competitive in the market, those rascals!

This is no different from the Oblivion tools not being shipped with the game. It's just that everyone wants to find fault with Bethesda on this game.

What happened to the good ol' days when modders had to jury-rig their own tools and crack the file formats? Modders these days seem to expect the tools handed to them on a silver platter with documentation printed in gold ink...

Disgruntled Aussie Gamer

Vanilla Oblivion was outright average mebe 6/10 in comparison to OOO and the like imo, worst news all day... Not that i've had much bad news today but still :P

The_nub_next_door

luckily im getting my collectors edition on the PS3. My PC has been an annoyance when it comes to installing new programs ever since my XP was uprgraded to vista (gaaaarbage). So having Guild Wars and Sims 2 is enough.

But i'm sure at some point you PC gamers can mod the hell out of that game like you all love to do :D

DarthMetalHope

There's a reason why PC games keep selling still years after release. Without good mod tools, Fallout 3 won't have that reason.

Mara

The F3Toolkit isn't on their schedule because they're actually putting more effort than ES3 and ES4 combined into the game.

Adriankat

People, they're not saying they won't make the game mod-able, they're saying it's low on the priority list. The game is built on an engine designed for mods, and Bethesda knows how much mods contribute to their success.

All it means is you might have to wait for a patch.

Tiber

despite the fixes for games that always come out, i can say that for both Morrowind and Oblivion, both of which were not too bad on their own, give them a bit of credit, mods made them absolutely amazing, and frankly in the long run, they could have had significantly more sales if they had included it.

Recusor

@Ginnsberg: Yeah, now the question is, can I wait that long?

TitillatedOcelot

Mods are a part of the reason these developers are going away from the PC and sticking to consoles.

Their pride is getting too hurt in seeing what people can do for FREE to fix their shoddy developing, and they're sick of the world exposing this. So they'll just be content to put the game on consoles and hide their imperfections.

MVP Baseball 2005 on its own, in my opinion, has destroyed EA Sports desire to work on PC games. That game has been updated for nearly 4 years now to update EVERYTHING, and it makes EA Sports look foolish in their yearly sports game releases with minimal updates. They see how much the community does with that game every year, and I bet it's embarrassing.

mva5580

Not really interested in Fall Out, so it doesn't bother me as much as say an announcement that TES5 won't have mod support.

Gen.Grievous

@Quaro:

Apparently, not only that, but they are also far too busy to even consider DLC for the PS3.

Bethesda taking lessons from Valve? but then taking paychecks from Microsoft? hmm..

0rin

I have a strong feeling that there will be a "True Fallout" mod out after awhile; bringing the game closer to the old Fallout, or at least try to.
I'm interested in that one then!

Plus, Oblivion's gameplay was just rubbish if it hadn't been for a bunch of good mods.

Melonfodder

@Eville1 says SKUse me a sec.:
It's because the mainstream doesn't understand RPGs anymore.

Adriankat

ahhh mods.

Nothing like moding the old fallouts to play as a super mutant or robot.

I better be able to do that in 3. Could always extract and swap model/skin files and recompile if I have to...

Derigor

Yeah modders should mod modsupport in!

Sunjammer

A lot of hate for a game and a company that everyone said they've been waiting for. And people wonder why Oblivion got game of the year for Xbox and the like? Sans mods? Hmm.

Eville1 says SKUse me a sec.

@Gen.Grievous: Then next time, don't comment on a Fallout 3 post.

Spoony Bard

@y2julio: Some people just need a reason to hate. No matter how lame it is.

Spoony Bard

Not buying it until there are mod tools.

Oblivion was a crappy, simple, buggy console game until mods took it and made an excellent PC version.

Harmatia

I just hope it runs decently on my computer...

Vecha

@0rin: Don't you people get tired of whinning all the time. They will do whats best for their pockets ALWAYS no matter what you think or how much you bitch about it. Only thing you can do is not support the product, but then its your loss.

Sweetsauce

I don't know, it sounds like the mod tool will come later. If that means I get the game sooner, then cool. Say what you want about Bethesda, they tend not to release a game and then forget about it. I wouldn't be too worried about this.

heretrix

@mva5580:

Well...with games like unreal on the 360...I'm Sure mods will eventually come to the consoles in for storm!

at least I hope

Vecha

@Harmatia:

it wasn't as buggy on my 360....at least I didn't notice as much problems as I did on my PC.

Vecha

Wow, Beth has been headed in a downward spiral with each version of elder scrolls getting more and more dumbed down for the idiot masses. Fallout 3 is looking to go the same way, and seems to be way more focused on the FPS part of the game than the RPG part of "an RPG series" that they bought. Now the one saving grace of Beth has been releasing mod tools and now they do not even want to do that? Nice move, now they have officially turned into a generic crappy company.

Azriel77

I played a ton of Oblivion on the 360 (obviously without mods) and didn't have any problems...? Was the PC version somehow worse than the 360 version? Or are people equating "slight framerate hiccups" with a game being unplayable?

dowingba

My own opinion is that Oblivion won game of the year on xBox because the reviewers didn't play enough of the game to see that it eventually broke so that folks who played the game a lot couldn't finish it.

Chilly Hollow

@Eldragon: Amen. Maybe the modders can step in and get the game to work.

Chilly Hollow

Hm, i wonder if this is some conspiracy to get me to switch my preorder to Xbox from PC. Ugh, i hate these new comment bubbles, sorry.

kidko

We are definitely impressed with the mods that get released for Oblivion.

As we already mentioned a few times, including a fan interview back before E3, we'd love to see mods tools for Fallout 3 happen. First and foremost, the priority is getting Fallout 3 ready for release. If/when we're able to get them out, we'll let everyone know.

gstaff

@Rebochan: @Rebochan:

Exactly.

The primary reason I'm BUYING Fallout 3 is for modding.

Cpryd001

Hmmm.... so no naked people walking around a post-apocalyptic landscape??

Bummer.

goddessakasha

@Sweetsauce:
But I'm a paying consumer that is why I am whining. I don't care which console sells the most cause I've made my decision as a consumer. But here we have a game that doesn't come with the usual extra. It's like buying a new car without airconditioning. Is it an extra? Yes. Is it an extra that you think should be standard? Oh yes. and spoony bard the comment wasn't anti 360. But then some people just need a reason to be offended. I didn't mention the ps3 cause I keep hearing it just sells less copies of each game.

Quaro

God the wine, are you all in Napa? Oblivion rocked, and just got better with the mods. What reviewer (worth a damn) didn't like it when it came out? What award didn't it win? I think that after you finish it for the 6th time you know way too much about how everything works and it's just not enjoyable anymore, but man when it came out it was teh shit!

Relax, Fallout 3 is going to great, the mods will come, they always do.

Pwnieboy

If they don't have modding on the PC version this is huge negative for me.

That's part of the reason the PC version of Oblivion was the best version of the game, and why I loved it so much.

marcus1060

@Cpryd001: Same here. I added some 200+ hours to Morrowind through various mods. Oblivion, not nearly as much but there we're some wonderful mods out there that made the game better. Bewsides, with Bethasda's history of buggy games, a Modding tool would be fantastic. The other thing that has me itching is the fact I live pretty damn close to DC. Being able to plop down places that I know would be awesome. Besides, I'm just itching to adding the full Metro complete with non-working escalators!

trogam

Good on them they can start work on the modding tools after the game is on store shelfs, modders can do alot before they have the tools. Like creating textures etc. Not to mention no one plays mods right after the game is released they have to beat it and get bored with it first :)

redice

"...all these different languages to get it out around the wall."

Wait, so now they're all working on translating the game, the programmers and artists? :rolleyes:

I just think they want to profit from this later. Sell it for 10 bucks.

HenryHSH

I blame the lack of work on a mod tool on someone at Bethesda deciding that Fallout3 needs to be on 3 platforms! Does doing multi-platform releases really maximize profits for a developer? I want hard figures, please. Do the profits from selling on 3 platforms make up for the extra work needed to make 3 different versions? Also, say you really WANTED to make a mod tool for the game, but it would be a nightmare to create some tool that works on all systems with all their different file systems and all the different harddrive, usb, network options. How would you even import user made mods into the game in a reliable way across platforms? Each platform would need a different set of tools.

They should have just chosen a platform (cough,PS3 cough) and made the strongest game they could. Yah I'm a PS3 fanboy.

trigger2

Wow. People certainly like to be pretentious. Oblivion = in the top 5 games I have ever played, without mods.

Itri

Mods "saved that game"? I certainly would have accepted "enriched", "enhanced", or "extended the longevity of"; but "saved"? I think that what saved the game was that it was made by a high-pedigree developer like Bethesda, and not some bored, anal-retentive, forum-stalking programmer looking to fill the holes in his life by modding a game, and then condescendingly listing his improvements.

Poohead-1

@TitillatedOcelot:
I don't know about you, but I sure as hell can!

Besides that let us not forget about the in-game console, which will probably only be available for the PC as usual.

HepCat

no more delays>!

UnwantedKiller

@Itri:
You should play more games.

Tizlor

@redice: Really, the mod tools should be the same tools the developers made the game with. The tools they made Fallout with should be the same tools they made Oblivion with, since they use the same engine.

Sure, they probably improved upon the engine and the tools, but I expect there to be similarities.

The real work to be done is to make it so user mods won't crash the game, and getting the tools documented (they said this part about the documentation themselves).

Tiber

@Quaro:
I see what you're saying. I wouldn't exactly call a mod tool an expected extra when compared to most games, but I guess for Bethesda it has been. Still, they said it might come out after they're less bogged down with work. They really should have accounted for it in their time budgeting, though.

Blah8

@Grimhound: What do you mean? I only played Oblivion on the Xbox 360 and I thought it was fine. What did the mods change/add for PC?

TheFamous1

Mods "saved" Oblivion. I think you may have been playing a different game, Luke.

nlangan

They don't want to release any modding tools, so you can't make your own dog-armor. :/
No user created content = more chances that gamers spend their cash on EA's crappy DLC.

neojam

If they don't release mod tools for this game I'm just not going to buy it. It's the whole point of open worlds.

jcrsantiago

Without mods Oblivion is crap. Mods made that game 10 times better.

AzureD

Saved the game? I've never had any issues with vanilla oblivion, or the 360 version. Occasional AI issues like getting stuck on a rock, but nothing a little shove cant fix.

Talleh

No mod content for Fallout 3? Well, I'll pass then. If and when they do release modding tools for fallout 3, I'll pick it up.

I don't even know what vanilla Oblivion looks or plays like anymore. I can't imagine playing a Bethesda game without mods.

Sir_Crocidile

@Infamous.mpgEU: for oblivion that is

Infamous.mpgEU

Most of the mods i seen where just texture changes and some graphical tweaks.

Infamous.mpgEU

Lots of idiots saying F3 will have NO modding tools, then just right out condeming Bethesda for stuff they imagined (yeah bethesda is not perfect, but anti-PC?). Idiots. The tools will probably just be available later like with Oblivion. They never said NEVER.

Here's something amazing, another website made a few anti-Oblivion comments and the readers accuse them of anti-PC gaming agenda. Yes, you heard me. To them: Oblivion-hate = PC-gaming-hate

Of course, this is the same species that say idiot stuff like 'Islam is evil' whenever they here news like 'terrorist behead hostage in Iraq'. The comments here is just a small sample of how stupid the human race is becoming.

syafiqjabar

As with UT3's short comings, I BLAME CONSOLES FOR THIS! Who's with me?!

Yofu

With that said, I am about |---| close to canceling my preorder. Fuck you console games, you are fucking ruining gaming. I have no doubt in my mind that they are pushing the game out because of the fucking consoles and this screwing PC people over. Mods in Oblivion make that game worth playing and make the game infinitely better. If it isn't released with the game, it BETTER be released sometime after it. People play the console versions of Obliivon because they are just too dumb to not realize what they are missing out on.

Rajolae

@Tiber: Well all I am saying is get the game out there worry about the extras after. Most people are not going to be playing mods right after launch, or working on them even if the tools were available.

redice

@Infamous.mpgEU:

try visiting some of the better oblivion mod sites like tesnexus, they have categories like quests, weapons/armors, and gameplay that just about completely changes how oblivion plays, not just looks

thisisnotright

Fallout fans are screwed. No way this game will ever live up to its name without devoted modders.

qJohnnyp

Well, consoles get more and more love from developers.
PC as a gaming platform is not "hip" anymore :-(

ZnegilLetni

So they might actually have to finish their game, instead of relying on the mod community.

PhilomenaJahoobies