Sony: PS3 Is A Nice, Shiny, Juicy Red Apple

Sony: PS3 Is A Nice, Shiny, Juicy Red Apple

Despite constant rumours of an imminent PS3 price drop, Sony says the price isn’t the issue. The PS3 is holding its own against the competition. It’s also juicy.

Recently I had the chance to chat with Michael Ephraim, head of Sony Australia’s PlayStation business. Ephraim told me he was happy with PS3 sales, particularly in PAL territories including Australia.

“If you look at where we’re tracking against other consoles… the Wii and the DS, especially during toy catalogues are very strong, they’re definitely selling to a broader consumer base than we currently are. But if you look at our sales compared to a more comparable product in Xbox, in PAL territories we’ve closed the gap in the first half of this year. For a few weeks now we’ve had almost 1:1 sales with Xbox.”

“Clearly they outsold us last quarter of last year when they dropped the price. But this year we’ve brought that back. The PS3 is holding is its own at a very premium price against the Xbox. We’re generally very happy with the sales of the PS3 console.”

I mentioned to Ephraim that Xbox had seen considerable growth recently with the Arcade console, which at $299 RRP is well under half the price of a PS3. Sony has of course experimented with several SKUs since launch – the PS3 has featured 20, 40, 60 and 80GB hard drives as well as various combinations of ports and chips providing PS2 compatibility. I asked Ephraim if not having an equivalent low-end version of the PS3 had hurt them.

“I think what we really have to look at the content. The price point on the console is a valid point. But it’s more about people understanding the value for money with what you get on a PS3 versus a stripped down basic games machine which the Arcade is – there’s no Blu-ray, there are many features that are just not there. So you’re comparing apples and oranges.

“But if you’re selling on the lower end, you need a library of content that is going to appeal to that customer. For example, we have incredible brand equity with Singstar, you know, we have 800,000 mics in Australia alone. Migrating that Singstar PS2 consumer to Singstar PS3 is a factor for the broader take up of our console.”

“You have to look at the catalogue. You can buy the Arcade at $299, but if you’re talking a family purchase, what kind of content is available? That’s where we are extremely confident this year.”

I mentioned a quote from Sony America boss Jack Tretton from E3 this year, where he noted how difficult a year it had been to “sell future technology“. This is when, as I noted on Tuesday, I asked Ephraim whether he was comfortable going into this holiday period with an 80GB PS3 at $699 up against a rival console priced between $299 – $399. Here’s his expanded answer.

“Let’s face it, we’d love to have a lower retail price, but we’re a company that needs to deliver a profitable result. The weakness in the Australian dollar hasn’t helped, you know, from being at almost parity to now being in the 70-plus cents range.

“As far as the model is concerned, we’re comfortable with the 80GB… which is of course upgradeable, so that storage capacity isn’t really a factor. And if you look at our sales where we’re tracking well against our competitor at a premium, I think we have a lot of value that’s just based on consumers understanding what the device can do. As people understand that more, the price becomes less of a factor.

“We have to compare apples to apples, and not apples to pears or whatever, because the PS3 in our mind does a lot more, there’s a lot more content, there’s a lot more diversity of content. As Jack said, it’s hard to sell future technology, and that’s something we’ve experienced here. But as you demo it to people, and show them features and functionality, there’s no one I’ve demoed it to who hasn’t said, ‘Wow, I want one’.

“So there’s a price issue, and there’s an education issue, and there’s the consumer getting their heads around their home entertainment solution, you know, what’s the best box to have sitting in front of the TV. Price will work itself through one day. We’re not overpriced for what we deliver… and with the Arcade, we’re just not comparing apples to apples here.”

Finally, I asked Ephraim if he felt the PS3 was the only apple in the basket.

“Well… it’s a nice apple. A nice, shiny red apple. And it’s juicy.”

I’m interested to hear your thoughts on the price debate. Do you agree that the PS3 isn’t overpriced for what it delivers? Do you think of the PS3 as a juicy red apple? What fruit analogies would you use for all three consoles?


  • “because the PS3 in our mind does a lot more, there’s a lot more content, there’s a lot more diversity of content”

    I’d like to know, do any PS3 owners agree with this?
    And is blu-ray really such an important thing to have? Have blu-ray discs replaced HD? are blu-ray discs cheaper? if neither of those answers is yes than why is having a blu-ray player better?

    • I have a PS3 and a HD tv, and i own 2 blu ray films, im not going to pay twice as much as a regular DVD to see the movie in better resolution

    • I think blu ray is more about forward thinking… did the PS2 in its early days really need DVD drive? No… nearly all the earlier games on that system would have fitted on a CD, but later in its life cycle when they started to push the machine, it became a necessity, and I think you will see the same with having the Blu Ray.

      I am not sticking up for the console…. its a personal choice which one you pick and I believe all three consoles have their own merit and are each excellent in their own unique way! =)

      To be honest I am kind of sick of the whole price argument. I find it odd because we all know sony have made something that is expensive to produce and they take a loss, so to Microsoft probably take a loss as well on each machine, yet the Wii which we all know is actually making a very tasty profit from every machine, and yet the price seems to never go down. Strange that this never seems to get a mention.

      • There are more advantages than just a Blu Ray drive.. but I do get great use out of that.
        If I can, I prefer to purchase a movie on Blu Ray rather than DVD, for me the different seems marginal, but they certainly look better.

    • How bout i put a question to u, no matter what response u got, would u care?

      There’s plenty of ppl happy with their ps3’s, it’s not even a question, ofcourse we agree, we choose it over the 360.

      I see looots of douches thinking they know economics, and know what’s best for a gaming console. The fact is though, if u don’t want wifi, high def movies, web browser, excellent dvd upscaling, great 1st party games, etc, etc then just shutup and be happy with the “better” gaming console u already have.

      There’s ppl like myself who happen to think that the features of the ps3 are not just worth the price point, but even the games on offer are of just better stock, get over it. When are ppl going to learn (microsoft included) that being fuckwits aren’t going to change someone’s opinions of preferences. It just hardens our resolve to just say to u all simply – no, lol.

  • Well one thing is for certain, PS3 does deliver a lot, it’s a blu ray player, a music player, a video player, surfs the internet. Unfortunately they can throw all that out the window because the vast majority of people only know the PS3 as a gaming console, and on that front it pretty much delivers as mush as the xbox does. I think the price issue will boom in the next year if sony does nothing, lets think about it, as it stands right now even the normal (and only) ps3 you can buy in Australia is still almost $150 more expensive than the Xbox elite console

    I understand why The sony boss’s don’t want to compare their machine with the Wii, I wouldn’t either if the wii was selling as much as it is, this “console war” for this generation is over, Wii has won it by a long shot. But I guess its easier to call the Wii some fruity machine and forget it ever existed.

    P.S I got mine for $750 with a game

  • If they could truly make it a one box solution, then I’d be in.

    If it can replace my digital TV set-top box, my PVR, my game console, my blu-ray player, stream MKV’s, avi’s etc. and be enough of a internet solution browser-wise to be able to check my mail and news sites like this, then I’d get one.
    But it has to drop in price a bit, I just can’t justify seven hundred dollars when the arcade I got for $228 from Harvey norman (complete with Halo Wars and some arcade games) plays 95% of the games I want to play. Sony just doesn’t have enough content that I can’t get elsewhwere.
    I really want a one box solution, with one remote but I can only get that at the moment with a HTPC.

    Sony if you are going to go to the high-end and claim your machine does more, then it has to actually do more! Just being able to play HD discs isn’t enough of a differentiation. Open it up to become a true media centre and I’ll pay $700 tomorrow.

    • Well it *can* do most of the things you mentioned.
      There’s the Play TV accessory which will allow you to record and watch HD digital TV when it comes out here; which will be when our HD digital broadcasting standard specification…thing… is finalised. (Though apparently you can just buy the one that’s available in the UK, ship it over and it works fine here)
      You can already stream AVI’s, as the PS3 natively handles them, without any new software(windows media player can stream them fine) and you can stream MKV’s from your computer using PS3 media server(which is free 🙂
      If you have a fairly fast connection(it’s not as fast at loading pages as most PC browsers, but eh…) you can use the built in browser for most things… youtube has a specialised site for PS3 users I think… Unfortunately iView doesn’t work and unless you get the chatpad thing or a bluetooth keyboard commenting would take ages(but reading sites like this is fine.

      There seems to be a lot of buzz about Sony discontinuing the old 80GB model and rumours about the slim PS3, this coupled with the fact that apparently the manufacturing costs are down 70% and apparently they’re announcing something special at gamescom (I heard August 18th mentioned) could definitely mean a slim ps3 and/or a price cut 🙂

  • Atm for me,
    It doesnt deliver much more than the 360 besides the better exclusives for this year.

    Later when i get a new 50″ 1080p TV then it will mean a lot to me. Currently a 720p 32″ doesnt look too bad playing DVD’s. But Blu-Ray on a large screen is awsome. Plus i dont have to pay to play online, I get Free wi fi and one thing that can be over looked

    Unlike Microsofts overpriced periferals.

  • I plurged out on both consoles. I just use the 360 to play games, but I use the PS3 for games, movies, and music. The 360 “online” experience is much better.

  • Peter Richards

    You right about the HTPC you can build these for around the 700 mark these days

    and for a little bit more you can have blueray drive & HDTV with Windows 7 coming out soon it will be even better

    i would like to buy a ps3 myself but @ 699 no thanks my 360 plays everything i need it to and the longer i wait for the ps3 to drop the cheaper the few games i wanna get become

  • You can buy the Arcade at $299, but if you’re talking a family purchase, what kind of content is available?

    Just of the top of my head…

    SceneIt?, SceneIt? Box Office Smash, Lips, any Lego games, Rockband, Guitar Hero, Viva Pinata, plus the countless downloadable games in Arcade…

    Face it Sony, you fucked up.

    Stop making excuses, stop trying to say you’re still on top, and simply reduce the price and take it on the chin.

    • Yep. Agreed.
      Its always excuses to justify their position.
      The Xbox world (developers, publishers, gamers, owners, etc) dont even discuss or compare the PS3 now. For the first couple of years it was all about competition between the two. But now, Xbox world is like “PS3? Meh. . .”

      • Oh, but the PS3 world is still wrapped up in this one sided flame war against its rivals.
        The rest of us have moved on.

    • Every Time a comment as stupid as that is made a PS3 fanboy is born.

      Those Exclusive games you mentioned are of such bad quality anyone who bought them should have bought a Wii. Thats the real family console.

      Have you seen the PSN store?? All the quailty games that are 4 players?

      • “…should have bought a Wii.” Ahaha! Well said.

        Sony haven’t really fucked up with the PS3. Considering the PS3’s lifetime sales aren’t far behind the 360’s, I’d say they’re doing pretty damn well.

        Not to mention, the 360 has been out for an extra year, plus you have to wonder how many of those lifetime sales are RRoD replacements. PSN now has more titles for download than XBLA, and have more innovative, interesting titles showing up.

        Sony know what they’re doing. Some teething problems, but they’re starting to kick ass. Meanwhile, it seems Microsoft are too busy trying to flood the multiple markets by turning what was pretty much a hardcore gamers machine into a bloated casual gamers dream machine.

        I would (and lightly will) also point out the fact you pay what, AUD$80 a year for XBL service, which now has advertising all over the place?

        PSN = free… and we’ve only JUST seen the first advertising pop up in WipeoutHD… (which sucks!)

        Either way, Sony aren’t doing too badly at all. If everyone could stop being fanboys and realise that there is never going to be an end to the console wars…

  • Yes the PS3 is a huge ripoff, The PlayStation Au boss is talking shit.

    The AUD buys 84 USD cents ATM, not 70.
    The US MSRP for the PS3 is $399.99 USD and that equals $476 AUD!! and then you have the fact that it costs sony about $350 AUD to make each PS3!!

    So for each PS3 sony sells it will be making around $200 to $325 (based off if you want to add costs that have nothing to do with the hardware itself and could be covered by other things like the $20 odd bucks that sony makes on most game sales).

    And don’t try and drag the PS3 into a pissing match with the 360 over what stuff (like Wi-Fi) each console comes included with, Because 1. you don’t need any of that to play games and 2. A gaming PC will piss all over the PS3 with not only how more powerful it is but also how much more it can do and thats for a PC around the same price as a PS3!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • If I had bought a 360 instead of a PS3 a couple of years back I would have spent a lot more money on it by now for the luxury of playing online.

      Comparing a PC to the PS3? The PC is actually much more like a 360. There are very few games that are “exclusive” to 360 that I cant play better on my sweet gaming rig. The PS3 library is much more differentiated from PC than the 360 and so I play games like Fat Princess (which rocks, btw) that I cant get anywhere else. So my PS3 actually compliments my options rather than duplicating them.

      Add to this the fact that my PS3 runs cool and quiet while my mates 360s whine like an aircon. I know one guy who has a PS3 blow up on him. I have lost count of the guys who have had 360s die, some of them more than once.

      I know a lot of people want to somehow declare one console is the better one that everyone should have, but I think this is the wrong attitude. I like my PS3 and have been very happy indeed owning one since the early days. Im sure there are many happy 360 owners.

      • “Add to this the fact that my PS3 runs cool and quiet while my mates 360s whine like an aircon.”

        Andy, this hasn’t been an issue for a year or more now. My 360 runs no more loudly than my Panasonic projector. The only time I hear it is when a game DVD is playing, and that’s only if I haven’t installed the game to the drive.

        Earlier 360s were terrible with noise, but not the ones sold these days.

      • Just want to say, I agree with you in terms of ‘exclusivity’. Coming from a PC gamer, xbox360’s exclusive games are quite limited. And that’s where PS3 and wii shines with their own exclusive games. And that is why I bought both PS3 and wii instead of xbox360.

        Until xbox360 can make good 1st party games that I can’t play anywhere else, then I’ll get it, otherwise, I’m going to enjoy PS3 and wii for the time being.

      • oh womble, thats the whole point. i bought a ps3 early on and its still running perfectly. by your logic i would be on my 2nd 360 by now.

    • your forgetting Australian import tax. which can be up to $200 AU per unit. On top of this you also have GST. Plus Sony is Japanese not American. Last I checked Japan doesn’t trade in US dollars.

  • I could easily justify spending the $699 if they only released a few things like MKV video support which would make this more than just a games system, but a home theatre accessory as well.

  • Well to be fair the dollar fluctuates a lot, would you be happy if they jacked the price every time ours drops?

    Even at 75c which is a fair price for the dollar, (we don’t sit above that for much of the year and are often below it )the PS3 price comes to close enough to $530, then you have to add GST which takes it to about $580, so here it probably should be selling at $599 instead of $699.
    You can find it at retailers quite easily for around $650 so we are paying about $50 – $100 too much compare to the US.

    That should be fixed straight away, the only problem is that the PS3 really needs to be $499 to get any traction, and at $399 it would probably sell like hotcakes.

    • Peter writes:

      “But seriously the 360 should come with wi-fi, over $100 for a wifi connector for the 360 is a complete rip.”

      You are correct that the wifi dongle is a rip-off. It can’t be justified. (But then I guess we also have to look at the prices of core peripherals on all consoles, such as controllers. Ouch!)

      However, I’m glad that the device itself is an option. It helps keep down the price of the Arcade unit, which helps put HD console gaming in to more homes.

      • Actually there is a justification for the 360’s wifi adapter being so bloody expensive. It runs 802.11 a b & g. That means it has basically 2 NICs in one, one to service the 2.4ghz band for B & G and one to serve the 5GHz band for A. You basically get the 2 adapters in one.

        Now personally I think given the lack of adoption for A, including that in the adapter was a mistake but from what I can gather, they wanted to make sure a non-tech savvy consumer could buy an adapter that simply worked with whatever they might happen to have.

        Does the PS3 support 802.11a? I’ve never really read up on it

    • Yes i agree peter, but not just the wifi adaptor is over priced.

      The headset, hard drive, the controllers not coming with batterys? I have to buy a charge kit.
      All the extras you need to buy for a 360 is stupid.

      • “I have to buy a charge kit.”

        I never bought one, it’s a waste of money for me. I just use the same rechargeable batteries that I use for my cameras, keyboards and other gizmos. One charge usually lasts about a week, or about 4 days if I’m using the headset a lot.

        And for someone in a dorm or bedroom where they have a PC, the wireless isn’t needed at all.

        They could drop the XBL price though. But, they won’t. That’s a huge earner for them.

      • But what about when you neeeed those things??
        What happens then? Microsoft bends you over your wallet. Ps3 its like oh wow i didnt know this was here, how convenient.

      • ” Ps3 its like oh wow i didnt know this was here, how convenient.”

        Erm, for $700 it had bloody well better be there already, no?

        It’s not “convenient” to have to pay one (high) price for an option that you may or may not need. If I really need a recharger (which I do not) then I’ll fork out $20, if that. (MS is not the only supplier of such devices.)

        But it will be MY choice. I don’t need a recharger, so why should I have to pay for one as part of the package?

        Sony need to provide options, and lower the price.

  • I’ve got a PS3, 360 and a Wii.

    Anyone who tells you that there’s a major difference between the PS3 and 360 is a fool. There are good games on both. Cross platform games are generally better on the 360, but the PS3 has some good exclusives like LBP. XBL costs money, but it’s a better gaming network. Apart from that, it comes down to price.

    But anyone who tells you that the PS3 isn’t overpriced is also a fool. It most certainly is, for those people who don’t WANT to have to pay for Blu-ray. For your average consumer who wants a games console, the PS3 is waaay overpriced relative to the 360.

    .mkv support would be greatly welcome on both machines.

    Oh, and PC gamers? Please, do everyone a favour and shut the fuck up already with your trolling. I don’t want to play PC games in the lounge room or home cinema. That’s what consoles are for.

      • “Clearly you’ve never hooked a good PC up to a HD TV and played Fallout 3 on max settings.”

        Not Fallout specifically, but you’re wrong on the other counts.

        Look, some people — a lot of them it turns out — do not want PC gaming in their lounge room. If you do, fine. Knock yourself out.

        But the rest of us don’t want Windows in the lounge room, nor keyboards, mice, mice pads, nor multiples of these devices for all players. That’s we we have consoles as WELL AS PCs.

        We all know that PC gaming provides better graphics. Duh? But we don’t want to pay the price for those graphics in a lounge room setting.

        Banging on the PC Gaming drum is just boring. Get over it.

  • I’ve often thought “wow, I want one” but my “mind” cannot see past that price tag.

    I have had long, hard staring contests at the PS3, giving serious thought to buying one for the exclusive titles I’m missing out on.

    The problem is, that these staring contests normally happen in video game stores, where I could also pick up half a dozen 360 games for the same price.

  • the ps3 is only over-priced if you purchase at full retail. i bought mine (40gig) in 07 for $570. i now have all the consoles and can honestly say, i would much prefer to be using my ps3 than anything else. i use it for games, music pics and streaming movies. yes even mkv’s. all you need is ps3 media server setup on your pc. its free and piss easy to use. granted the media center looks great on the 360 but unfortunately thats all it does. it cant play any of my avi’s let alone an mkv. as for my blu-ray collection… it is starting to grow. most BR movies can be bought for around the same price as a dvd. maybe an extra dollar or 2 here and there. but, thats what you get for wanting quality. i hate playing online on the 360 as there are just morons and children playing!! i spose thats what happens when you drop the price that much. you end up with hill billies and kids acting like fools and wrecking your gaming experience. the ps3 however seems to attract a better class of people. you can actually have fun on their. yep ok i cant be playin cod and talk to someone whoes playin killzone. luckily i dont care. i have a mobile phone and if i want to talk to that person i will call them. oh sorry hill billies probably dont know what a mobile phone is. and surely cant afford one…
    i just dont like seeing the ps3 getting so much shit dished onto it! it IS a way better machine and does twice as much as the 360 does. most people use all the features in it too. i know i do. if you dont like it then just move along onto your hill billie machine and enjoy halo… yeah i tried that, wow what a terrible game!!! you guys really need to save up so you can play a real shooter like killzone 2!!! that is what a shooter is meant to be like!

    • “most BR movies can be bought for around the same price as a dvd”

      Where are you buying your BD titles from?

      In my experience, BD titles are about 1.5x to 2x as expensive as DVD.

      It’s very easy to find bargain-bin prices for 6 month old DVDs. I haven’t seen the same thing for BD.

      • On release JB Hi-Fi’s Blu-ray discs are usually $1 or 2 above the price of the DVD version. I picked up the new Friday the 13th on Blu-ray for $29.98 – same price as DVD

        However, as you said, there are no bargains for 6 month old titles yet

    • “you guys really need to save up so you can play a real shooter like killzone 2!!! that is what a shooter is meant to be like!”

      Brad, I think you need to play games more. Seriously dude, Killzone 2 is ok, but it’s almost extremely repetitive. It’s a bit better looking than Gears of War 2, but that’s about it.

      I think the reason so many Sony fanboys idolized KZ2 is because they simply didn’t have a lot to compare it with. I play it, and it’s ok, but there are a LOT of “ok” games out there.

      More importantly, KZ2 has not sold systems. The game itself has only sold a fraction of what its competitors have done. It still hasn’t even sold as many games as Halo 3 had PRE-ORDERS!!!

      Buying a $700 console for KZ2 would be crazy. And clearly, not enough people are that crazy.

      Drop the price, Sony.

      • Im sorry??
        The ps3 has now got a better library than the 360. You have 2 exclusives that 360 fanboys fall back on. Halo 3 and Gears. COD 4 is better than both of them. Killzone 2 is better than COD 4 (in some respects)

        Halo just has fanboys and is so overrated.
        And when did this become about sales??? So Okami, Ico and Shadow of the colossus sucked becasue they didnt have the same amount of pre orders as Halo 3??

  • I am NOT buying a PS3, until it drops in price. Im not paying 600 bucks plus more for controllers and games.

    $400 is my sweet point. Im still waiting for Final Fantasy. When 13 and VS 13 come out it will be decision time and ill decide between 360 and the ps3

  • “Let’s face it, we’d love to have a lower retail price, but we’re a company that needs to deliver a profitable result. The weakness in the Australian dollar hasn’t helped, you know, from being at almost parity to now being in the 70-plus cents range”

    That’s funny. Because he said a little while ago here:

    “Also, for the history of Sony Computer Entertainment, we report to London. Compared to Europe and the UK, we’re right in line. We can have an endless argument about who do you compare price with: US or Europe. If you compare to Europe, our price is spot on.”

    Well if I follow that line of reasoning the UK to AU conversion rate has stayed pretty much the same for the past 12 months yet in the UK the PS3 is 300 pounds RRP which is roughly $600 AU.

    So does he just change his line of argument when it suits him or have I fundamentally mis-understood something in his contradictory statements?

  • I’ve been extremely happy with my PS3. I use it for allot more than games. Watching BR movies, vidzone Friday night and sat/sun mornings. Streaming movies/music via PS3 Media server.
    We have a 360 in the house (housemates) and the only thing that IMO keeps it on the same page as the PS3 is the online community. The PS3’s online is so sterile and lifeless.
    However as previously mentioned he has had to dish out allot of money on peripherals and add-ons to bring it close to the PS3’s capability.
    The main things that sealed the deal for me:
    – Out of the box features
    – Exclusives
    – Upgrade capability (HDD)
    – Blu Ray capability

  • the PS3 online community is great! i have started playing Metal Gear Online recently and i cant beleive its taken me so long, the guys are amazing in the aussie servers their real friendly, helpful, and just amazing fun to play with

    its actually shocking after playing FPS online on PC with fuckheads my whole life (cut my teeth on CS 1.3 beta)

    i got my PS3 at launch for $1000 and sold my kick ass gaming rig to do so and have never looked back

    the whole “price issue” is really simple:

    people who cant afford a PS3

    want one

    because its good

  • As an ex reatail sales person Ive always sold PS3s based on value..

    To get the same value in the 360 costs more money than what you get out of the box in a PS3..

    However.. as and owner of all current consoles I must say its my 360 that gets all the use as a media server and a games machine.. the PS3 rarely gets turned on.. all my online gaming is done on PC..

    • dude what planet are you on PC gaming died about 3 years ago, no one cares about it anymore .
      and sell yer PS3 to someone who will appreciate it ya dick.

      in every way it has benefits over xbox 3fixme,bar one xbox is cheaper and it fucking shows

      • PC gaming is very much still alive. You really cant beat using a KB and mouse. Those who complain are the ones who don’t have a PC capable of playing games, or fanboys.

  • simple answer, those who say its overpriced are those who don’t want to spend the money for it and probably wouldnt use it to its full potential, anyone who does want it and use its true potential wouldnt mind the steep price. can you think of a cheaper combination that can play blu-rays, stream music and movies, connect to the net and play high quality games all for under $700? the price is justifiable, but it should be closer to the exchange rate with the US now

  • the PS3 is slightly overprices IMO, however it’s not just the hardware, games for the PS3 also seem to run about $20 (au) more expensive than 360 games, and they have mandatory installations that you can’t skip.

    I love my PS3, I just love my 360 more 🙂

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