Solution: Free games for everyone!!!

A bill of rights isn't really a step in the right direction if you ask me. Because, REALLY, there is no need one in this situation. We're consumers, and we aren't being forced to buy their games. THEY have every right to put DRM their games. Heck, they have the right to put a "one time start-up" limit on their games.

Now, neutral ground: They SHOULD have to put a warning on the game box as to how extensive the DRM is. For example, with the activation code limit. There should be a warning for that, and not one that you have to scour the internet to find.

Finally, These companies should be seeing how they are screwing up. If they don't, they could run the game industry into the ground. It seems that they have the philosophy of "We won't change until we're forced to." Now THIS could run the game industry into the ground.

Indypunk

How many7 different 'bills of rights' have we had so far this year? Can't we come up with some massive amalgamated gamer's Magna Carta or something?

emcake

@orentholjames: Fallout 3 will be an interesting experiment with no DRM. It's already been pirated, but it would have been anyway. The point is, will it be pirated LESS.

Mister_Jack

I just don't get the point of DRM.

It doesn't deter pirates. At all.
-at all-
None. Zero. Zip. NONE.

All it seems to do is deter a used games market, and try to use creepy methods to get users too afraid to download an "illegal" patch, to purchase their games again.

orentholjames

oh boy *gets popcorn*

anyone want some? you don't get charged for taking any ;)

ninjadude14

@Indypunk: Considering they have the right to lock more than half the game's content with Pay DLC (which is nothing more than unlock script for a few dollars) unlocking what's left on the disc...even if it's unpopular with the gaming public, it happens.

The gaming industry is riding a thin line between life and death as it is T_T

masterage

There was a gamer bill of rights on display at PAX this year that had quite a few signatures. Some of the 'rights' on it were downright hilarious. I'm sure other people saw it, I just don't remember what booth it was by..

klogg

The number one thing I think, in the discussion of DRM, is the attitude of "Vote with your wallet". Which, in any other realm, really, would work. But not here. Because then, there'll be no sales, or low sales, or even lower sales, and more massive pirating. Which leads to the conclusion that "Well, it's bein' pirated! Oh well, more DRM that doesn't work!"

orentholjames

The only problem with being 100% DRM-Free is that no matter how good a legitimate user's morals are, the more likely they'll steal even if they think it's wrong.

If you get a song or album off of iTunes (Amazon MP3 ftw) and your friend says "Can I get a copy? I'll bring the CD." You're not going to feel bad about it- but now the person who paid for it is stuck with a DRM copy, while the user who paid nothing gets a DRM-Free copy.

I think that metaphor sums up everything about DRM.
Let's keep hoping someone will come up with a legitimate method of non-intrusive, non-annoying DRM.

Klink

The way I see it, stuff like DRM is a placeholder while they come up with something better. DRM has it's flaws, it's easy to see that; but for the time being, technology is only at the point where it's the best they can do. Eventually they can come up with a fool-proof method of leaving digital content open to users but restricted to others, it's just that that time is not now.

DRM is not the problem here, it's the extent the companies try and take it to.

NeonLight

All of these "Gamer's Bill of Rights" are just dumb. They're part of an entitlement complex that seems to be incredibly childish attempts to change the rules players have agreed to. Not to say that there aren't inadequacies in the existing systems...but most of these things (unsurprisingly) treat game makers as governments instead of businesses. Take for example the idea of owning virtual property. Turning an MMO provider into a property ownership arbitrator...is turning them into a government.

The way to affect these changes is not to simply petition for it; its to, as others have said continuously, vote with your wallet. If you truly believe that, as a gamer, you deserve these things, buy games that support this. If they don't exist, and you truly believe that they're both "correct" principles, and people will pay for a company that supports them, start a company. If that's too hard, quit whining and telling other people what they "should" do because of what you "deserve". You have choice, you have power; you only have to exercise it.

verrius

@verrius: The thing about voting with your wallet is that it doesnt work. If the next big game comes out its either "suffer not playing it and fight for the cause" or "suffer by putting up with DRM and play the thing". Its been like that with almost all things. windows is an example. I love linux and would like to see it do well but seeing as most games are DX I have no choice but to put up with windows.

Cue2

@masterage: what I wonder is do they have the right to complain if you unlock the content thats on the disc via other means since you have bought the digital content already would it be a copyright infringment?

Cue2

DRM doesn't deter piracy at all! I disagree with what someone said.. "The only problem with being 100% DRM-Free is that no matter how good a legitimate user's morals are, the more likely they'll steal even if they think it's wrong."

I think they either steal or they don't. It's a non-issue.
No one's going to think "Well golly! No DRM! Better steal this!".

orentholjames

@Cue2:

Technically, they've got the right to be do that too (And to be mad if you unlock it by other means). But you've got the right to be mad back. Their viewpoint is that when you buy the game, you're not paying for that DLC. You're getting it for free, but it's locked up. Which is true. What sucks about this is that they are taking from the game to make money, which is a rip.

Indypunk

@Mister_Jack: Well, I'm buying Fallout 3. I won't be spending anything on Spore or Crysis: Warhead until its virus like DRM is removed. So, there's your answer.

Seriously, what ever happened to CD in the drive and serial number activation? Sure it was easily cracked, but this current DRM bullshit isn't any safer for the publisher.

Ubersoldat19

They're not actually using DRM to fight piracy, they're using it to shut down the legitimate resale market and circumvent first-sale doctrine as they're criminally greedy. They just have to keep saying it's "for piracy" just like politicians have to keep saying things are "for the children".

Kral2

A gamer bill of rights sounds good to me.
The voting with your wallet tings is doomed to fail because people in general have no taste at all.
No sense for quality. Nothing.
The average gamer knows nothing about DRM.
The average gamer is a consumer of crappy EA or Disney games.
The average gamer doesn't care about physical quality, for instance, barely anyone has protested against broken 360's.
Gamers should be more concerned about quality and the rights they deserve, but they are not.

eman_resu

@Ubersoldat19:
Virus like DRM? I didn't really notice the DRM until someone mentioned it to me and it didn't really even stop me from doing anything.

CreativeCat89

@Mister_Jack: It has been pirated on the 360, NOT the PC yet.

DaFox

@eman_resu: I wouldn't say that they are not concerned more that they have little choice if its a game they want to play. The only thing they can do is buy the thing and complain at the same time which I consider perfectly OK.

Cue2

@Indypunk: Thats crazy how do they get away wih this sort of thing. I'm going to sell people a house but lock up a room with a webcam in it and make no mention of it. if they bust in, well, I'll see them in court.

Cue2

@orentholjames:

Yup. There will always be pirates. Even the most secure and tightwad DRM out there can be cracked. Given enough time and resources, any thing can be broken.

Seriously, less DRM BS more people willing to actually buy the damn game instead of pirating to avoid the DRM.

Mercsenary

@Cue2: Actually, voting with your wallet works fine. Just because you didn't get the result you wanted doesn't mean you should cry about it. Obviously you, and other people who "want" games on Linux don't matter enough; if you did, people would buck up and start making games for it. Stop whining and start being part of the solution; if you actually care about it, start making games with whatever inane requirements you want. No one's forcing you to buy these games don't want but apparently just feel compelled to buy.

verrius

@verrius: Have you lost your mind. "start making games with whatever inane requirements you want." uh yeah right so I should change my career learn to program for a console just because something bothers me and I have no right to complain. Get real. So if something bothers me while I'm making a game for linux I have no right to complain about it I just have to change my career again.

Cue2

@emcake: Agreed. Best example of serious Bill of Rights: Stardock's.

unfathomablej