Sunrise Tomorrow At 8.10am: Seamus And The ACL Discuss The Oslo Attacks

78 responses to “Sunrise Tomorrow At 8.10am: Seamus And The ACL Discuss The Oslo Attacks”

1. 

   706

   July 25, 2011 at 6:02 pm

   Good luck Seamus. I don’t think I could ever do something like this, I don’t know how to deal with such utter stupidity. I think it would just degenerate into a screaming match if I tried.

   Reply
2. 

   Aidan

   July 25, 2011 at 6:05 pm

   That’ll be a barrel of fun.

   I trust Sunrise will treat the issue with all the thoughtfulness it warrants?

   Reply
   1. 

      Squidd

      July 25, 2011 at 7:46 pm

      hahahahahahahahaha, good one

      Reply
   2. 

      Trent

      July 26, 2011 at 2:00 pm

      Seems they didn’t need to, they just let Saemus speak a rational argument, and then cut to Jim Wallance making an absolute ass of himself.

      Reply
3. 

   Velnica

   July 25, 2011 at 6:05 pm

   Best of luck Seamus! Show em gamers are normal people too!

   Reply
4. 

   NegativeZero

   July 25, 2011 at 6:05 pm

   This can’t end well 🙁

   Reply
5. 

   geegee

   July 25, 2011 at 6:07 pm

   insert ****storm here

   Reply
6. 

   The Cracks

   July 25, 2011 at 6:09 pm

   @ Seamus – don’t let Wallace bait you into saying anything he can use. But you probably already know that, because you are a beast.

   The fact that Seamus needs to go onto the show at all shows just how borked the media is.

   Reply
   1. 

      The Cracks

      July 25, 2011 at 6:11 pm

      Also, ask if he’s personally killed anyone during his SAS/army days.
      Though that might be a bit too inflammatory.

      Reply
7. 

   Alinos

   July 25, 2011 at 6:11 pm

   eh like always Seamus will own the ACL even though they will be given 10 times the screen time.

   Reply
8. 

   Braaains

   July 25, 2011 at 6:11 pm

   Make sure you hammer home the point as often as possible that the guy is a Christian, then demand the ACL justify their own religion if they’re going to demand you make some justification for violent videogames.

   Reply
   1. 

      thyco

      July 25, 2011 at 6:25 pm

      Actually Make sure you hammer in the fact that his type is one of the types of people that the ACL actually speaks for besides the normal Flanders and Helen Jovejoys.

      Reply
   2. 

      crotchdot

      July 25, 2011 at 6:48 pm

      I agree, if they’re going to pick a random claim in his manifesto to point to and argue that is the reason behind the shooting, then why not the fact he’s a right-wing fundamentalist Christian (rhetorical question, we all know why)?

      I’d also be interested to know if ex-SAS Jim Wallace has ever played a Modern Warfare game, because the idea a videogame could train anyone to commit mass murder is laughable to… well, anyone that’s ever played a shooter, I’m willing to wager. If he has, ask him how it compares to actually shooting a real person.

      Reply
   3. 

      Rupert

      July 25, 2011 at 7:03 pm

      where’s the damn +1 button for this post. You’ve got it spot on.

      Reply
   4. 

      mccawsome

      July 25, 2011 at 7:10 pm

      I think Seamus should just ask “if this guy was a Muslim terrorist (as opposed to a fundamentalist Christian Terrorist) would we even be discussing video games?”

      Reply
   5. 

      Peter

      July 25, 2011 at 10:25 pm

      Actually make sure the guy is a Christian to begin with. I did some quick digging and can’t seem to find anything solid.

      Reply
9. 

   VGP

   July 25, 2011 at 6:14 pm

   I hope they don’t electronically add flames and devil horns around Seamus, ala, Mayor Quimby.

   Reply
10. 

    WOJAus

    July 25, 2011 at 6:15 pm

    Jesus….what is there to discuss? Nothing! It’s a non-bloody-issue!
    The ACL are just stirring shit.
    Literally millions of people play WoW and CoD – why aren’t they all going out killing people too?
    Because that has NOTHING to do with what happened!

    Reply
11. 

    Grandmaster B-Funk

    July 25, 2011 at 6:16 pm

    okay, i’m so pissed off, look how god damn leading the sunrise page is

    “Do you believe there should be concerns about video games following revelations from the Norway killer, Anders Behring Breivik, that he used the game “Modern Warfare” as training for his massacre?”

    THERE IS NO PROOF THAT HE USED THE GAME FOR “TRAINING”, ALSO, HE LIKED HUNTING, THATS MORE TRAINING THAN A VIDEO GAME, SEAMUS, PLEASE PERFORM A VERBAL FATALITY TOMORROW MORNING, OKAY?!!

    Reply
    1. 

       P3t3

       July 25, 2011 at 7:20 pm

       He wrote in the manifesto that is attributed to him that he did consider modern warfare 2 as training. I have personally played MW1 but not 2 but I can see how the mission in 2 where you have the option to kill fleeing civilians at the airport may have been considered training for him. But it is certainly no simulation. Personally I didn’t buy the game because of that level.

       Reply
    2. 

       Dark_Templar

       July 25, 2011 at 10:49 pm

       Why not a real spine ripping fatality, increasing the irony of the situation due to MK being banned, then Koschie can pop his head in the corner and go “toastie!” for good measure.

       Reply
12. 

    SunSkorpion

    July 25, 2011 at 6:21 pm

    The fact they still try to make the connection is frustrating, you dont see people up in arms because football seems to correlate with numerous forms of bad behaviour. Its not causal, end of story.

    Reply
13. 

    THEFARKINCHAMP

    July 25, 2011 at 6:22 pm

    my money is on Seamus

    Reply
14. 

    thyco

    July 25, 2011 at 6:23 pm

    at least sunrise has been mostly on our side though when its come to the R18 debate. Infact i remember Sunrise being more on the Side Fiona Patterson’s Sex party in general.

    Reply
15. 

    uninformed christian parent

    July 25, 2011 at 6:29 pm

    Bah I’m gonna be driving to TAFE at that time 🙁 Best of luck, Seamus!

    Reply
16. 

    Glen

    July 25, 2011 at 6:34 pm

    I can’t think of anything that sums my thoughts up better than an internet meme… ITS A TRAP!

    Reply
17. 

    Dean

    July 25, 2011 at 6:48 pm

    This really dissapoints me. Having Seamus go up against the ACL on this matter gives the public the appearence they both have an equal evidence backed point of view. When in actual fact it is nothing of the sorts.
    For me its a rocket scientist up against a guy who thinks he found alien technlogy in his back shed and should be heard on it’s effectivness.

    Reply
18. 

    Trjn

    July 25, 2011 at 6:57 pm

    If it were me, I’d be making a point of how shockingly similar the ACL’s views are to those of that bastard. Videogames are simply irrelevant here and we should make it clear that the ACL are only trying to drive their agenda. They are shameless, fear-mongering twats and the less respect the public gives them the better.

    Reply
19. 

    fishonthecarpet

    July 25, 2011 at 7:05 pm

    I wouldn’t suggest it, but it would be amusing to see the response if Seamus was to point out that Anders Behring Breivik was a Christian.

    Reply
20. 

    Zac Farraher

    July 25, 2011 at 7:08 pm

    Aww, I’ll be getting ready for school but I’m definitely record this tomorrow.

    Reply
21. 

    Seegrey

    July 25, 2011 at 7:11 pm

    BRB gonna go skin the neighbours cat for a new shirt like wow taught me!

    Wait, I’m not an idiot.

    Seamus, gl;hf doesn’t work here, so play hard and destroy them instead. Remember that games can indeed be triggers, but it’s not the “game” aspect that’s the issue – it’s an individualised trigger, and could be anything from a certain string of words, to a game, to a kitchen appliance(more commonly passive experiance, like a movie or book, than one that requires you to make choices, though). Once the trigger is found, the psychotic episode goes off; the fact it was a game is irrelevant.

    And push the Christian thing. That might wake a few people up and help solve more problems than just those related to gaming.

    Reply
22. 

    JPhillips

    July 25, 2011 at 7:11 pm

    This is so silly, does anybody remember the birth of rock &/or roll? If memory serves me correctly it received about the same amount of negative attention when it first became the dominant form of media (or a sub-genre in media to be more precise, but my statement still stands).

    Reply
23. 

    Ruen

    July 25, 2011 at 7:12 pm

    It really disappoints me that this has been allowed to get this far. . . That Sheamus has to go on national television to defend a point of view hopefully the majority of the population already agrees with against blatant fear mongering arrogance.

    Reply
24. 

    Femto

    July 25, 2011 at 7:13 pm

    The ACL are out of touch with mainstream society and reality and as harsh as this may sound I think they are not even worth talking to. The more people acknowledge them the more chances they will be called upon for interviews. Jim Wallace never should have been called upon to speak to the media again after he Tweeted “Just hope that as we remember Servicemen and women today we remember the Australia they fought for – wasn’t gay marriage and Islamic!” If anybody were to say this in a workplace they would be sacked but for some reason Jim Wallace can spout this crap and still get newspaper and Tv interviews. Good luck trying to REASON with Jim.

    Reply
25. 

    Anno-Nomis

    July 25, 2011 at 7:21 pm

    Good luck Seamus. Show the damn media who’s boss. I’m very tired of seeing the media blaming every violent act on games. Has it ever occurred to the media that your everyday Hollywood movie also has the potential to fill these criminals with ideas, too?

    All the media has shown me is their PATHETIC ability to make deviated “news”, and their lack of providing the world PROPER and informative news.

    Reply
26. 

    Kyall

    July 25, 2011 at 7:23 pm

    MORE: Reading some more news about the manifesto, he says training with an assault rifle with a red optic sight is recommended.

    I’m going to presume no one knows how effective a reflective sight like that is. When you have one, you don’t have to align your sights with the target before you fire, with something like that it’s dot on body and pull the trigger. It makes a weapon much more deadly by the fact that minute inaccuracies due to alignment difficulties are eliminated.

    How the fuck did this guy get his hand on an automatic rifle with a reflective sight; and fragmenting rounds no less. His victims never had a chance.

    Reply
27. 

    Steve0410

    July 25, 2011 at 7:23 pm

    Lookee here, so many perks!

    /jks

    Reply
28. 

    Trjn

    July 25, 2011 at 7:29 pm

    He was planning his attacks for nearly a decade. MW2 was released less than 2 years ago.

    Not really hard to see the flaw in trying to place the blame on that game.

    Reply
29. 

    Marathon

    July 25, 2011 at 7:36 pm

    Sigh… this is going to end badly. Good luck Seamus.

    Reply
30. 

    Gus

    July 25, 2011 at 7:36 pm

    I think it’s shameful that the ACL would resort to something using such a cheap shot. Using the Norway massacre as a platform for their argument is beyond deplorable.

    At the risk of sounding insensitive, this could not have come at a worst time. The already touchy topic of the classification system, coupled with the actions of a pathetic human being, pretty much ensure that the order of the day will consist of ill-conceived arguments and hasty decisions.

    The R18+ debate is an important one that should be argued rationally. Anything other than that is utterly irresponsible. It is a decision that should be made in spite of these events, rather than because of them.

    Reply
31. 

    Luke

    July 25, 2011 at 7:36 pm

    like 7/10 people aged over 15 play video games.

    7/10 people aren’t becoming psychopaths running around smashing things and slaughtering people for the sake of it. Clearly this individual had a serious, pre-existing mental disorder.

    people were going on shooting sprees years ago, and of course they will blame video games, not his religion, they won’t say a single phrase about it.

    And thats just further poof that playing video games means SFA in 99.9% of cases.

    Its like accusing ALL middle eastern people of being terrorsist.

    Its like accusing everyone who likes rap music a drug user / dealer

    Its just absolutely retarded, nonsensical garbage spewing from someones mouth, what do they do for a job you ask? why, they sit behind desks and listen to other paranoid ignorant fools exaggerate their stories. or read their exaggerated crap.

    Reply
32. 

    Stevorooni

    July 25, 2011 at 7:40 pm

    I look forward to Seamus being cut off and misinterpreted.

    Reply
33. 

    Aidan

    July 25, 2011 at 7:41 pm

    I have to disagree, with respect.

    The idea that he’d ‘train’ himself to ignore civilian suffering via a video game seems a bit far-fetched.

    Isn’t it more likely that he was just batshit crazy, completely devoid of empathy for people he hated and so consumed by paranoid and illogical delusions that killing the ministers and youth of the government he opposed made perfect sense to him?

    I won’t pretend to even begin to understand the mind of someone so deranged, but blaming it on a level in a video game that was released 6 years after his initial decision to commit to a more violent path is a little premature.

    Reply
34. 

    Stephen

    July 25, 2011 at 7:41 pm

    By the way, I understand Jim Wallace is ex-army? They’re a fairly violent bunch aren’t they?

    Reply
    1. 

       The Insufferable Señor Steengo

       July 26, 2011 at 1:25 am

       No, they’re actually really nice. Back when I did basic we sat around playing paddy cake and then later we all went out for Cold Rock. The Drill Instructor had some really nice things to say about me, too!

       Reply
35. 

    Kyall

    July 25, 2011 at 7:45 pm

    If the ACL give you any problems, tell them to watch the videos breivik uploaded to youtube, and ask them if they see any content in them, that didn’t come first from conservative, christian media.

    Reply
36. 

    lame3190

    July 25, 2011 at 7:55 pm

    Seamus – just a tip, dont punch him. It wont go over well at all. Just saying.

    Reply
37. 

    Thrade

    July 25, 2011 at 7:56 pm

    http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2084895,00.html

    Reply
    1. 

       Thrade

       July 25, 2011 at 8:08 pm

       The ACL reallllly should be trying to play this one down.
       We normally think their a bunch of attention seekers who make no sense, but THIS time the guy is a self confessed Christian extremist who confessed to doing it because he hates Muslims.
       I mean … c’mon, how do you stretch to games from there in any way that isn’t going to bite you in the ass.

       Reply
38. 

    Asuron

    July 25, 2011 at 8:31 pm

    Seamus I can only hope you restrain yourself from yelling at him, for his disgusting use of such a tragedy to further the ACL’s own agenda.

    The stunning hypocrisy in condemning his actions while making racist remarks about Muslims on ANZAC day and other similar racist actions.
    How far are off are they truly, when they want similar actions to what he wanted to acheive, the only difference being they want less extreme measures to do so, but are no less racist and prejudiced than the man who committed these atrocities

    Reply
39. 

    Chris

    July 25, 2011 at 8:40 pm

    The fact this is being brought up again really is a blood-boiler. If anyone has been reading news that keeps it’s bias to a minimum will understand that motivation behind the attacks were right-wing ideals and Christian fundamentalism, so why aren’t we putting the blame on the ACL for the for once…i.e. stirring up hate and intolerance towards people (anti-Muslim ideals). Surely that has more effect on society than bloody WoW or MW2.

    While it is arguable that video games could have inspired how to carry out the massacre, from Breivik’s alleged quote of using MW2 as a simulator, it takes far more than that to find reason to carry out the attacks outlined in his 1’500 page Christian extremist document.

    Shouldn’t have to defend ourselves against the ACL for being gamers, but be questioning the ACL instead of their ideals of trying to manipulate politics with Christian ideals that would stir upo society much more than a video game.

    Reply
40. 

    Simon G

    July 25, 2011 at 8:51 pm

    I hope it’s going to be on youtube.

    Reply
41. 

    Dutch

    July 25, 2011 at 9:14 pm

    Best of luck to Seamus. The Twitter conversation between him and Dr Limimi has been fascinating.

    Reply
42. 

    Raif

    July 25, 2011 at 9:40 pm

    Best point: black ops sold 16 mil, that’s a 1 in 16 million chance someone would do something like.
    Don’t use this point, it’s probably bullcrap

    Reply
43. 

    Milbo

    July 25, 2011 at 9:54 pm

    Good Luck Seamus,

    I know it might be tricky to do so in the heat of the moment on live TV, but please point out to the Australian Christian Lobby that while the shooter was indeed a gamer, HE WAS ALSO A CHRISTIAN FUNDAMENTALIST!

    Clearly his crime was motivated more by his religion than his hobby. You don’t need to stray too far down this slippery road though, just use it to point out the difference between ‘causality’ and ‘coincidence’.

    Reply
44. 

    Shepard

    July 25, 2011 at 10:10 pm

    This guy has been planning this for longer than MW3 has been out /story

    Reply
45. 

    Tezz

    July 25, 2011 at 11:09 pm

    just remember, never interrupt your enemy while he is making a mistake.

    Reply
46. 

    Peter

    July 26, 2011 at 12:04 am

    I’d just like to point out to everyone that he cannot be considered a “fundamentalist Christian”; his actions quite clearly go against the Christian ethos.

    I’m a Christian and I like video games (violent ones are fine by me), but to do something like that is in complete violation of what it is to be a Christian.

    Clearly and sadly, the man was quite deranged and that’s the cause of this. Not the video games, not the “religion”.

    Reply
47. 

    Stapler Pirate

    July 26, 2011 at 12:11 am

    I am kind of sure he learnt how to fire a gun from… Ummmm I don’t know… Hunting, mandatory military service, gun clubs, practice at his farm.

    But nope… Clearly dem vidya gaems are to blame.

    Reply
48. 

    Bookbuster

    July 26, 2011 at 1:23 am

    Ask for a show of hands in the room as to who’s actually been taught to kill people and gone through a series of highly extensive and effective violence desensitization programs. Go on, I dare you. The only one will be the non-gaming but former SAS Jimbo.

    Reply
49. 

    The Insufferable Señor Steengo

    July 26, 2011 at 1:34 am

    Here’s a nice little quote I wouldn’t mind Seamus reciting:

    “But the biggest problem then was that there were no options for me at all. There was no known armed culturally conservative, or Christian, anti-Jihad movement.”
    — Anders Behring Breivik

    He wasn’t looking for a Video Gamer movement. He wasn’t looking for Violent Film movement. He wasn’t looking to join a god damn bridge club. This despicable person aspired, for over a decade, to turn arms on his fellow countrymen to fulfill his own twisted, violent Christian extremist cum conservative ideology. Video games have nothing to answer for and the opportunistic scumbags at the ACL should be ashamed of themselves for needlessly politicising the tragedy while Norway and the rest of the world are still grieving.

    Reply
50. 

    striper

    July 26, 2011 at 2:31 am

    Hitler never played video games and he was responsible for the deaths of over 17 million people.

    Reply
51. 

    Cray

    July 26, 2011 at 8:22 am

    Just wanted to say, Seamus did a fantastic job. He presented his arguement in a calm and methodical manner, and hit where it hurt.

    The ACL guy was on the defensive and his arguement just completely fell apart.

    At least that’s how I saw it.

    Reply
52. 

    Candi

    July 26, 2011 at 8:26 am

    Congratulations Seamus on your informative and well structured (although very brief!) argument!!! So proud to hear your intellectual comment momentarily stump Wallace. Well played sir!
    Let’s get voices like yours in the news more often!!!

    Reply
53. 

    Betsy

    July 26, 2011 at 8:28 am

    Just watched the interview, very well spoken Seamus! Well done. Although Wallace had a point about how supported we are, or rather how unsupported we are. We need more academics who aren’t clouded by some cop out reasoning to back us up and make our arguments official. We’re gonna have to play *their* game to get anywhere with these people. I remember doing an essay on this topic a while ago and the evidence out there is mostly always against us. I’m sure there *are* people out there with the goods to back us up the way we need but they need to be showcased. And we’re just the people to do it. We own the internet. Let’s own these idiots.

    Reply
54. 

    Ponton

    July 26, 2011 at 8:35 am

    So anyone care to summarise how the interview (or was it an interrogation?) went this morning for the people who couldnt watch it?

    Reply
55. 

    ThatGuy

    July 26, 2011 at 8:35 am

    Just watched it and it seemed like Jim Wallace was given far more leeway than Seamus which was a joke.

    Reply
    1. 

       mccawsome

       July 26, 2011 at 9:48 am

       …and ten times more airtime.
       Utter BS on sunrises part.

       Reply
    2. 

       Stevorooni

       July 26, 2011 at 9:53 am

       Of course.

       They do it to rile people up then they say “Send us emails!” and they get lots of angry people sending them emails and they can say “look how popular we are with all these emails and hits on our website! Payrise please.”

       Reply
56. 

    Milbo

    July 26, 2011 at 8:40 am

    Well done Seamus,

    Great to see you go on the offensive like that. Also, It must have been tough going on after that story about the doughnut-burger… Mmmmm doughnut-burger…

    Reply
57. 

    Hans Wannop

    July 26, 2011 at 9:32 am

    Apperently Sunrise is deleting posts and mine doesn’t seem to be acceptable to their anti gamer stance, so ill post it here instead.

    Allow me to quote a tweet from Brigadier Jim Wallace, CEO of the ACL “Just hope that as we remember Servicemen and women today we remember the Australia they fought for – wasn’t gay marriage and Islamic!”. The tragedy in Oslo was clearly the result of an insane man, but that his motives rest on beliefs shared by some members of the ACL is of far more relevance than whether or not he played violent video games, which most men aged 15-35 do.

    Also would like to note that I do identify as a Christian. But the ACL does not represent me or my beliefs whatsoever.

    Reply
58. 

    WiseHacker

    July 26, 2011 at 9:35 am

    I just saw the video – you would think that going on camera would make the ACL wisen up up but no.

    They must really have a short memory – saying Seamus’ comment is a cheap shot and yet here is the ACL using the incident in Oslo as a reason not to bring in an R18+ rating?

    Someone please tell me I’m crazy or somethings as his comments lacked so much logic they must have been a hallucination.

    Reply
59. 

    Stevorooni

    July 26, 2011 at 9:44 am

    I actually gave the TV a thumbs up after Seamus spoke.

    Then swore after Jim Wallace called it a cheap attack then proceeded to make a cheap attack on videogames.

    Reply
    1. 

       Paul

       July 26, 2011 at 10:08 am

       I saw it as well Steve. I would have liked to have marched down to the studio, knocked on the window and demanded that religious idiot open his eyes.
       Religion is also involved in this issue, he’s clearly avoiding it and is using cheap tactics himself. What a filthy idiot.

       Reply
60. 

    Broken Code.

    July 26, 2011 at 9:45 am

    I didn’t watch the interview. I’m sorry, but I can’t stomach the idea of biased one sided debates. And it’s very clear who’s side Sunrise is on.

    Reply
61. 

    ToastyFresh

    July 26, 2011 at 9:50 am

    Can I see the interview online? I had to leave home early.

    Reply
62. 

    ChaCha

    July 26, 2011 at 10:06 am

    Good to see the vast majority of commenters on the Sunrise site speaking well mannered sense.

    Kudos to you Seamus

    Reply
63. 

    Joel

    July 26, 2011 at 5:06 pm

    After watching that interview I have to say that Seamus Byrne may be the strongest person in the world.

    To be able to listen to those opinions (that frankly even believing in an infinite universe I did not conceive could exist) and not at the very least interrupt him, proves you are much better man than I.

    In terms of “No Russian”, I beginning to think that it was probably a mistake to have it in there. It has nothing to do with the content since i believe that if it had been in a book or movie awards would have flocked to it. I just know that for the next 20 years every unstable nutcase with an Xbox is going to be saying it’s not my fault, I just played “No Russian”.

    Reply