I'm surprised that they don't go over to the Wii if that's the case. If they are having problems with the Cell, maybe look at the 360?

Shin-san

@thedarkmarc: nominating this for comment of the week...every week. It fucking applies to anything-except another quote from peter molyneux.

kakihara

Personally, I'm tired of waiting on FFXIII. I got tired of waiting on Kingdom Hearts 2 three years after the teaser trailer at the end of the first one.

Amazon_Chris

tru dat

thedarkmarc

"it's relatively easy to form a large team that required to create this generation of games..."

I grew up in the generation that supposedly learned to create bad grammar... and even I think it's "relatively easy" to correct that sentence.

That said, with all the talk about how Generation X and Generation Y are, respectively, the "slacker generation," and "the dumbest generation ever born," I'd be really amused if we somehow overtook the Japanese in the software development department.

I mean, okay, so the baby boomers beat us in nuclear weapons development, but we're clearly beating them in raw profits!

BtownDesignGuy

Why don't they fucking export to another country. They do for anime, but it would make it look better not worse in this case. Well, to export to a group that can do advanced programing well it may not be cost effective.

I don't know.

kakihara

Yeah, it's really depressing for me as American games don't seem to have the same pull for me as Japanese games do(design wise.) Ah well, here's hoping they make a come back sometime soon...

DarkCode

@Super_Koopa: It was released worldwide. It's in the hearts of millions of fans (just not as fondly in those who don't have a ps3).

kakihara

Sounds more like: "FFXIII? Pssshh... it was never THAT good. >:-("

Honestly, he's been saying what many developers have been saying and seeing that he isn't using his own games as an example may speak to humility or dissatisfaction with his own studios... who know. Enough prominent developers from Japan have chimed in enough to give this belief some credence.

okenny :) ...building bridges (to hide under)

Aw Japan, don't get so down on yourself. Resident Evil looks incredible. You'll get through it big guy.

SnakesSolids

@Grumpz®:HDTV's are nothing new in Japan. The issue is, they simply don't care.

Foxstar Sixtail

@Super_Koopa:It is.

Foxstar Sixtail

I believe it, just look at Square. Sure they hay have quite a few projects in the fire but when they talked about pulling FFvsXIII team members to work on FFXIII in their spare time (or vice versa, forget how it is exactly) it shows the strain on developers being stretched so thin

Sparx

look at all the jrpgs atlus has release so far on 360/ps3. The graphics are ps2 quality but a tiny bit more widescreen and nicer. Disgaea 3 I'm looking at you too.
What's the HDTV penetration percentage there?
They needs to learn to unlock the power of the cell/Castle Grayskull.

Grumpz®

Wait, in Japan, isn't MGS4 in the bargain?

Super_Koopa

@Xiedo: That wasn't supposed to be a comment-specific directed reply.

Xiedo

Oh well. I'm having trouble thinking of any Japanese dev I care about anymore besides Capcom. And Capcom is doing great.

Xiedo

@BtownDesignGuy: ....Until you look at the national deficit. Then you go "...o....well, shit, we *are* the dumbass slackers".

verrius

@Shin-san: where you been living? most Japanese developers are into:

1.Cell Phone
2.DS
3.Wii
4.Ps2
5.Ps3
6.PC
7.OSX
8.Xbox360

VakeroRokero

@BtownDesignGuy: If we're focusing on game programming, I'd say we've been ahead for years in software development. It's just that no one realized it while the pc market gave way to consoles. The original Xbox, and on to the 360, has acted as the Portal (pun intended) for pc developers to enter the console market with their wares largely intact. Now obviously, that has expanded to the PS3, and even handhelds. The set of skills and experience offered from pc devs in the West dwarfs anything from the East shown on a console.

What we lack is the creativity and attention to detail the Japanese bring.

The matter of which side you find more appealing is entirely up to you.

Of course there's going to be exceptions to both sides of this situation, but those wouldn't really fit my sweeping generalizations (i.e. this is just my opinion).

Killtacular

@BtownDesignGuy: so what you are saying is that our generation is better because we are making more video games?

I never saw it from THAT perspective...

VakeroRokero

That explains the lack of third party support the PSP and Ps3 are getting, not piracy but slow japanese developers.

Let's ask Nintendo if they agree with this statement...

VakeroRokero

@okenny :) ...building bridges (to hide under): Actually outside of Polyphony Digital, Team ICO, and the "Japan Team" (that last one mostly makes low budget stuff like Echochrome), how much does Sony even have in Japan?

It seems like even Sony itself has mostly invested in America and Europe. I mean, it's almost spamming when I start listing off their studios like Sony Santa Monica, Psygnosis, Media Molecule, Gorilla, Sony London, Insomniac, Sucker Punch, Naughty Dog, Evolution Studios, and many more.

Nirolak

I'd imagine this is one of the main reasons there have been so few RPG titles for the damn thing.

B33

@DarkCode: So in other words... you miss pointless grinding & stories that don't make sense or even finish things up? You feel the need for a game that requires a strategy guide to complete because there's no indication of what to do?

Japan fell behind a few years ago and hasn't really caught up. Expecially Square.

zPhreak

@Nirolak: i think that was sonys plan from the beginning, i mean the western market was still on the up and up (where consoles are considered) in 1995... its smart to go after the guys on the rise instead of trying to start up dev teams in the dominant market. also, sony worked close with americans on the development side of things when they were just a publisher.

shouryuuken

@DarkCode: I'm still surprised people want to play japanese designed games. Then again, theres the whole anime/manga craze thats blocking their thoughts.

NoBullet

I work in the industry and part of the advantage the US has over Japan in high end graphics is the movie industry and other tangental industry to draw on. Another big advantage is our dominance in PC gaming with high end 3D. A lot of graphics technology and even programmers in the industry have been drawn from other industries because a lot of the principles are the same.

In Japan they have a lot of talent but for high end 3D you really need a mature industry, and it's hard even in the US to find people with that experience. They have very disciplined developers and know how to make quality games. We'll definitely see some great graphics out of them too, but it's going to take them an extra year or two longer for Japan to catch up. I just love what I see in games like White Knight Story and Last Remnant.

royaljester

Yeah it doesn't help that the PS3 is an absolute PAIN IN THE ASS to develop for, not to mention expensive. If there is one barrier to entry for this generation it's the unaccommodating nature of the PS3. Even little PSN games are a challenge.

ChiChi_BBQ

@shouryuuken: longer*

shouryuuken

@DarkCode: i hear what youre saying man.. i feel the same way. and to the kids that replied to you first.. i dont play rpgs and i dont care for anime much..

its this simple.. i dont want to play an fps (most the time) i dont like mmo rpgs or simulators, i dont like rts.. i hate sandbox games.. and im not trying to play a game that wants to be a movie.. if i wanted to play pc games... i wouldnt do it on my 360 or ps3.. i like arcade games.. i like platform games.. those and jrpgs are what they shine at.. and if 5 years from now.. they no long existed.. id quit playing games.

shouryuuken

And why is Yoshida trying to give us a primer on something the majority of us already know??

In other words, what is his point exactly?

You have the choice of two options here:

1. That Yoshida is trying to alight us to an issue that really has nothing to do with anything, and is not even specific to just Japanese developers alone, but to any small time developer without the correct requisite funds to create such a technical achievement (if that is the type of game they are even aiming for to begin with - *1st flaw in Yoshidas argument*) be they Japanese , American, or European.

OR

2. That he is trying to make pretenses for the PS3 not sharing in the same success that its former predecessor, the PS2, shared in from the japanese market of last generation....

Well seeing as how option 1 is simple common sense, we are left with only option 2 to understand Yoshida's reasoning for making such a trite comment to the media boys in the first place.

*Sigh Mr. Sony exec*....maybe you should stop making lame excuses over why you think PS3 japanese developer support is so lax, and actually GIVE these so called Japanese developers a valid reason to SUPPORT your console, much like what nintendo has done with the wii and what Microsoft is currently trying to do with the 360.

Sitting on your ass and spewing theoretical babble over why you *THINK* PS3 japanese dev support is failing is more than enough PR worthless spin for one night. We all know solving technological hurdles (which Sony doesn't seem to be doing too much of anyways - look at Guilty Gear overture commentary article) is only half the problem. The other half (5th place marketshare behind the DS, PSP, Wii, and PS2, lower royalties than your competitions, declining brandname, other platforms wanting to be explored besides playstation *gasps*, etc) we haven't even begun to touch upon.

Logic1

Since when did technology make a great game?

There are plenty of examples of great games without having "the latest and the greatest" in technology.

This focus on technology over creativity is getting depressing.

GrandfatherParadox

@GrandfatherParadox: "Technology" is the definition of a "great game" in terms of the PS3, because it boasts technical advantages over the 360, which is pure rubbish anyway. The PS3's alleged technical superiority combined with a strict memory limitation just makes it tough to develop for. It's sad really, all that "power" without the capacity (memory and disc read speed) to pull it off. The end result is developers trying to optimize performance rather than manifesting their ideas into working code.

ChiChi_BBQ

@ChiChi_BBQ: It's not just for the PS3. The 360 also defined itself as the most powerful machine when it came out and the Wii is defining itself as "anti-technology".

GrandfatherParadox

@Logic1:

And maybe he just answered the questions of a journalist?

Garo

@Logic1: I think you're overlooking a third option.

This isn't about hardware. It's an observation about the games development industry in Japan compared to other countries. Remember when Japan was at the forefront of games development? Yoshida does... He joined Sony in 1986. He's been in the industry for a long time, and times have changed. He's making a point about the technological base shift that has occurred over time, not about his company's hardware.

It's not an official Sony PR release. Instead of "trying to alight us to an issue that really has nothing to do with anything", or "trying to make pretenses for the PS3 not sharing in the same success [of its predecessor]", he might just be trying to share his views with us by explaining his thoughts at the Games Convention in Germany.

天

I think the phrase "speak for yourself" would be appropriate at this moment. I'd love it if Sony executives completely lose it and pull a Randy "Sexual Chocolate" Watson hissy-fit.

Sony: "PS3, everybody!"

*scattered applause from developers*

Sony: (stomps feet) "P-S-THREE!"
*drops mike and stomps off the stage*

boopadoo

@GrandfatherParadox: Yep. I find it strange that, out of all the games coming out on PS3, the one I have my eyes most set on is Mega Man 9. That's not to say that tech and creativity can't go hand in hand (LBP has that in spades), but the tech limits raised by current-gen technology have largely been un-explored by a matching increase in creative expression. The innovators are few, but as time passes and devs gain more experience, we might see more true masterpieces in a year or two (ex. Psychonauts, which was late in the Xbox/PS2/GCN cycle).

jmaster14656

I'll take smaller teams and less money over huge teams and huge budgets any day.

Sunjammer

Yoshida is on the money ,next gen development for HD machines is slow and painful in Japan and thats hurting a lot the HD consoles ,specially the PS3.

Iberianpower

@Killtacular: Hmm, I see your point. I do value creativity... but the original point is that there's a sweeping generalization about how resistant we are to learning math, and a sweeping generalization about how "them Asian kids" are so much better at math, etc.

Keep in mind, when I was a wee child, there were TV news clips talking about how the Soviet Union would doubtlessly win the Cold War because kids in my generation would rather play videogames than learn math, and the Soviets would produce brighter, sharper engineers than we would. Kind of ironic how it all turned out, isn't it?

BtownDesignGuy

@天:

And what reasoning would he have for doing that? Absolutely none whatsoever

This commentary, or should I say PR spin was solely made to mend the growing discontent of an unsatisfied PS3 fanbase (the guys who are wondering what happened to all those jrpgs I used to play on my ps2, or the "quirky out of these world games" that only those japanese nutheads could produce, the guys asking what happened to the japanese games?)

You may think my post as being harsh, but his isn't the first time Sony has made a commentary of the sort trying to justify the abysmal state of PS3 japanese support (you only have to see the pattern to understand) and this wont be the last. I wont be surprised if tommorow Yoshida came up with even more excuses and more blames on someone or something else as to why the PS3 is performing badly in Japan.

Typical Sony - always blaming everybody else but themselves for their own shortcomings.No, I wont listen anymore.

Logic1

@Amazon_Chris: Me too. People argue over which country makes the best games, but there's also the element of quantity. Right now, the West is putting out more AAA titles.

RPGs: Square-Enix has only released 1 main-series Final Fantasy in 7 (FFXII) years. In that time Bethesda will have released Morrowind, Oblivion, and Fallout 3 (which will be released just two years after Oblivion).

Shooters: Resident Evil 4 was released in 2004, and Capcom won't be releasing Resident Evil 5 until 2009. However, Ifinity Ward will have out a new COD in 2009 just two years after COD4's 2007 release. Epic is releasing Gears of War 2 just 2 years after the original.

Platformers: Award-winning Nintendo has only released 2 Mario console platformers (Sunshine, Galaxy) in 12 years. Whereas, award-winning Insomniac has released 5 Ratchet and Clank titles in just the past 6 years.

Again, the issue isn't quality, it's quantity. And clearly the Japanese need to learn that one good title every 4-6 years isn't good enough anymore. They now have competitors across the globe who not only release great games, but release great games like clockwork.

Lixie

It's funny that Nintendo (and the 3rd parties that decided to focus on it) pretty much never release these whining statements.

I guess being able to finish games in a reasonable time frame and make a profit will do that.

yomachaser

*WHINE WHINE WHINE WHINE

Come on Sony. Where's that old fearlessness to destroy Nintendo and Sega and everybody in your way? Now it's getting beat around like a ragdoll by Xbox. Oh well. I always appreciate a good American effort to game consoles anyhow. Sorta sad to see Sony like this though. And sorta sad still that casuals are taking over the gaming industry. Hardcore all the way, baby!

Shippoyasha

the japanese don't care about the technological aspects of a console. this is why the wii is above all the other consoles because they are offering a new way of play. sony can copy nintendo's wii but no one will buy it because they are merely imitating and don't know what to do with the hardware and software.

i can't believe that sony would blame it on the developers. my god, don't they know that the developers are the ones to make the products, without them you would have nothing.

newave

@beanerific!: "exactly those types of games", my bad.

beanerific!

@shouryuuken: So North American studios like Insomniac, Naughty Dog and Double Fine don't put out products that excel in exactly types of games? Wow, some people are picky.

beanerific!

@fuchikoma:
If we're talking high end graphics, I'd take Square over Pixar any day too... mind you I think Square uses truly absurd detail, but it does seem to work.

fuchikoma

*shakes fist* If you guys start churning out a bunch of boring sandboxes with kitchen sink options, I'm throwing in the towel and hibernating in last-gen for a while until it gets sorted out...

Japan still suffers low self esteem culturally - amazing. They're like Britain in the 60s right now; if anything I think they should be touting their artist and visual designers' skills. I've played games with 10 year old graphics technologically that look way better than games I barely have the tech to run. Odin Sphere, Okami, Team Ninja generally, or even Ragnarok for example.

IMO eastern games are eastern games, western games are western games, and they cater to the home teams' interests first. Japanese devs are just starting to buy into the mythos/meme lately and it's freaking me out...

fuchikoma