Talk Amongst Yourselves

This is where Kotaku readers go to talk about the stuff we're not already posting about. Think of it as the official unofficial Kotaku community forum.


    A marvellous thing has occurred.
    I have come to fight Manus and what do I find?
    Onebros! Two of them with summon signs up looking to fight as well.

    Haha, if only I was not terrible at the co-op....

      Hope it went all right!

        We failed about a dozen times, though one guy gave up after about 5.
        Also got invaded by a dark phantom, I assume also a Onebro cause of level restrictions. But he did not last long.


    We can finally play Ys end to end. \o/

    I need some help. I'm trying to set up an Ebay account, and I've entered my email address and it comes up as already in use. I have looked up the user id associated with my address and it is not mine. Is there anything I can do?

      You could ask for a password reset - it will probably send an email link.
      Then change password, delete impostor's account and start your own.

        It says: error
        You have not yet confirmed your registration with eBay. Please complete registration before requesting a new password.

          Hmm might have to contact customer support, they can probably help out.
          And/or set up a new email account and use that.

            I have created an account using my secondary email address.

    Murasame's new remodel art is a massive step up from the old one:

    Unfortunately I ran 3-2 with my newly minted Destroyer fleet and it sent me to the node where all the Wo-class Aircraft Carriers lie in wait for unsuspecting ships. Got annihilated. Thankfully it was first combat in the sortie because there would have been sinkings otherwise. :(

      Wow not kidding. That is a very nice visual upgrade.

      Bad luck with the carrier node. I'm surprised that such a higher level world can only be cleared with a full fleet of DDs. Sure it's challenging but you would need to grind so much.

        I ran them a couple of times this morning and it went the other direction, toward the boss node instead, and this time the enemies were a bit easier (destroyers & cruisers). Only took one hit first time, on Yukikaze, but it put her into enough damage that I didn't want to risk it. Repaired and re-ran, got a harder fight and still cleared it with an A-rank. Again, too damaged to go on. They're gaining XP each time at least. I'm thinking if I get them all to ~25 and with some modernization, and sparkle them first, they should be able to make it with some luck.

        Also got my Hiei to 25 but don't have enough ammo to spend on her remodel :(

          :( If you level Hiei up again, do you forfeit the opportunity to remodel or is it now that you've reached the minimum requirement you can do it whenever?

          I didn't get a chance to play last night so I have no news. Thankfully I'll have a nice juicy stockpile of resources to burn through tonight and hopefully get Chiyoda to level 15 for her light carrier remodel.

            You need to be at least the minimum level. I believe that the level transfers over as well. What's lost is any modernization you've done, as their stats reset to base for the remodel. It also de-equips all your gear and equips whatever the starting gear is for the remodel version which is why certain ships are worth leveling up even if you don't want to use them, eg Isuzu gets free air radars as she goes up (and she remodels at level 12) and Chiyoda / Chitose get midget subs at their level 12 remodel.

            I've actually got my light carrier Hiyou on the verge of a remodel as well. Oddly I find her to be more effective with planes a lot of the time than Akagi is.

    Tonight's your last chance to pick up a great box set at JB, or 20% off any other DVD or Blu-ray.

      Why do they need nine discs for 3 Star Wars films?

      Also why can't I just get the original versions of the proper films without all of Lucas' tampering and bullshit attached? :(

        That box includes six films, original and prequel trilogies and three discs for extra goodies I'm guessing. I agree about the tampering though, I'm not a fan of the added CGI in the original trilogy and I haven't seen it yet but I'm pretty certain I won't like the howling Darth Vader either.

          I'm confused, there's only three Star Wars films. Do you mean that the Ewoks movie and the Holiday Special got discs?

    RAGE get, Command and Conquer: Red Alert 3 get! \o/
    Also, I kinda bought Dungeons and Dragons.
    And the Monsters University artbook. :D
    And Shakugan no Shana Season 3 Parts 1 & 2 on Blu-ray/DVD.

    Last edited 05/12/13 9:35 pm

    Industry night was alright. Soooooo lucky I did 4D Snake - meant I actually had something interesting to show. There didn't seem to be too many people stopping at the programmer tables, only had maybe three of my postcards taken I think. Talked to one guy who recognised me from IFEST last year, I think he may have kind of offered me a job? Sort of? As a Unity programmer though. It's like some kind of sick joke :P Got his business card and he said to e-mail him. Then a guy from Halfbrick really really really liked Snake. Also really really really didn't understand it :P But he was there for ages offering suggestions of ways to change and fix it and things like that. Gave me his business card too, they'd be looking for programmers towards the end of the year and that I should e-mail him my resume to put in the pool. Success?

    Also I can't find my hard drive. I think I left it at school. I hope I left it at school. Fuck.

      Maybe Halfbrick stole your hard drive and Snake 4D will be their next game and you'll be a damn liar for claiming you made it. :P

      I want to see this snake. Figure out a way to upload it. :P


    That final line of South Park's console wars trilogy.


      I'm going to try my hardest to download it, but I fear I may not get very far...

    Bloody hell Broken Sword 5 is fantastic so far. Really excellent game, feels just like the original 2 in so many ways and more modern in others that don't detract. So far, narry a pushing box puzzle to be had!

    Oh, tell a lie, there was one but you had to push a single box so you could climb on it, that strikes me as fair enough

      Yeah, I'm enjoying it too. The humour and charm is back too. Has made me laugh more than once showing random inventory items to people and seeing their varied reactions. The backdrops are stunning. Can't say I'm a fan of the 3D animation during cutscenes, especially when Daedalic games are still doing traditional animated characters but it's pretty seamless in the actual gameplay. So far, so good. :D

        Introducing everyone to Trevor is my favourite so far. That and the cologne kind of reminds me of showing everyone the clowns nose in BS1

        Last edited 06/12/13 10:00 am

          Or the tissue with grease makeup on it. XD

          George: "I'm so surprised this cookie has held up in my pocket"
          Nico: "Got to work on the small talk, George."


            Sounds like we're pretty much up to the same spot then

            Just finished part 1, damn I love this game! I'm tempted to have a marathon of the other 4 in the time it takes them to release 5 part 2

    Oh and also.

    Last day of school tomorrow. Forever. IE last chance to man up and get shot down by Sketchbook Girl. Well, save for graduation maybe. Or possibly if that one that keeps using me as a pillow invites the two of us to her party in a week or two (seems likely, though attendance of both...?).

    You just know that I'm totally going to not.

      Alright, I'm gonna make a deal with you that a friend once made with me. You ask her out, succeed or fail, I'll buy you a drink. You don't ask her out? You owe me a drink.

      Think about it man, at the very worst, you get something for what is basically nothing.

        So what kinda drink did you buy him? :P

          A beer. But that's not the point.

            Actually his bet with me was $50 to ask out the next 3 single girls I met.

            I managed to weasel out of it because I only met 2 new women in the time between him making the deal with me, and six months later when we spoke again. I was in mad hermit mode at that point.

        Real response:

        Go forth and conquer...
        Go forth and conquer...
        Go forth and conquer...

        *breathes from paper bag*

      I nearly didn't ask a girl out once...
      but then i did...
      we're now married (6 years)
      and then i found $10

      Last edited 06/12/13 7:05 am

      You can do it Gooky
      At the end of the day the worst that can happen if you do ask is she says no, you don't see her again and you move on with your life.
      The worst that can happen if you don't ask is that you will be considering her even after you aren't seeing her anymore and you miss out on something else because you are still hung up on her.
      Nike it up buddy

      Insert @transientmind motivational story here

        That's my thinking. I figure getting shot down is likely, but I can't really let anything happen with Climbey while I can't stop thinking about Sketchbook.

        Alrighty. @mrtaco:

        Hah. You shouldn't be afraid of getting shot down. You're offering someone something awesome and kickass, but if you've ever worked in any kind of sales position, you know that people turn down cool stuff - even free stuff - all the time. It can be disappointing, but it doesn't reflect badly on you and you shouldn't take it hard.

        You wouldn't BELIEVE the number of times I've been shot down. Some of them are OK for your ego, things like, "I have a boyfriend, but if I didn't..." but some of them have been outright weird. I've never had any laughing rejections (I've seen 'em though - utter dick move, ladies). One girl actually tilted her head, frowned and looked thoughtful before asking, "Why?" Knowing what I know now, I probably could've rallied and put out a decent come-back, but that one totally threw me off-balance. (Also, to anyone who ever gets, 'I have a boyfriend': smile and reply, "Let me know when you want a MAN friend," before you walk away.)

        Also, sometimes a seeming rejection of non-interest or responsiveness isn't exactly a rejection. Girls can get nervous and awkward and uncertain, too. I've seen it plenty of times when just tossing out random compliments (I guess some would call it flirting? Does it count if you aren't really interested and just think their glasses look good?) to girls in service positions, or at the bus stop. Sometimes it's obvious, like smiling, ducking the head and looking away, they'll reach up to touch their hair or face... Other times, they'll just freeze up and get very awkward or look uncomfortable, then when you walk away, taking their discomfort for rejection - I have it on good authority - they go home kicking themselves the whole way.

        Just like I'm pretty sure every guy in history is familiar with doing at some point.

        One girl I had a thing with for a while was incredibly shy and coy, and I THOUGHT I picked up a few hints of interest but just wasn't sure enough about it, so dropped several of my own, encouraging her to show some sort of more positive sign. She totally let the opportunity pass by, and I walked away thinking obviously she just wasn't that interested... Until I remember I'm a fucking MAN and walked right back and took the assertive lead, with results right then and there. She admitted afterward she was glad I had, because she hadn't been game to make a move. It's not necessarily fair or 'right', but women ARE still being conditioned by society to not make the first move.

        So yeah. It's probably in the bag already, even if she may not exactly react amazingly, just remember she's possibly just as awkward as well. Girls are human like that.

        Besides, you're not asking her to marry you and have your kids... just to go out and have a little fun. No pressure. No drama. No worries.

      Go for it mate, she's more scared of you than you are of her. Or am I thinking of snakes?

      Anyway, ask her out and I'll buy you a PS4 and/or XBOne*

      *This isn't actually true

      Last edited 06/12/13 10:10 am

      So what did you end up doing?

        Nothing :P

        For now.

          Heh at least you probably have a second chance, no wussing out of that one

            I hope not. Really.

            The wussing out, that is. Dear god I hope there's a chance :P

              Well the only thing worse than a 'No' is a 'What if I had'

              Okay, maybe genocide is worse but only a little.

              What if's would be at least as bad as the combination of always online DRM & flaky 56k dialup

                I *do* like to go out of my way to avoid most forms of DRM...

    Fuck Assassin's Creed IV completely. Just took a 90 degree turn straight into steaming piles of shit and now it's doing the absolute worst bits of AC3 again :(

      I think I know what you're talking about. There was like four back-to-back missions like that and then it got good again. Here's hoping it stays good. XD

        Sequence Seven, I think. I just did six and that kind of sucked, then got pulled out of the proper game so they could do their irrelevant meta-game 'modern world' bullshit, then back in and suddenly it's forced stealth with only one non-obvious path to do anything and instant fail if you don't do it exactly as the designers intended. Oh and by the way, often you will do it absolutely right but the AI will glitch out or otherwise fuck you over anyway so you don't even know if you're doing it wrong or not.

        Whoever designed the goddamn 'tail these people but don't be seen' mechanic in the Assassin's Creed games deserves to be keelhauled, right beside the fucker responsible for the eavesdropping crap.

    Yo, @shane, @bdkiaf, @rize.

    Are we doing a thing tomorrow? Is that a thing that's happening? Or am I just going to dance outside Rize's house until his wife yells at me to leave? Also, organisation is hard when it's hard to access dayTAY.

      Upvote equals answer.

      Also, I have no idea.

      I'm happy to have you guys around if you wanna come for a lunch thing or whatever. As long as I know by tonight that I'm supposed to be doing something it'll be easy for me to be organised :P

        I'm gonna say "fuck it, it's on"because at least that gives me an excuse to make gingerbread men.

          Righto. I'll make sure I clean the house then :P

    Woke up this morning to find my pc won't turn on. My monitor will but the tower won't. Tried checking the power cable and it's plugged in properly.
    Gonna try buying a new power cable

      Before investing in a cable, i guess the power cable to your monitor is the same type, just use that to confirm the tower will turn on, just so you don't waste your money

        The monitor power cable is different so I can't check

          PS3 uses a standard PC power cable as well, you might be able to try that.

            My PS3 uses a figure 8 rather than the standard PC cable

            Randomly started up without me noticing. No idea what is going on.

              Was it simply not switching on? Or was it switching on then immediately stopping again? The former is probably a PSU problem, but the latter is likely a short somewhere, possibly something not seated right or a loose cable crossing a circuit or similar.

    Apparently it's Work in the Nude Day today.

      I thought it was yesterday. No wonder I was getting so many funny looks yesterday. So embarrassing.

    That Spider-Man 2 the Second Part Deux: The Do Over Sequel trailer looks kind of awful. Like it's trying WAY too hard for gravitas and meaning.

      I'll be honest and say its got me interested and I hated the first Amazing Spider-Man.

      I'm pretty sure most of that interest comes from Dane DeHaan though.

      I only noticed it on my second watch but it's actually an incredibly colourful trailer. They really "pop" so to speak which is a nice change from GRIM AND DARK AND LOOK AT ALL THE SHADES OF BROWN AND DARK BLUE WE KNOW!

        I didn't mind (read: i could tolerate) the first Amazing Spider-man...
        I definitely prefer Andrew Garfield's Peter Parker over Tobey Maguire's...
        But again that's my personal taste which you will no doubt change again XD

          Can I? Because I will if you allow me too :P

            Lay it on me :P

              I guess I'll put it all in spoiler tags incase people haven't seen it and still care :P

              Peter Parker
              First up, I love Andrew Garfield, but the Peter Parker in the movie is so incredibly "meh". He starts the movie as a likeable, well-dressed, attractive, athletic, intelligent teenage nerd and ends the movie as a likeable, well-dressed, attractive, athletic, intelligent teenage nerd with super powers. Even before he has his super powers you see him standing up to people and being a "hero" so to speak. So there's very little development in the character. And he stutters worse than Shia LaDouche in Transformers.

              General Points
              Spider-Man can't keep his mask on. Generic villain who is conveniently connected to every person in Peters life. Pretty sure everyone in the school knows who Spider-Man is because he's god damn terrible at hiding his secret identity. If you play basketball and manage to smash a basketball ring, people are gonna notice. If you throw a football and it hits and bends a football post, all physics aside, people are going to notice.

              Pros about the movie
              Peter and Gwen have great chemistry. Kirsten Dunst wasn't in it. Emma Stone is amazingly attractive. Andrew Garfield is a great actor. They got the "movement" of Spider-Man when fighting. Kirsten Dunst wasn't in it.

                I agree to all of this, and i would never deny the movie is majorly flawed...
                I still prefer it over the original Spider-man though for reasons stated below... again personal taste and all that :P not trying to tell anyone it was a good movie, just that i enjoyed it.

            Do it. He's wrong about Tobey Maguire's Peter Parker.

              I wouldn't say it's possible to be wrong about personal tastes, but i'm interested to hear other peoples opinions

                With The Amazing Spider-man I just felt everything about it had been done before. Done better, too. I really felt I needed Spider-man 4, not a reboot.

                  While i agree a reboot was unnecessary, i do appreciate the more comic-booky reality of spider-man (slightly more quirky, web shooters instead of sperm-from-wrist super power etc.etc.) which is why i could tolerate the idea...
                  The original spider-man was good... for it's time... but i re-watched the other week and it definitely hasn't aged well...

                  i concur, that one was the best of the 3... but even then i have a gripe with Tobey's Peter Parker XD... can't place it, he just doesn't strike as being... right?
                  i dunno...
                  Doc Oc was pretty cool though

            You could try but you'd both be wrong. Neither of them can even compare to the greatest.

            Behold! Evidence:

              Hahaha that's great

              Skipped to some random dialog
              "If he is found innocent he will be released and will award the contract for the steel mill to a Canadian!"
              Oh the horror

              Last edited 06/12/13 9:23 am

              Oh wow, that's old. Good thing I wasn't around for that one. I grew up with the animated series. That, plus X-Men animated and Dragon Ball Z on Cheez TV - best childhood mornings ever.

                aahh the 90's Spider-man.... now there's something i've watched (and still watching) to death... so awesome!

        It could just be the tone of the trailer but the overly heavy super cereal thing it has got going has been one of the hallmarks of every incredibly bad superhero movie that has come out.

          Except green lantern. Pretty sure that wasn't a hallmark of that one

        Dane DeHaan is awesome! So good in Place Beyond the Pines and Chronicle.

    only a couple of days until a double whammy of VGX awards and Cambridge United on tv in the FA Cup. The latter involves staying up late on a Monday morning, but hey, all my deadlines at work seem to be today so I can be a zombie on Monday no problem

    Christmas party day \o/
    Although I'm sure these things were much more fun when you didn't have to pay for them. Should be good though, already pre-ordered my duck curry and planned the lucky dip


    had an abso-bloody-lutely wonderful time - and now i'm back at work :| lol

    How is everyone?!
    What's the goss?!?!

    On a side note, picked up Battlefield 3 complete the other day because it was $29 - now it needs almost 50gig of updates?!! WTF man....

    Edit: proper post to come, this is just a quick hello while i'm meant to be working. :D

    Last edited 06/12/13 9:22 am

      Hey Choops, congrats on the wife get!

      Gooky is going to requite his unrequited love today
      Both Zetrok and Transientmind need all the hugasaurus' they can get
      Steam sale has been and gone and we have a full 13 days before the next one starts
      something something videogames
      NegZero has become a pusher and got popdart into the same addiction he has
      People are organising meats I can't attend
      Secret Santa is either on the way or sitting on the couch thinking he will get around to it soon
      Loops has a sore back from being flat on it for the past week

      Last edited 06/12/13 9:38 am

        You make it sound like I didn't want to get into it. :P

    RecommendTAYtions please.

    Mrs Shane needs a laptop. It will be used for study purposes, so it basically needs to be able to access the internet and run Word. Ideally, it'll be responsive enough not to be irritating, and reliable enough to last a few years. New is preferable.

    Any favoured brands?
    Places to purchase from?
    Budget... hahahaha! What budget! (as cheap as possible please)


    Last edited 06/12/13 9:39 am

      MacBook. Pro or Air. Either. I've had real world experience with MacBooks outlasting their Windows brethren. That's not to say you can't get a dud, though. Secondly,

      Apple customer service is second to none. Take out an Apple Care plan and you will have peace of mind for the years to come. Standard warranty is only one year, sadly.

        Ah. The magic word. Cheap.

        Um, yeah probably not an Apple then. Like they say though, you get what you pay for.

        Let's say for the sake of argument (and accuracy) that I had a "budget" of about $200, maybe $250.

          Oh shit, haha. That's probably not even enough for Apple Care.


            Last edited 06/12/13 9:50 am

              does she need a large screen (14-15")? If not I'd suggest a half decent netbook for that price. Dunno if there's a umart near you but worth checking them out. Customer service is zero, but that's not why you go there

              Okay then. I guess it's time for 'steer-clear' suggestions then. Personal opinon, of course.

              Don't get HP or Acer. I've had more than two HP laptops where the battery is bin-able after one year. Bash me if you will, but Acer make some real cheap and nasty looking products. Probably cheap and nasty to use as well. (Sorry to all you Acer owners!) but I really think Acer play off the name similarities of ASUS. ASUS is the better product.

              I hate to burst your budget bubble, but even the cheap cheap laptops are probably going to set you back about AU$400.

              ..more to come.

          That's probably too low- entry level laptop is about double that.

          Myself and my friends had Acers, but we all had various problems with them. I've heard nice things about Asus. HP stuff is loaded with bloatware.

          MSY is usually pretty good on prices:

          It's going to be extremely difficult to find something at that price.

            Starting to realise that. I'm so used to buying second-hand electronics for myself that I forget the 'new' price is so much higher.

          Also, the other point I'd make is that if you want to get a bit more use out of it, mid-range at least is worth it.

      Don't go for anything without a half decent CPU. I made that mistake, got a 2.1ghz pentium b950. I thought it'd be good for basic coding & web browsing but pretty much every day I say "fuck I HATE YOU!!!!" at it when it constantly stalls.

        THat's probably more the HDD..

          Never had an issue with a HDD like that before

            EH, I have 2.0GHz dual-core Pentium, 4GB RAM laptop that I purchased 5 years ago for IT work including excessive coding and web dev etc. Never had a problem with it really. The slow HDD is noticeable though., since my main rig runs one.

      Asus is the most reliable, in my experience. We have four Asus laptops still running in this house, whereas any other brand (HP, Lenovo, Toshiba) we've tried hasn't lasted long.

      My last two laptops have cost between $300 and 400. Both from Harvey Norman actually, now that I think about it. Both have been advertised in a super-sale thingy. If it's for studying next year, I suspect the post-Christmas sales may be handy for you guys in this regard.

      Last edited 06/12/13 9:55 am

        Oh, I should also mention that both of those were only so cheap because they have no CD/DVD drive in them. So if you need one of those in your laptop it's going to cost even more than $400.

      Are you after the laptop for portability or because you don't have space for a desktop

        Portability is a must, as she will be studying at the kitchen table while the kids are out.

          AH! Forget my email then. :D

            Extremely generous, though, man! Thank you!

            I will see if we can find some out-of-the-way place that it might fit, and get back to you with a final answer, if you don't mind! :)

          I'm confused. If the kids are out, then why does she have to study at the table?

            Because she doesn't think we really have anywhere in the house to set up a desk :P

              Uh-oh...she's trying to muscle in on your mancave! Quick, change the lock! :P

                Hahaha, we've already had that conversation. Thankfully, the weather is starting to get hot, and there's no ventilation or cooling in that room. Thoroughly unsuitable for anything in the summer months.

                Wait... that's bad! :P

                Last edited 06/12/13 10:31 am

      Tbh the Surface RT first edition that's on sale at JB right now is probably the best. It comes with Word (no need to pay $50-100 for student version), it has a stand, supports USB/bluetooth mice/kb, and doubles as a recreational tablet.

      Give Lenovo a shot. I don't know if they ever get as low as $250, but I bought an awesome laptop almost 2 years ago for $650 that is still going strong.
      Maybe periodically check:
      They have one for $500 atm.

    Its Friday \o/

    Yes! yussssssss

    Another of the great men of our time has passed. Nelson Mandela has died at the age of 95.
    If only more people would follow the example of forgiveness and reconciliation rather than revenge

      As usual, The Onion says it best:,34755/

    Edit: TAY doesn't need my bitterness
    *shows self the exit*

    Last edited 06/12/13 10:10 am

      Tell them you're having a bad day and just want to be left alone.
      Or just start picking your teeth with the letter opener.

        ha, they don't listen, anyway sorry, I shouldn't have brought my crap here, sorry I edited and made ur response look weird. It's all Gutsoup's fault everyone don't worry.....

          For the bazillionth time, everyone: stop worrying about talking about your problems/annoyances here. Dealing with that kind of stuff is part of what made this place so special.

            scree response

              Gutsoup, I really like you. Don't be sorry, be comfortable! Own your TAYbie-ness and rampage around here like you own the place! :D

                thanks, I like you too :D
                *kicks down door and drags in recliner*
                now you'll never be rid of me :P

      What's the most polite way to tell a co worker to f$#@ off before I drive my letter opener into their skull?

      Yes: Dear sir or Madam, kindly f$#@ off before I drive my letter opener into your skull... please

        hahaha, this made me smile :D

          See?! We're good at responding to this kind of thing. That smile Pixel gave you probably just saved your freedom and your co-worker's skull. :P
          So stop stressing about what you post here. Please.

            I think the only thing that saved them is the fact i can listen to music, so i listened to some angry metal followed by some cheerful metal. :D
            Metal saves the day again
            edit: this is my cheesy I need a cheer up song
            right near the end there's this goofy voice saying things like yeaaah, for some reason it reminds me of Jimu :P

            Last edited 06/12/13 11:30 am

            I think a lot of us stress to varying degrees by how much we share and the impact it may (though probably won't) have on others. Hooray insecurity!

      "For your own safety and my sanity, please go away."? :P

      Get some pamphlets and ask them if they have found Jesus in their life

        And then warn them that they might not have as much time to find Jesus as they first thought... :P

    So last night I played BOARD GAMES at a shindig hosted at Grill'd Fortitude Valley and set up by a friend of mine (he of It was pretty fun although I didn't win anything.

    I got stomped in Kings of Tokyo where I was killed in the third round (Cyber Bunny why do you betray me :( ). I did decently in Small World: Underworlds although that game got pretty crazy fast. Then we finished the night with Lords of Waterdeep which was super fun although I kept getting blocked at every chance when I wanted to complete quests and what not. It's a shame we didn't get to play ZOMBIES!!! as I bought that recently and wanted to try it out. Hopefully next time.

    Hey guys, I need some help.
    You know how my nans house isn't selling? Well, I tried to tell my family that Mum and I can't afford the bill. This is the response I got:

    "Our idea is to sell the house not give it away!
    We need the gas on for the hot water and the electricity, when we clean the house. Also it is very cold in that house throughout the winter. Not that you would or Bradley for that matter would know any of this because you are never there to help! But I’m sure you will reap the reward of the money when it is finally handed down to you both.
    The bills are normal bills they are not discounted like you would be used to on a pension! Think yourself lucky we are not charging you for the maintenance and endless work we have put into keeping the house respectable while it has been on the market.
    Maybe you could ask [Scree's Brother] to help you pay your bills and the estate bills! He is working and could be living with [scree] and giving his board money to you instead of [scree's aunt]
    You were emailed about the real estate agents bill on the 12th of October, haven't you save anything towards it?

    My response (so far)
    Mum says that she can't afford to pay both houses when she only gets $300 a week on a pension. As for saving up, we have, but now we have a $200 gas bill that we have to pay. As for that pensioner discount? The GST completely negates it, so we only end up with a $10 discount at most on a normal bill. So we're paying the same as you, minus $10. Oh, and as for the house being cold, we're well aware, seeing as we also live in a concrete house and our gas heater leaks gas. So we can't really use it.
    If this keeps up, we're going to go to legal aid, because we are fed up.
    Also, Mum said [scree's brother] has nothing to do with the will. Not to mention that you don't really inform her of anything.
    Btw, what happened to the $300 we paid out last time for the real estate agent?
    Just so you know, our bills are always going to come first and we are not going to starve ourselves to pay Nan's bills.

    Does that sound okay to you? As for the maintenance, my mother uses a walker and I don't drive. If we were to get there we would have to catch 2 buses and 2 trains before walking a half hour. Not really suitable for a person who can't walk too much.

    Any and all help is appareciated

      Wow. There's a bit of vitriol in that email (the one you received) O_o

      My response would be to cut them off completely, no communication, no contact. But admittedly, that's not for everyone, and probably not right for this situation. I'll give it some thought.

      It might be worth mentioning that the house has been on the market for a long time and the ongoing costs (and inconveniences) for everyone are starting to overshadow the potential benefits of hanging out for a buyer with the right kind of cash.

      Is there anyone living in the house at the moment? I genuinely don't understand why the place needs the water and gas connected (electricity, sure, but the others...?) Edit: on reflection... how often does it need to be cleaned? And what cleaning uses electricity other than a vacuum?

      Last edited 06/12/13 10:27 am

        No one is living in there at the moment and we really just can't afford it any more.

        Sorry, they need the electricity to turn the lights on using a timer and to have the radio going 24/7

        Last edited 06/12/13 10:36 am

          Weird. Might be worth floating the idea that you believe the electricity, water, and gas are all unnecessary at this stage, and that this will be the last bill you pay. Then take your sweet time paying it.

            We brought it up last Christmas and multiple times before that. I have also warned them about squatters living in the house. They just ignore us.

              what a horrible situation, I'm sorry I have nothing useful to offer and I'm glad to see other taybies seem to be more useful. You mentioned your mum with get about 1/4 when sold. Are the other 3/4 paying their share of the bills?

                Yeah, but they can afford it. Mum is a pensioner and we wouldn't even be able to afford our own bills if I wasn't paying for half the rates. I also pay for the credit card and phone. Oh and I give her rent money so she uses that for food and bills too.

              Then you can feel free to slot this into your letter.

              "We have previously advocated for the electricity, water and gas to be disconnected as, because no one is living there, they are unnecessary expenses. In my opinion, the size of this latest bill serves to validate that perspective. We are on a small fixed income, and cannot afford to be paying for unnecessary expenses like this. We wish to reiterate our strong opinion on this matter, and will not be contributing to further unnecessary bills like these."

              Last edited 06/12/13 10:59 am

                Thanks Shane. Thanks everyone. Mum and I both appreciate it.

                Exactly this. Electricity is fine, but disconnect the gas, that's just ... weird.

                Also, if they keep pushing for elec bills that you can't afford, draft up an agreement with them: they pay your share of the bills, you will pay them out when you receive the settlement.

          I don't see where a $200 gas bill fits in here. :\ May very well be squatters are you say.

            The $200 gas bill is our own.
            We were saving up for my Nans house, but we got a large gas bill so the money may have to go on that

              Oh! Welp, see here:

              That may be the best solution if they keep pushing.

      They sound unreasonable but because they're your family I guess you can't tell them to go fuck themselves?
      Are you guys counting on any money the house might make from being sold? If not, it might be easier to just wash your hands of the whole thing. You obviously can't afford all these bills they're sending and I think they're taking advantage of you being somewhat timid.

        We would be happy with any money. We're not greedy. If the house sells for $200,000, Mum gets a 1/4 of that.

      Best advice I can offer without knowing the people involved is to take as much time replying as you want to. By far the best thing you can do is avoid strong emotion (either way of the scale) either when writing or in the writing because it generally never helps.
      Other than that, all I can say is good luck, cause that's a pretty shit situation to be in.

        Does that sound okay so far then? My response I mean.

      Hi Scree
      I'm happy to help out with a response but you will need to be a little be clearer before what you say makes sense to us.
      Some questions
      I'm assuming this was an email between yourself and another family member?
      I might have missed all the details so if they were posted previously just link me to them
      What is the current status of the houses ownership?
      How long has the house been vacant? And how long on the market
      What is the bill period for the bill they are asking you to pay
      Who is doing what at the house and who is paying for what
      Can you give a breakdown of all costs associated
      Also if you are comfortable say what is the distribution of proceeds for selling the house (What is currently owed in the mortgage, how many people with share in profit, etc)
      What is your preferred outcome

      Shoot that through in an email tigerion at the google mails

      At a high level I would say you are making the letter too personal and conversational. Don't include things like Mum says....... Just write the letter on behalf of both of you.
      Our personal financial situation doesn't allow us to spend cover costs on multiple properties.
      We appreciate the work you are doing and that you want full market rate for the property however we are unable to continue to pay for the maintenance while waiting for this to happen.
      We propose that (insert preferred option here)

        Well, the house is paid off. It has been vacant for roughly 2-3 years and it's been on the market that long.
        The bill period we don't actually know because they don't send us copies of the bill, just what we have to pay. So they send a list of bills all at once. We've never actually seen an original bill. And they don't really give us any time, they just kind of send it and expect us to pay.
        As for who is doing what, we're not really sure. When I was talking to my other aunt, she would mow the lawn like once or twice a month. As for the actual cleaning, I've no idea.
        The four of us are paying equal share of all the bills.
        Our share is:
        Melbourne Estate Agents 25/09/2013 $450.00
        Hume city council 30/11/2013 $69.25
        AGL GAS 19/11/2013 $3.07
        AGL Electricity 06/12/2013 $27.17
        Yarra Valley Water 17/12/2013 $39.43
        APIA House insurance 1/12/2013 $44.52

        This is our share of the bills. I've no idea what the others are paying.
        The distribution of proceeds is split equally between the four kids.

        We just don't want to have to pay for this stuff anymore.

          How often do you get a bill for Melbourne Estate Agents. That is an $1800 bill
          Electricity seem high if that is monthly, $100 for a vacant house.
          So even if those bills are quarterly it is costing you all close to 3 grand a year. If that's monthly you are getting closer to 10 grand. And that is before estate agent fees. Multiple that by 3 and you are talking significant amounts of money. If as you said the house could be worth $200, grand you have potentially already spent 10% of it's value trying to sell it.

          I would be saying that you need to draw a line and set an ultimatum. Either take the house off the market and get the agent to rent it out, it pays for itself and you can share whatever revenue comes in from that.
          Otherwise set a date to auction the house and take whatever price is offered. If they want to refuse the offer that is made then they can buy out your share for that price.

          Again this is purely advice from somebody who doesn't really know the situation so this is something you really need to sit down and discuss seriously with your Mum before you come to a decision.

            I am telling Mum all the suggestions that you're giving me. The estate agents is a one off, but even so, Mum and I have no idea what we're supposed to be paying for. We're not sure if it's for the previous agent or for the new one...I just have no idea.
            I think the bills are quarterly. I'm not sure as I said, they never show us the actual bills.

              I highly suggest you get everything in writing and copies of all bills. You're probably getting ripped off. Send that letter ASAP - if they refuse to deliver, refuse to pay. Legally they can't cut you out of any settlement anyway.

              Cut off the gas line, turn off the electricity but keep the account connected. Water? Put locks on the main tap.

              Real estate agent fees are odd. You can get agents that don't charge anything until the final settlement, then they take a percentage.

              Once you have a copy of all bills, split them equally. Since it should be pretty minimal by now (insurance mostly, rates), you may be able to afford it. If not, draft up the aforementioned agreement regarding your family paying everything and you repaying after settlement.

              2-3 years on market? It's obviously not working. Start posting on FB, Gumtree, etc. Or drop the price, take it off the market even. 2 years is not good at all. Have you received any offers?

              Last edited 06/12/13 11:30 am

                We got an offer for $230,000. We said take it, My uncle said the same, but my aunts disagreed.

                  I think with the offer you have much stronger stance with any legal avenue you pursue. If your aunts are convinced that the property is worth much more than that then they can buy you out.

                  What @tigerion said. Push for a buyout or a settlement, get this sorted. 3 years is a long time. They don't hold all the power, believe me.

      I haven't heard all of this story, so forgive my naivete, but is there a possibility you could rent it out for a while? At least then you may be able to get it cost neutral.

      Also, if it's empty and closed up, kill the power and gas. Fuck the rest of the family- if they want it connected they can pay for it.

        Renting will cost more as the rent would have to be split 4 ways. And if anything breaks we need to fix it.

        We don't have any power as my Mum's sisters are the executors of the will.

          I'm not sure renting will cost more. You won't be on the hook for bills anymore (except for water supply), and you'll be getting a small amount of money in each fortnight. It won't be a big turnaround, but it's a move in the right direction!

          You'll need to fix anything that breaks anyway, regardless of whether the place is being rented :P

          Hang on, is the house paid off?

          My suggestion (I am not a financial planner): Rent it out, and put the rent into a trust or something to pay for repairs etc. once you sell it, split the trust.

            It is. Thing is, we don't really have any power. My two aunts are the executors.

              Obviously I haven't seen the will but the power you do have is to stop paying.
              But seriously Scree I would recommend as a first step making a call to legal aid and just asking what your options are. It's a free call and they will have so much more experience in dealing with this sort of thing than any of us.

                I think we'll have to. It's looking like we don't have many other options

            This makes a lot of sense (I also am not a financial planner)

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