Euclideon's Given Up On Unlimited Detail For Games? Its New Website Suggests So

"I see comments from people saying the games industry will never use this," he begins. "Well, this industry isn't quite so old and stubborn. The games industry is actually quite open and we're in contact with quite a lot of players in that industry."

These are the words of Bruce Dell, the CEO of Brisbane-based Eulicdeon, in an interview with Kotaku Australia editor Mark Serrels last year. Dell, speaking about its polarising "Unlimited Detail" technology, was positive about its potential, but made it clear it was still in the process of getting it just right.

Shortly after Euclideon pushed out a video demoing the tech, Marcus Persson of Minecraft fame made his position clear, calling Unlimited Detail "a scam" and accusing Dell and his company of being "snake oil salesmen".

Since that flurry of news and controversy, we haven't heard much from Euclideon... nor any interested game developers. Perhaps it's because the company looks to have changed gears, its website now offering the product as part of something called "Geoverse", aimed entirely at the "geospatial industry".

Going by the new website, Euclideon's re-marketed its Unlimited Detail technology as a data visualisation solution, rather than a game engine. It's quite possible the company is still pursuing "players in that [the games] industry", but going by the provided brochure, those voxels appear better off as a medium for compressing and storing data efficiently than rendering elephants and palm trees.

Personally, I remember getting an email from Dell while I was editor of Atomic (back in 2006, if memory serves) and being wary of his claims, with the visuals shown to me almost identical to the ones provided last year. I forwarded the information to Ken Silverman, the genius behind the BUILD engine that powered games including Duke Nukem 3D and Shadow Warrior. While Silverman didn't go into specifics, his initial reaction was one of scepticism.

But let's not be negative. If Euclideon's found a use for the technology it's spent so long working on, that's good news... even if that use isn't in games.

Geoverse [Euclideon, via Reddit]


    Euclideon - the strangest Australian company of the last decade...

    The main issue was the idea of animating voxels not that it couldn't be done, I don't know why they didn't push for voxel worlds with poly based characters and assets. This would have made a lot more sense also given that poly rendering of the static environment (which is already mostly static in polys) would have freed up a hell of a lot of power to process significantly higher detailed characters.

    All that would be based on the theory that the tech existed in the first place.

      Because they are completely clueless when it comes to GAMES.. in the first videos Dell doesn't seem to understand anything that is going on in modern games.

    Not rendering*

    I've always thought this tech was more suited to 3D medical imaging than games. It would be perfect for exploring detailed 3D maps of bones, vessels, tumours, etc.

      "Nurse, get me an iron pickaxe, stat. I'm nearly at the skeleton and there's a stack of diamond here!"

      Wait, I thought voxel imaging was already used for display of medical scans?

    Their justification that it wasn't a scam was 'If this was a scam, how come we've convinced the Australian Government to give us a tonne of funding?' Great justification there guys.

    I think it's a scam. They had no idea what they were doing, they've just run off with the money.

      please enlighten everyone about how you are a software engineer, who is well versed in the inner working of game design.

    "company is still pursing"? Is that when you put things in your purse?
    "the CEO of Brisbane-based Eulicdeon", so is this a different company to Euclideon?

    I said I thought it was a scam at the time (for the reasons Notch outlined). Nothing has happened to convince me otherwise.

    Well, even if the tech goes nowhere, Bruce will always have the fall-back option of voicing characters with terrible Aussie accents in American games.

      Ah fuck yourself. Our accent is fucking way better than your shit

    I've followed the information I've found on Euclideon and it's Unlimited Detail tech, and I do very distinctly remember hearing Dell say that the engine would be oriented toward Scientific and other such industries before getting around to Video Games. This article doesn't say anything else to me other than they're directing their focus exactly as he said they would. I really don't get what the news is here.

    I was incredibly sceptical of this when I first heard of it. As my mum always told me:

    'If something seems too good to be true, it probably is'

    Such a shame that they managed to scam the government out of money. It's bad for the industry as it means that the government will be more wary of giving video game related grants in the future

    Dice uses Unlimited Detail. Expect a Battlefield with Unlimited Detail scenery.

      Any evidence to support this claim?

    I hope you guys realize how retarded you sound:
    "X can only be used for games, there is no other use for X despite that many other industries including but not limited to engineering, simulation, architecture, product conceptualization use them!"

    Unlimited Detail is not a game engine, its a visualization system ala D3D or OpenGL

      On April 23, it was public knowledge. On April 24, it became a secret. Proofs are available.

    Notch said it's a scam... must be true !
    John Carmack, on the other hand, see's merit in it, but what would he know.

    It's a logical choice for them to aim at the Geospatial industry - it would be perfect for LiDAR data.
    I worked for a company building simulations with geospatial data; clients were often keen to use LiDAR data, but it is just not possible in a polygonal engine. With polygonal terrain it's very easy to end up with so many tri's that your fancy top-of-the-line PC can't cope with out leaving a mess in it's underpants.
    Animation is rarely wanted for these simulations (and when it is, it's usual;u just simple transforms E.G., a wheel rotating. and not fancy, bendy, fleshy movement), which is something these voxel engines can't pull off very well yet from my understanding.

    Also, I 'd love to know how big a voxel world would be... the amount of bitching about RAGE being 20gb's was great.

      Agreed, I use Geoscience's 1 second digital elevation models of Australia in my work and my poor work PC (which I had to convince work to upgrade) still craps itself everytime it touches the overall mosaic data. Admittedly it's a bit over 10.5 billion rows of data but still...

      Also Australia's going nuts at the moment investing in mapping in a way I've never seen before, it's a good money earner for this guy if he can pull it off.

    there still going for games but there are things that need this tech more

    I would love for this to all be true, though they have not done a good job of proving it so far. :(

    so any leaked info or pics of quality yet about geoverse since they are supposedly providing demo viewings

    They’ve already said a couple of months that their first release would be targeted at the mining industry with game-specific software (possibly) coming out at a later date. Sucks to hear that but hey, if the former succeeds then there’s a bigger chance of the latter getting realized as well.

    Although ... with the way technology is progressing right now we might not even see much of a difference between polygon- and “atom”-based graphics engines in terms of visuals. The amount of polygons in video games supposedly increases by 25% every year. That means that in just one decade the initial number more than triples (357%). It’s not hard to see how Unlimited Detail could become obsolete at that point. Then again, I’ve been told that physics simulations actually become easier with point-cloud data when compared to polygon approaches so perhaps it does have a future after all.

    What people don't understand is that the dumbass Bruce Dell was talking about "games games games games"all the freaking time. He KNEW that this tech could not be implemented fully for games then and he knows it now. There's no way you can make a normal game title with this technology at this moment and it won't be possible for a looooooong time. The hardware is just not ready... even if you would stream the voxel data from a giant cloud you still have the problem of having to have a supercomputer to manipulate all the data for all of the users connected to the service. Again at this moment the technology is impractical but the retard Dell was trying to make it look that the things are ready while they're not. This is a fraudalent business practice and you kiddies all fell for it... visualizing static DATA is EASY!!

      Good point about Dell's focus on gamming but they do infact have animations on one of there videos. The example looks very poor but then so does the whole world it's in. I don't think we should give up so quickly on Euclideon. They seem to have something different than voxels. If its a new technology they've created, then they will be secretive by default. The whole story is probably not being told on purpose if there is one. I'm saying that there is a chance that they are not frauds.

    Dell said a while ago that they have all the money they need. It seems reasonable to me that UD is still progressing as planned. Nothing new has been shown because they have nothing to prove - the tech will speak for its self when it is ready. I don't recall Euclideon claiming it would run on current hardware. I'm optimistic. They're not asking anything of us except that we leave them alone to work. I can do that.

    They had a booth a few days ago in February at ILMF.

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